Sep 16, 2015, 12:29 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
Two routes will be moving to LGW South ahead of the formal move date.
from 11 January 2017: BA2273 will depart for JFK out of the South Terminal
from 12 January 2017: BA2272 will arrive into the South Terminal from JFK
from 19 January 2017: BA Naples flights will operate in/out of the South Terminal
Customers on these flights should check in at Zone A within the South Terminal
from 25 January 2017: all other BA flights will operate in/out of the South Terminal.
The BA First and Terraces lounges in the North Terminal closed on the evening of 04 January 2016. BA passengers can now use the No.1 Lounge and My Lounge in the North Terminal until the date BA moves its operations to the South Terminal (currently estimated to happen in November 2016), where there will be a new British Airways lounge. The new British Airways lounge in the South Terminal is anticipated to follow the latest concept found at EDI, GLA, IAD, CPT and SIN, and will include a dedicated area for First and oneworld Emerald passengers. It is not yet clear what form this area will take (ie. whether it will be a separate First lounge or include a Concorde Bar/Dining concept). For more information, see here and here
For information on the temporary lounge arrangements in LGW North, see this thread:
Temporary BA Lounge at LGW North - No. 1 Lounge - Photos, reviews, questions
By way of guidance, the above Lounge thread is for direct questions and experiences on the No. 1 lounge, whereas the thread here below is suitable for discussing the broader issues arising from the move to South.
from 11 January 2017: BA2273 will depart for JFK out of the South Terminal
from 12 January 2017: BA2272 will arrive into the South Terminal from JFK
from 19 January 2017: BA Naples flights will operate in/out of the South Terminal
Customers on these flights should check in at Zone A within the South Terminal
from 25 January 2017: all other BA flights will operate in/out of the South Terminal.
The BA First and Terraces lounges in the North Terminal closed on the evening of 04 January 2016. BA passengers can now use the No.1 Lounge and My Lounge in the North Terminal until the date BA moves its operations to the South Terminal (currently estimated to happen in November 2016), where there will be a new British Airways lounge. The new British Airways lounge in the South Terminal is anticipated to follow the latest concept found at EDI, GLA, IAD, CPT and SIN, and will include a dedicated area for First and oneworld Emerald passengers. It is not yet clear what form this area will take (ie. whether it will be a separate First lounge or include a Concorde Bar/Dining concept). For more information, see here and here
For information on the temporary lounge arrangements in LGW North, see this thread:
Temporary BA Lounge at LGW North - No. 1 Lounge - Photos, reviews, questions
By way of guidance, the above Lounge thread is for direct questions and experiences on the No. 1 lounge, whereas the thread here below is suitable for discussing the broader issues arising from the move to South.
BA to move to LGW South Terminal Nov 2016 [revised to 25 Jan 2017]
Jan 6, 2016, 11:56 am
#556
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
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There seems to be a lot of moaning on here from people who have never been in the No 1 Lounge.
Let's clarify a few things :-) The BA Gatwick lounges were a dump with a pathetic food offering. No 1 is one of the best third party lounges you will visit - because, shockingly, when you are creating something which people will be paying real money for, you make a good job of it.
Let's clarify a few things :-) The BA Gatwick lounges were a dump with a pathetic food offering. No 1 is one of the best third party lounges you will visit - because, shockingly, when you are creating something which people will be paying real money for, you make a good job of it.
I agree that No. 1 is a perfectly acceptable alternative, particularly if considered "in the round". I've given what I consider is a balanced to positive report upthread, and I'll be using the lounge on future visits. But the previous Flounge and Club lounges were not dumps, they were reasonably up to date, with good catering options. I prefer them to No. 1 and if given the choice I would go back there in a shot. I guess some people will prefer No. 1, it's essentially a leisure / holiday facility, with good facilities for families (e.g. sets of seats for 6 or 8 people travelling together, background uptempo music, the eccentric menu). But as a business traveller I'd go back upstairs without looking back, if that option was provided - far more comfortable and practical for someone who enjoys the BA product.
But it is a temporary arrangement and I look forward to seeing the new lounge.
Jan 6, 2016, 11:58 am
#557
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I did check with "someone in BA" about the champagne.
