mcgahat

Just to be clear, Plat Pro's do clear upgrades. So, the part I take exception with is "never" and not even waitlisting the person. I am having a hard time seeing what the harm is in being waitlisted with the upgrade cert. Also, I would think that like the BXP3 mentioned earlier, you could redeposit for a fee. Depending on the fee, it may not be worth it.

FleyeSkyHigh

Biz Xtra and Complimentary upgrades do not pull from the same inventory. BE pull from either C (Economy->2 Class Biz/First) and A (Biz-> 3 Class First). Sticker upgrades generally clear in to R and X. FYI: R and X are not easily view-able outside AA as this data is not accessible by GDS, the travel agency information management source which is also what ExpertFlyer uses . Revenue management algorithms ***should*** normally make A and C available prior to R and X and in most cases that happens (I have only seen a few odd cases where it does not but they are few and far between).

The problem with BE upgrades (and sticker upgrades in general) not clearing has nothing to do with contention between the various inventories but rather that the airline has made a conscious decision to narrow the pricing gap between economy and premium cabins in an effort to increase incremental revenue by selling more (and in many cases all) of the premium cabins seats.

The result is that scraping this incremental revenue has been at the expense of the loyalty and rewards programs. The truth of the matter is that to some extent the airline is more dependent on the revenue from selling FF miles to it's partners (Citibank, Barclays, and others) and the good news is that they just got a rude awaking this past quarter in there earnings. They haven't been selling as many FF miles to their partners because people aren't signing up for and using their AA Credit Cards for miles. This is partially the result of the FF program devaluations (lack of availability, increased award costs, ect). So while they were scraping for pennies to sell premium cabin seats for less incremental revenue they way over shot and lost nickles, dimes, quarters and dollars on the real gravy train of selling miles.

The good news is that according to reports as well as dialog on their conference call they got the message loud and clear. I would expect inventories for award seats to start going up as well as, hopefully, upgrades increasing (for example, their is a strong correlation, but not a direct relationship, at least for business awards (U) and business upgrades (C) inventories).

There has been a bunch of chatter about BXP3 lately as well. The problem with BXP3 is that they fall under eVIP (SWU) on the list not to mention the list is ordered by status. So even an EXP using a BXP3 has to wait for all the EXPs using SWU to clear prior to getting an international upgrade.

txrus

Given my comments previously re: BXP1 inventory above, I wanted to give an update on how I spent my morning, trying to book 2 flights for myself & upgrade one of my staff, using these awards.

Decided to try a different tactic this morning & simply called the BE office directly, told the AAgent who answered where I needed to go, & the date(s) in question, & asked her to find me inventory that would allow the use of the BXP1's.

55 minutes later (seriously), I had the 2 tickets. These were not complex routings nor were they what I would consider to be high traffic times, though, in fairness, I was attempting to fly on days that ended in 'y'

One flight does go out @ 5:15 am (ugh), but otherwise, all departures are fairly civilized, though she did first offer me red eyes to which I said thanks, but no.

While I did, in the end, get to use the upgrades that I literally earned, the hard way, it shouldn't be this difficult & time consuming, on both ends.

I don't begrudge AA making money-after all, I am in business to make money, as well, but I also don't nickel & dime my clients because, in the end, I would much rather have their loyalty & their business long-term.

Apparently UA has had the same rude awakening on their credit card driven revenue that AA got this quarter-from what I've read, Scott Kirby has apparently decided that having the UA FA's hawk the credit card offers in-flight will fix that. Guess he doesn't read FT but it is nice to know that it's not only AA pax who are no longer willing to play the fool for the airlines.

As I recall, there were similar promises of Discount Dougie & his minions having previously learned their lessons over the on-board catering cut backs a few years ago & vows to do better. While that, which was once so eloquently described by Rowan Farrow as 'something that looks like the dog threw up' vanished, eventually, I'm not sure there was a huge improvement overall. So, their current vows of having rec'd the message about upgrade cutbacks 'loud & clear' must be taken w/a very large grain of salt until proven otherwise.

thehawk75

How often are these BXP1's clearing these days with the whole change to the booking class from A to C ?

