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-   -   ARCHIVE: 737 MAX (7M8) grounded until TBA. What to do if scheduled to fly on one? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1960706-archive-737-max-7m8-grounded-until-tba-what-do-if-scheduled-fly-one.html)

enviroian Apr 7, 2019 10:09 am


Originally Posted by JDiver (Post 30974413)
AA today announced a new date, June 5 2019, as the earliest date for the 737 MAX 8 to be back in the schedule. Emails should be out today.

I didn’t realize the FAA announced a recall end date?

MSPeconomist Apr 7, 2019 10:17 am


Originally Posted by enviroian (Post 30974695)
I didn’t realize the FAA announced a recall end date?

It didn't but there have been guesses regarding how long the fix and its approval will take. Most airlines changed their schedules based on some such guesses rather than taking all MAX aircraft out of the schedule permanently (to the end of schedule). Other carriers are apparently still doing rolling schedule changes, removing the MAX a few weeks ahead in each step.

enviroian Apr 7, 2019 11:11 am


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 30974708)
It didn't but there have been guesses regarding how long the fix and its approval will take. Most airlines changed their schedules based on some such guesses rather than taking all MAX aircraft out of the schedule permanently (to the end of schedule). Other carriers are apparently still doing rolling schedule changes, removing the MAX a few weeks ahead in each step.

Gotcha.

Something tells me whatever AA, UA, FAA, whoever says "okay, we fixed it, good to fly folks" will do zero to sway passenger opinion about boarding this plane moving forward.

transportbiz Apr 7, 2019 1:30 pm

The more this drags on, the more I'm not entirely convinced this aircrafts ONLY issue is MACS, Any discussion about flyers like myself who will not fly this aircraft at least for a few years? What will an airline do if you book avoiding MAX flights, but end up on on due to aircraft swap?

ijgordon Apr 7, 2019 2:48 pm

There’s no provision in AA’s domestic contract of carriage for fee-free changes to, or refunds of, itineraries where there is an a/c substitution. (There is for AA internationally though). Will AA still allow it as a customer service gesture? No idea really at this point. Maybe they’ll waive the change fee but not any fare difference.
Your safest bet is to only book on airlines that don’t operate the MAX....

transportbiz Apr 7, 2019 3:20 pm

Well, I would assume if enough people do exactly that AA, WX, UA will announce specific policies. I avoided the 787 "firebird" for a while too, and the MAX's issues I think are far greater. A plane that was rushed to market to be competitive with the Airbus Neo, this thing had disaster written all over it.

This is the email I wrote AA:

Going forward with the issues of the 737 MAX American Airlines needs to issue a specific policy concerning allowance of changes if one of these aircraft are substituted for another aircraft on a booked flight. I for one, and anyone I buy tickets for and our company policy will not allow employees to travel on the MAX for a minimum of 2-years once it begins service once again. American has a choice to make, either guarantee passengers will have the option to opt out of a flight with no penalties, or be accommodated on another flight in the event a 737 MAX is used in substituting for a flight booked specifically to avoid the 737 MAX. Failure to have such a public policy will require all bookings on airlines that do not fly the 737 MAX for this two year period of time.

A similar message will be sent to UA and WX

GunsOfNavarone Apr 7, 2019 3:30 pm


Originally Posted by transportbiz (Post 30975365)
The more this drags on, the more I'm not entirely convinced this aircrafts ONLY issue is MACS, Any discussion about flyers like myself who will not fly this aircraft at least for a few years? What will an airline do if you book avoiding MAX flights, but end up on on due to aircraft swap?

Seems possible with the false center of gravity based on the more powerful and heavy engines, using technology to "trick" systems might work for many applications, but maybe not so much for a airplane holding up to 190+- PAX, often being flown shorter routes with numerous take offs and landings every day, 365 days a year.

Wondering if Boeing should have started with a clean slate to make a short haul, narrow body 190+- PAX aircraft, rather than pushing a 1970s designed aircraft originally developed for 130 +- PAX to its limit and maybe beyond.

tbrein Apr 7, 2019 6:09 pm

It will be interesting to see if and when the MAX comes back into service, if they will all fly out of MIA again. I, for one, use the MIA hub often for Caribbean trips. if this is the case, I will begin to use CLT as much as I do not like it.
At least the MAX does not fly out of CLT.

enviroian Apr 7, 2019 6:25 pm


Originally Posted by tbrein (Post 30976183)
It will be interesting to see if and when the MAX comes back into service

I don't think it will ever come back.