Basically BA weren't given much option about the move to South Terminal, the first they heard of it was in a press report! They were also not given much leeway on the North lounge, they don't actually own it, but Gatwick Airport Limited (GAL) were prevailed upon on a number of the details and timings in particular. GAL also leaned on No. 1 to provide lounge facilities to replace the BA Pavilion, for which a number of building projects have forced its closure.
Now I don't have a clear insight about this, other than that it was quite a tough negotiation and "no one should think that BA are saving any money" by this move. My speculation bit: BA are paying a flat fee to No. 1, which is greater than the implied cost per head of the previous arrangements. To get the deal to work, champagne wasn't included since the deal was "per head", and if BA wanted to pay for the champagne this would have been added as a unconstrained add-on per drink served. And you can appreciate with non BA guests also in the lounge, there are some logistical issues around this too.
Now I wasn't happy with the early closedown of Flounge, and did raise it with the top leadership, clearly I wasn't alone in doing so. But in this case BA management at LGW are more the victims of a terminal move which was always going to have a number of pain points.
And it is just temporary, in the last few days this has gone up in Frankie and Bennys South Terminal. This used to be the main entrance to the restaurant. I can't reproduce the note on the door since it's loaded with telephone numbers, but it says very clearly "BA CIP Lounge Project". The client, incidentally, was listed not as BA, but GAL, who have their own project manager heading this. There was plenty of construction noises emanating from behind the door.
I'll take a selfie stick next time!
Basically BA weren't given much option about the move to South Terminal, the first they heard of it was in a press report! They were also not given much leeway on the North lounge, they don't actually own it, but Gatwick Airport Limited (GAL) were prevailed upon on a number of the details and timings in particular. GAL also leaned on No. 1 to provide lounge facilities to replace the BA Pavilion, for which a number of building projects have forced its closure.
Now I don't have a clear insight about this, other than that it was quite a tough negotiation and "no one should think that BA are saving any money" by this move. My speculation bit: BA are paying a flat fee to No. 1, which is greater than the implied cost per head of the previous arrangements. To get the deal to work, champagne wasn't included since the deal was "per head", and if BA wanted to pay for the champagne this would have been added as a unconstrained add-on per drink served. And you can appreciate with non BA guests also in the lounge, there are some logistical issues around this too.
Now I wasn't happy with the early closedown of Flounge, and did raise it with the top leadership, clearly I wasn't alone in doing so. But in this case BA management at LGW are more the victims of a terminal move which was always going to have a number of pain points.
And it is just temporary, in the last few days this has gone up in Frankie and Bennys South Terminal. This used to be the main entrance to the restaurant. I can't reproduce the note on the door since it's loaded with telephone numbers, but it says very clearly "BA CIP Lounge Project". The client, incidentally, was listed not as BA, but GAL, who have their own project manager heading this. There was plenty of construction noises emanating from behind the door.
I'll take a selfie stick next time!
BA read of the terminal move in the press ...
GAL drove a hard bargain ....
BA have contracts with GAL. That included the lease of a lounge complex, which GAL presumably terminated early. If that is so, GAL have to make good. Leaned on No.1! What to take the full per pax daily rate!
If BA have a contract that permits GAL to move them between terminals at their whim and with minimum compensation and no guarantee of business continuity, I would be absolutely amazed.
Other parts of what you say don't ring true. There is absolutely no need for unlimited free flow Champagne for the whole lounge. Other airlines issue their pax with chits for champagne in the very same lounge in which this would apparently cause confusion.
I'm sorry but someone (not you) is putting a spin on this which is simply BS.
If BA are not saving money on this, then they must be fools,
Jan 6, 2016, 12:10 pm
#558
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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A very helpful and informative Thread from C-W-S, as is to be expected from someone with very useful contacts within the 'system'. Thanks ^
I shall not be tearing up my BAEC cards, nor howling at the loss of free-pour booze, nor the lack of free champagne. I try to be realistic, and accept that whatever happens is largely unavoidable, and thus go with the flow. I will, of course, not be altering my flying patterns to avoid LGW, as I have little choice in the matter! However, my main use of the LGW Lounge facilities is on the way home after overnight l/h flights, where my "need" is for somewhere relatively quiet and comfortable for a few hours whilst waiting for the last sector home. Any risk of being denied access due to overcrowding in those circumstances is not a prospect I relish.