I'm going from LAX(or BUR or ONT) to EWR (and NOT JFK nor LGA) in a few weeks and, I know there's no direct route from Los Angeles to EWR on AA, I'm ok with a stop that results in a short hop and a long segment or vice versa (i.e. a stop in PHL, CLT or PHX).

Obviously trying to use the BXP1 on the long segment.

I've found a few ideal itineraries, and even priced them out in G vs the current best fare code, and obviously G is more expensive, but, I'm ok with that as long as this clears.

Naturally calling meeting services has pretty much resulted in being informed that NONE of my proposed routes have any 'C' space available for the long segment, in fact none of my proposed routes for the entire 2 weeks around my ideal date of travel.

So, I've been told I could book and 'waitlist'. But, I really don't like the idea of paying more for a ticket, just so I can play a game roulette. Of course if there's some inside information that these all have a good chance of clearing, then, I might be compelled to join this game.

I also have a second question, but very much related.

I put a 24 hour old on an itinerary that does 'allow' for a BXP1 upgrade. Meeting Services did inform me that 'yes, this itinerary does comply with the BXP1 rules, but, NO there is not yet any confirmed upgrade space available, however the front cabin shows a whole bunch of extra space available, would you like me to wait list you?'. I did say yes.

So the question here is, can these BXP1 upgrades 'clear' while I'm on a 24 hour (or rather next day before midnight) reservation hold, or do I literally have to 'Purchase' the ticket before there's even a chance of this clearing? Right now we're on hour 18 or so, and no indication of the upgrade clearing. In fact, no indication of even being on the wait list. But, perhaps aa.com does not show that you're on the BXP1 wait list, as all I'm looking at online is the 'sticker upgrade' request which of course indicates I have not requested.

At any rate, if anyone could share experience with the 'new' AA and BXP1's clearing when no inventory is made available weeks out would be appreciated.

FleyeSkyHigh

That's a great question. I know that IF the upgrade space (C inventory) is available the itinerary has to be ticketed PRIOR to the BXP1 upgrade being applied (even though applying a BXP1 upgrade does NOT result in a re-issue). I have had some meeting services agents mistakenly apply the BXP1 upgrade to a reservation that is on hold and by doing so it will prevent the reservation from ticketing all together (and the systems will refuse payment via website or live rep). I was unaware that meeting services would waitlist a reservation that is on hold (prior to ticketing) but good to know if that is the actual process.

Therefore, based on the extrapolating the above, I highly doubt that a waitlisted BXP1 upgrade will clear prior to ticketing and if it does it might require removing the upgrade (and losing the C inventory altogether or to another waitlisted pax) just to get the ticket to issue after payment. I would highly recommend that anyone that waitlists a BizExtra upgrade prior to ticketing verifies it’s still waitlisted after ticketing (my guess based on what I know about the systems it is should stick however but who knows for sure).

One other piece of advice: When you find an available BizExtra upgrade but have not ticketed the itinerary I recommend you put it on hold and then call meeting services. They have access not only to the front end systems that reservations reps use but also to the back-end systems so that can perform the two step process of forcing an immediate ticket issuance followed by application of the BizExtra upgrade. If you ticket the itinerary via website or reservations (even EP desk) then mtg svcs has to wait for it to queue for ticketing which can take hours and then you have to wait and risk the upgrade inventory going away not to mention waste the time to call back in after the ticket is issued.

Here is my experience over recent months with C (domestic) inventory opening up close to departure time (rated most frequently/likely to least frequently/likely):
T-25ish hours
T-5ish hours
T-100ish hours

The release of C (domestic) is based on route, historical, demand, overall premium load (and to a lesser extent economy load/anomalies) and certainly aircraft type. For example I never see C open up on a 2+ hour flight serviced by an A319 if less than 3 premium seats are for sale. On the other hand a on a B757 or B763 I occasionally see C open most likely at T-25 if it is not a trans-con.

