There doesn't need to be upgrade space available. AA upgrades down to the last seat 40 minutes before takeoff whether there is upgrade space available or not.

That screenshot doesn't mention 100 hours. On other places it says you can be upgraded as early as 100 hours before takeoff, which is true. "As early as" clearly means that it can happen then, or it can happen later. I don't see how else it could be interpreted. There is nothing misleading there.

I am not disagreeing. But without reading every AA webpage, and only looking at screenshot as presented, I see no other way to interpret "If space is available, AAdvantage® status members will automatically receive a complimentary upgrade" to mean anything other than "If I can select a seat in First, i.e. space is available, and I am an AAdvantage® status member, I will automatically receive a complimentary upgrade."

I know it is not the way it is, or in reality it is not the way it is designed. I think it is just sloppy verbiage on the webpage, and could be easily clarified with some footnotes.

And that is all true. Nowhere does it give a time frame of when you can do this though and that's what the discussion is about. I don't think that the suggestion is that you will be upgraded at any time you want.... like if you book an economy seat 11 months in advance when the flight is completely empty you can just pick a first class seat.

Again, AA does upgrade down to the last seat.

Let's also remember that the web page that has been cut and pasted here is missing some verbiage. Only the top portion was copied. However, there is considerably more detail on that same page. It simply requires reading what AA has published -- again, on the same page.

Then, if you really want details, there is another link at the bottom of this same page to the detailed T&Cs, which then clearly state, "Upgrade inventory is subject to seating limitations and capacity controls.".

AA does tend to have poor wording on aa.com. However, IMHO this isn't one such case if one simply reads what is readily available without cherry picking certain sections.

Delta and United also bury the 'subject to upgrade availability' in their T&C, though I was intrigued to learn a new facet - with DL, million milers have priority over others within same tier. Reading the various Facebook groups focused on elite status on the big 3, the most common question and complaint is "why didn't I get my upgrade when there were lots of seats open?". Answer: Like most of us, you didn't read the fine print.

It was not intended as cherry picking, rather it's showing the top section of the page, which is all that you will see on your phone, or your tablet, or even your PC, unless you scroll down further. And you will probably only arrive at this page by following links from the elite status benefit page, where there is no mention of limitations on upgrades.

The point I've been trying to make is a pretty simple one. For purposes of marketing the benefits of elite status, AA uses pretty expansive language to describe upgrade availability ("unlimited, auto-requested complimentary upgrades"). At the same time, the reality is more complicated -- you have dig further into the website, and perhaps even read FT to understand the nuances. (E.g. even the phrase "as early as 100 hours" does not hint at the fact that while you are waiting for your complimentary upgrade, AA will be simultaneously working as hard as possible to ensure that there are no seats "available" for upgrade).

I'm not arguing this is right or wrong, good or bad, or even unusual in relation to other companies' marketing practices. One always has to read the fine print. But I think it is easy to understand how a casual reader and relatively infrequent flyer who hasn't read the fine print could be misled about their chances of being upgraded. I'm surprised that this idea seems to be controversial -- if the upgrade process was so easy to understand, we probably wouldn't need multiple FT threads dedicated to it. :)

Good point I did a quick search and it looks like both PHX-HNL and DFW-HNL are on the Dreamliners. Probably definitely worth it to waitlist some miles+copay/SWUs just to get ahead given the lieflats at stake, as well as the relatively dismal J/Y ratio to begin with on that equipment.

It's reasonable for AA to assume one will do something as simple as scrolling down the page. I read all of this on my phone without any problem.

I know most don't read lengthy terms and conditions anymore, on any site. Most just click 'accept', but that doesn't mean we can then claim the merchant never told us. I see this as very similar.

It can be counter-argued that it is reasonable to assume that a person will simply read and comprehend a sentence as presented, and not have to scroll down for custom interpretations.

Right now, PHX-HNL has two daily flights. One is on the dreamliner and one is on a 321 neo.

The dreamliner generally sells out business class well in advance during peak times (ie, winter) so it's not a great candidate for SWU (ie, it's probably not going to clear)

And it says "if space is available", which is correct. I admit it could say "if upgrade space is available", but it doesn't take a law degree or any more than 60 seconds to find out what "if space is available" means.

I remember when I first got status as a 22 y/o consultant 25+ years ago and going to the counter to ask firmly where my upgrade was, as a lowly Gold on US. I was schooled quite quickly by the gate agent on how upgrades work. This thread reminds me of that experience -- one I obviously never forgot. ;)

😃
It also doesn’t take a law degree to realize that drinking red bull will NOT, in fact, give you wings…..
But someone with a law degree CAN do this:
https://www.businessinsider.com/red-...illion-2014-10

All the common sense in the world can't protect you from the written word.
😃

I have also noticed a change in the timeframes of upgrades, compared to last year. My guess it is due to increased buy-ups...

Regular fares for economy and business class are exorbitant, and I am surprised people are paying them.

As far as anyone can tell, DL has suffered no net adverse consequences for elite benefit erosion. They haven't walked any of them back (unlike the elite qualification changes, which might be what you're alluding to?).

the policy has always been the same though the past year their algorithm for upgrades has changed and its really rare that I get an upgrade within t-100. I was convinced its just my account but it seems to be the norm...... I wish they were more transparent about how the algorithmn works TBH and since im wishing I wish we could see how waitlist immediately after booking.