I await the news that another iteration of a famous black coffee mug has been installed, to give the No 1 a degree of credibility and (indeed) status
I shall not be tearing up my BAEC cards, nor howling at the loss of free-pour booze, nor the lack of free champagne. I try to be realistic, and accept that whatever happens is largely unavoidable, and thus go with the flow. I will, of course, not be altering my flying patterns to avoid LGW, as I have little choice in the matter! However, my main use of the LGW Lounge facilities is on the way home after overnight l/h flights, where my "need" is for somewhere relatively quiet and comfortable for a few hours whilst waiting for the last sector home. Any risk of being denied access due to overcrowding in those circumstances is not a prospect I relish.
I await the news that another iteration of a famous black coffee mug has been installed, to give the No 1 a degree of credibility and (indeed) status
Jan 6, 2016, 12:30 pm
#559
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,225
The lack of complimentary champagne wasn't unavoidable - I just can't believe that. It was a money saving business decision by BA. I don't normally get so irked by things like this but I really feel like BA sold me a product with the description of having complimentary champagne in the lounge, have now removed that and haven't offered any reduction in cost. In my book that's not fair.
Jan 6, 2016, 12:33 pm
#560
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,225
Postscript: I also don't think the previous lounges were a dump and would go back there without hesitation. I've used the No.1 lounge in the past and the food portions were microscopic and the included wine not very pleasant. I think this a relatively easy one for BA to solve; just give a chitty to status and premium cabin passengers as they enter.
Jan 6, 2016, 12:39 pm
#561
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Oxford
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The chit already exists. As a PP card holder, you can pre-book a glass of champagne to guarantee an entry time with No 1 and, on arrival, are handed a chit to give to the barman.
That BA have not opted to provide the same chit for their pax is cost saving, pure and simple.
I'm not asking for BA to pay for me to go on a bender but a single glass of champagne doesn't seem an unreasonable request considering the cost premium associated with business class tickets. It's especially galling since the website advertised that champagne was part of the lounge experience when I booked and it's been enhanced away after they took my money.
That BA have not opted to provide the same chit for their pax is cost saving, pure and simple.
I'm not asking for BA to pay for me to go on a bender but a single glass of champagne doesn't seem an unreasonable request considering the cost premium associated with business class tickets. It's especially galling since the website advertised that champagne was part of the lounge experience when I booked and it's been enhanced away after they took my money.
Jan 6, 2016, 1:00 pm
#562
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 331
Thanks very much for the pictures and the reports - I am actually quite impressed with these arrangements, I certainly wouldn't avoid LGW (not that one usually has the choice).
As far as the champagne goes, I think it's important to remember that the cost price to BA / No 1 to provide it may not be the same as what No 1 wanted to charge-back to BA for a 'chit', they may well have wanted to make a bit of profit on it. It's not as though BA had the strongest bargaining position here! At £8 a glass, and especially if takeup was encouraged by giving out coupons, I can well imagine BA declining, it would perhaps have made sense to offer it to those in F but they would probably feel obliged to offer it to Emeralds as well.
As far as the champagne goes, I think it's important to remember that the cost price to BA / No 1 to provide it may not be the same as what No 1 wanted to charge-back to BA for a 'chit', they may well have wanted to make a bit of profit on it. It's not as though BA had the strongest bargaining position here! At £8 a glass, and especially if takeup was encouraged by giving out coupons, I can well imagine BA declining, it would perhaps have made sense to offer it to those in F but they would probably feel obliged to offer it to Emeralds as well.
Jan 6, 2016, 1:20 pm
#563
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I think there is a clear pattern by BA to present themselves as victims whenever there is any adverse customer impact. Whilst there may be an element of truth to some of this it is stretching credulity that poor BA always emerges bloody and bruised from the hard fight of seeking to protect its customers interests. If so the commercial team need to be fired and replaced with more competent negotiators.
Is it not more likely that BA is attempting to spin every negative change to manage the message? Are BA ever likely to say to a customer however valuable or senior "you caught us bang to rights guv and we shall mend our mistaken focus on cost over customer ways"? Of course they aren't and it is naive to think that feedback from BA contacts is anything but an extension of BA PR spin.
No disrespect to CWS but he is clearly intelligent enough to realise this too.
Is it not more likely that BA is attempting to spin every negative change to manage the message? Are BA ever likely to say to a customer however valuable or senior "you caught us bang to rights guv and we shall mend our mistaken focus on cost over customer ways"? Of course they aren't and it is naive to think that feedback from BA contacts is anything but an extension of BA PR spin.