In the event C doesn’t open up and you are waitlisted you should automatically be put on the airport waitlist (PALL) according to status but above all sticker/500 miles upgrades but below all eVIP/SWU upgrades. In addition, it should be noted that prior to the airport waitlist, normally revenue management is supposed to open up C space (to satisfy eVIPs, BizExtra Upgrades and Mileage upgrades) prior to opening up the other types of inventory that satisfy complimentary EP sticker/500 miles upgrades .

There are some weird processes now with regards to CK and Airpass members that violate a lot of what I have mentioned above but they are mostly manual processes and if you are not a member of either program they don’t really affect you.

jcatman

An amazingly complete and information-filled answer. From experience, I would add one more piece of advice, which seems rather insignificant given what you shared.

Every time I have placed a reservation on hold and then called meeting services to inquire and hopefully apply the BXP1 one-segment upgrade, the agent has been able to LOWER the price of the ticket prior to completing the transaction. ^

DLinYUL

The Business Extra website states pretty clearly that upgrades may only be confirmed after a ticket is issued. Just hover over the ? next to "type of upgrade."

So unless there's a strange glitch, you're reservation on 24 hour hold won't clear the upgrade waitlist should C class inventory become available.

aacar

Any idea on how long it takes for them to process/ship awards?

I'm going out of town for ~3 weeks Wednesday night, and was hoping to redeem a BXP1 before C inventory disappears - am I likely to get the cert by Wednesday if I request it now with FedEx overnight shipping?

platbrownguy

I think they do it Tuesday & Thursday but can't recall with certainty. You might email [email protected] to see if you can get a definitive answer.

txpenny

March finally posted.

thehawk75

Thanks for all that information.

I did end up ticketing the flight, sans confirmed upgrade, and did have them put me back on the wait list again (or rather confirm that I was still on it).

Unfortunately in all this time they have not opened up any C inventory. Here we are at T-36 hours, and it's J4, C0. I hope you're right about the C space opening up before the complimentary/500 mile stuff. I guess going by what you say, I should check again at about T-25. Not sure if it will make a difference if I call again at that time. Meeting services would be closed, and, I am not sure if I can rely upon a regular agent doing anything to help (in fact I might be hurting my chances if they 'touch' my reservation).

It's kind of sad that these things have become so difficult to use now. I literally could have burned 25K AS miles and had the front of the plane confirmed on VX -- and a direct flight to boot. Probably should give up chasing status on AA (but, then again with just 100K BIS miles to get to 2MM it's kind of hard to give that up).

dkc192

An unsolicited anecdote for those of you who were wondering about un-applying a BXP-1: I called Meeting Services and the agent was able to do it in <3 minutes. Of course, YMMV with agent competency in doing this (I was initially skeptical and thought it would be a long, drawn out process, given how applying a BXP-1 can lead to quirky, messed up reservations), and doing so would probably require that your original coach fare bucket still be available. In any case, this time was painless, and I'm now able to apply the BXP-1 to a much longer flight.

C17PSGR

A little family discussion ensued after the latest Business Extra enrollment bonus.

If I establish a BE account, it appears I need a TaxID number. Is that just my SSN (absent getting a corporate tax ID number from the IRS)? Then my "employees" of the family business just use the BE number on trips.

Is there any downside to this?

MrJBoy

I mailed back two certificates and then called BE to reinstate points when I received email from BE.
They charged fee and still I don't see the points back to our account.
How long does it take to see the points reinstated in our account???

869

Was scrolling through this thread while on phone with BE to see about getting a bxp1 in my hands by thursday. They process Monday and Thursday and send out those days. Sounds like you must request in advance of the processing day to clear in that batch but note that the expedite request has been incorporated into the BE website's redemption page. Click the box and provide your FedEx/UPS Acct #.

Agent mentioned that BXP1's (the instrument I was discussing) will soon be electronic.