AMEX doing "mass" shutdowns.
Nov 5, 2019, 1:34 pm
#61
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 309
Share price isn’t the same thing as financial condition.
For the rolling twelve months period, Amex’s share price has gone up about 13%. That’s not really better than the Nasdaq Composite index did over the same period. AXP performed worse with its share price than an ETF for that index.
And on the topic of Amex’s financial situation, I would say that customers maximizing the benefits usage of card referral, of sign-up-and-use bonuses, and of using the card portfolio to the max for purchase offers/credits/points-earning are probably amongst some of Amex’s most costly customers ..... with or without consideration for any given account holder’s accounts propensity of becoming part of Amex’s non-performing assets.
For the rolling twelve months period, Amex’s share price has gone up about 13%. That’s not really better than the Nasdaq Composite index did over the same period. AXP performed worse with its share price than an ETF for that index.
And on the topic of Amex’s financial situation, I would say that customers maximizing the benefits usage of card referral, of sign-up-and-use bonuses, and of using the card portfolio to the max for purchase offers/credits/points-earning are probably amongst some of Amex’s most costly customers ..... with or without consideration for any given account holder’s accounts propensity of becoming part of Amex’s non-performing assets.
Also, concerning the shutdowns, I would rather see the self-referrers and the gamers excluded if the end product offered to everyone else is better.
Nov 5, 2019, 1:44 pm
#62
Join Date: Nov 2013
Programs: AA Lifetime Platinum; Amex Plat; Four Seasons; Fairmont; HH; etc.; "Retirees-In-Training"
Posts: 658
See this thread for the 1099s on referral bonuses only that came out this year (for tax year 2018).
AMEX sending out 1099s for referral bonuses
AMEX sending out 1099s for referral bonuses
I guess we've been too busy actually *using* those points and traveling/planning the travel/etc., that I hadn't noticed this.
And I suspect there are other new issues with various charge cards that I'll need to catch up on...
Anyway, I couldn't quite figure out where it all stood. Is it indeed for "referrals" only? We've not done any of that (unfortunately, apparently).
Or is it also for either spending accrual points or sign up bonus points?
And what's the status of that question of "the points belong to Amex until 'used'"?
Imagine someone paying tax for them when issued, and then for whatever reason having Amex grab them back some time later...
Thanks again.
GC
Nov 5, 2019, 1:45 pm
#63
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At the moment there are about 14 posts on the Reddit thread with shutdown details
https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/co...utdown_thread/
10 have made inputs to the data form:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1F...cBmSw/viewform
https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/co...utdown_thread/
10 have made inputs to the data form:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1F...cBmSw/viewform
Nov 5, 2019, 1:45 pm
#64
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sunny AZ
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Posts: 3,215
And Amex could see that as gaming ... circumventing a cap that Amex put in place.
Nov 5, 2019, 1:46 pm
#65
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
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Curious, what is a reasonable amount of Amex cards? I have 6, I spend a good amount on four or five of them, the others I use for their intended purpose (like paying for hotels or airfare for the specified brands). No MS, no self referrals, etc. Many people have multiple Amex cards with no issue
Nov 5, 2019, 1:50 pm
#66
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 309
Curious, what is a reasonable amount of Amex cards? I have 6, I spend a good amount on four or five of them, the others I use for their intended purpose (like paying for hotels or airfare for the specified brands). No MS, no self referrals, etc. Many people have multiple Amex cards with no issue
Nov 5, 2019, 2:11 pm
#67
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 194
Nov 5, 2019, 2:38 pm
#68
Join Date: May 2009
Location: South Park, CO
Programs: Tegridy Elite
Posts: 5,678
Thanks.
I guess we've been too busy actually *using* those points and traveling/planning the travel/etc., that I hadn't noticed this.
And I suspect there are other new issues with various charge cards that I'll need to catch up on...
Anyway, I couldn't quite figure out where it all stood. Is it indeed for "referrals" only? We've not done any of that (unfortunately, apparently).
Or is it also for either spending accrual points or sign up bonus points?
And what's the status of that question of "the points belong to Amex until 'used'"?
Imagine someone paying tax for them when issued, and then for whatever reason having Amex grab them back some time later...
Thanks again.
GC
I guess we've been too busy actually *using* those points and traveling/planning the travel/etc., that I hadn't noticed this.
And I suspect there are other new issues with various charge cards that I'll need to catch up on...
Anyway, I couldn't quite figure out where it all stood. Is it indeed for "referrals" only? We've not done any of that (unfortunately, apparently).
Or is it also for either spending accrual points or sign up bonus points?
And what's the status of that question of "the points belong to Amex until 'used'"?
Imagine someone paying tax for them when issued, and then for whatever reason having Amex grab them back some time later...
Thanks again.
GC
Nov 5, 2019, 2:45 pm
#69
Join Date: Jul 2011
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even if they don’t know why you have several of the same cars it still might trigger an algorithm as it is a red flag, unwanted behavior,...... who knows
Nov 5, 2019, 2:49 pm
#70
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sunny AZ
Programs: HH Diamond, Sixt Platinum, IHG Spire Ambassador, Marriott/SPG Gold .....
Posts: 3,215
you said 10+ are shut down (look like the exact number is 18). Were all Amex cards shut down or did some survive? Guess not but like to get as much real info as possible. Did you get a sign on bonus on any of the “duplicate” cards? I could self refer myself without lifetime language recently - didn’t do it but it was possible.
Nov 5, 2019, 2:55 pm
#71
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IMO multiple business cards should be OK if the person operates multiple businesses, but I've always thought that it's a bad idea to apply for a business card if you don't have a genuine business of some sort.
Nov 5, 2019, 4:52 pm
#72
Join Date: Aug 2007
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If you willingly exploit loopholes or do obviously gray area things like self referrals it’s not exactly shocking that shutdowns occur. Banks are cracking down more and more on gaming.
If you choose to take the risk that’s fine, but don’t be surprised if and when it bites you in the behind.
If you choose to take the risk that’s fine, but don’t be surprised if and when it bites you in the behind.
If AMEX were to instantly shut down the hundreds, if not thousands, of FTers who exploited that loophole for years I doubt we'd see some of these same self-righteous "that's what you get" responses. This forum would go into meltdown.
Nov 5, 2019, 4:56 pm
#73
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Location: Florida
Posts: 29,767
Logically you would think that they ought to be able to. Which gets to the whole inconsistency of the 1099s. I'm not an accountant or lawyer but it doesn't seem right to have to pay tax on something, e.g., MR points, that are explicitly not your property and bring you no actual value until you actually redeem them. I believe Citi only sends 1099s on bank-account-earned TYPs based on points redemptions, which makes sense at least.
Yes only for referrals, not for sign-up bonuses, other spending bonuses, or redemptions.
Yes only for referrals, not for sign-up bonuses, other spending bonuses, or redemptions.
Nov 5, 2019, 4:58 pm
#75
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sunny AZ
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Posts: 3,215
AMEX could also (easily) view purchasing gift cards for reimbursement with their airline incidentals credits on the Plat/Gold to be gaming.
If AMEX were to instantly shut down the hundreds, if not thousands, of FTers who exploited that loophole for years I doubt we'd see some of these same self-righteous "that's what you get" responses. This forum would go into meltdown.
If AMEX were to instantly shut down the hundreds, if not thousands, of FTers who exploited that loophole for years I doubt we'd see some of these same self-righteous "that's what you get" responses. This forum would go into meltdown.
too little information to say what is what ....