No disrespect to CWS but he is clearly intelligent enough to realise this too.
Jan 6, 2016, 1:48 pm
#564
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 331
I'm sure No 1 staff would be 'pressing' these chits on customers as well, we know too well what happens when 3rd party staff get generous with encouraging uptake of BA's gifts, e.g. Starbucks T5C, another well told champagne fiasco!
Jan 6, 2016, 1:51 pm
#565
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Temporary BA Lounge at LGW North - No. 1 Lounge - Photos, reviews, questions
The tragedy of the Champagne discussion is we are not talking about some tiny airport with one BA flight a day and a third party lounge. LGW is BA's second most important airport worldwide and a home hub!
The hub without the hubbub!
To not even offer a glass of non-vintage Champagne to your F pax is utterly ridiculous.
The hub without the hubbub!
To not even offer a glass of non-vintage Champagne to your F pax is utterly ridiculous.
Jan 6, 2016, 1:55 pm
#566
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrancisA
Other airlines issue their pax with chits for champagne in the very same lounge in which this would apparently cause confusion.
I think the respect in which BA's position at Gatwick differs is that it has a very large number of low-fare flights (they are competing with EasyJet in many cases), and also different than Heathrow in that fewer passengers are connecting except domestically, and a large proportion of that customer base has OneWorld Sapphire status or above (indeed that is probably the reason many LGW customers would have chosen BA). Even if we assume BA are getting a discount on the champagne as compared with the 'menu price', I find it hard to believe they would get it at 'cost', and that is a large overhead eating into an already minimal profit.
I'm sure No 1 staff would be 'pressing' these chits on customers as well, we know too well what happens when 3rd party staff get generous with encouraging uptake of BA's gifts, e.g. Starbucks T5C, another well told champagne fiasco!
Originally Posted by FrancisA
Other airlines issue their pax with chits for champagne in the very same lounge in which this would apparently cause confusion.
I think the respect in which BA's position at Gatwick differs is that it has a very large number of low-fare flights (they are competing with EasyJet in many cases), and also different than Heathrow in that fewer passengers are connecting except domestically, and a large proportion of that customer base has OneWorld Sapphire status or above (indeed that is probably the reason many LGW customers would have chosen BA). Even if we assume BA are getting a discount on the champagne as compared with the 'menu price', I find it hard to believe they would get it at 'cost', and that is a large overhead eating into an already minimal profit.
I'm sure No 1 staff would be 'pressing' these chits on customers as well, we know too well what happens when 3rd party staff get generous with encouraging uptake of BA's gifts, e.g. Starbucks T5C, another well told champagne fiasco!
With respect, an equally large number of LHR pax will be on corporate discounts and HBO Y fares but enjoying vintage Champagne.
Either you have a product that you sell it you dont; chopping and changing doesn't work!
Jan 6, 2016, 3:08 pm
#567
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Jan 6, 2016, 3:17 pm
#568
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On a serious note, could one pre-pay and book the No 1 lounge (which I quite like) for a period where demand is likely to be very high, i.e.: holiday periods, then send the invoice back to BA. This would guarantee a seat "Whether you want to work or relax you can choose how to spend your time in comfort and style..."
Jan 6, 2016, 3:26 pm
#569
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I've skipped many of the posts. Have we a consensus yet on how many avios are expected as compensation for the lack of champagne 
Thanks to c-w-s for the excellent photos and report. I have used the lounge previously with Priority Pass when flying easyjet and not been disappointed so subject to capacity constraints with the higher number of users, I 'm not too fussed.
Thanks to c-w-s for the excellent photos and report. I have used the lounge previously with Priority Pass when flying easyjet and not been disappointed so subject to capacity constraints with the higher number of users, I 'm not too fussed.
Jan 6, 2016, 3:55 pm
#570
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,771
I accept that the First lounges page on BA.com does mention champagne. You appear to be OWS so wouldn't usually expect that benefit based on status; have you perhaps made several F bookings from LGW for which you were expecting F access? If not, then I can't quite see why you're so royally p*ssed off about it.
Of far greater concern to most of us on this board is the potential overcrowding issue.
Much like a warm champagne, I think you need to chill dude.