VegasGambler Apr 7, 2019 6:38 pm


Originally Posted by enviroian (Post 30976224)
I don't think it will ever come back.

I hope you are right, but I seriously doubt it.

enviroian Apr 7, 2019 6:58 pm

Peoples perception, accurate or not will determine this planes’s fate. Two fatal accidents plus hearing Boeing raced to get this plane into service sits in hard memory with the flying public. Time will tell.

VegasGambler Apr 7, 2019 7:04 pm


Originally Posted by enviroian (Post 30976307)
Peoples perception, accurate or not will determine this planes’s fate. Two fatal accidents plus hearing Boeing raced to get this plane into service sits in hard memory with the flying public. Time will tell.

I think that with Boeing being this deep in, they will do whatever they need to do to get it approved. The regulators in this country put the health of the industry above all else so it will get through.

As for the public, most of them don't know or care what plane they are on. This news cycle will pass. It probably already has.

chicagoflyer1976 Apr 7, 2019 9:16 pm


Originally Posted by transportbiz (Post 30975711)
Well, I would assume if enough people do exactly that AA, WX, UA will announce specific policies. I avoided the 787 "firebird" for a while too, and the MAX's issues I think are far greater. A plane that was rushed to market to be competitive with the Airbus Neo, this thing had disaster written all over it.

This is the email I wrote AA:

Going forward with the issues of the 737 MAX American Airlines needs to issue a specific policy concerning allowance of changes if one of these aircraft are substituted for another aircraft on a booked flight. I for one, and anyone I buy tickets for and our company policy will not allow employees to travel on the MAX for a minimum of 2-years once it begins service once again. American has a choice to make, either guarantee passengers will have the option to opt out of a flight with no penalties, or be accommodated on another flight in the event a 737 MAX is used in substituting for a flight booked specifically to avoid the 737 MAX. Failure to have such a public policy will require all bookings on airlines that do not fly the 737 MAX for this two year period of time.

A similar message will be sent to UA and WX

that'll show 'em

transportbiz Apr 7, 2019 9:28 pm


Originally Posted by chicagoflyer1976 (Post 30976643)
that'll show 'em

Almost 4 hours before a snark, on flyertalk that's pretty long.

JDiver Apr 8, 2019 12:27 am


Originally Posted by transportbiz (Post 30975711)
Well, I would assume if enough people do exactly that AA, WX, UA will announce specific policies. I avoided the 787 "firebird" for a while too, and the MAX's issues I think are far greater. A plane that was rushed to market to be competitive with the Airbus Neo, this thing had disaster written all over it.

This is the email I wrote AA:

Going forward with the issues of the 737 MAX American Airlines needs to issue a specific policy concerning allowance of changes if one of these aircraft are substituted for another aircraft on a booked flight. I for one, and anyone I buy tickets for and our company policy will not allow employees to travel on the MAX for a minimum of 2-years once it begins service once again. American has a choice to make, either guarantee passengers will have the option to opt out of a flight with no penalties, or be accommodated on another flight in the event a 737 MAX is used in substituting for a flight booked specifically to avoid the 737 MAX. Failure to have such a public policy will require all bookings on airlines that do not fly the 737 MAX for this two year period of time.

A similar message will be sent to UA and WX

You use CityJet? No worries, they have no Boeing products at all. ;)

We’ve been through this before. The De Havilland DH-106 Comet, which underwent explosive decompression at altitude. The Lockheed L-188 Electra, which shed its wings midair. The Douglas DC-10, which had a poorly designed baggage door and which AA used an unapproved maintenance procedure on and of which several were lost. The McDonnell Douglas MD-80 jack screw issue. And on.

The difference is the FAA has lost respect from other nations’ aviation authorities, and more civil aviation agencies will take harder looks at the fix (reprogrammed MCAS, AoA disagree indicators, revised operating manual, etc.) Pilots will be better prepared and exceptionally aware of the MAX quirks.


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