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ARCHIVE: Chances of Upgrade Clearing and Availability (2019 master thread)

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Old Jan 6, 2019, 6:09 pm
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Last edit by: JDiver
Chances of Upgrade Request Clearing
NOTE: Be aware of recent (20 May 2017) upgrade priority changes.

"New Upgrade Priority as of 20 May 2017

(Upgrades were prioritized by elite status and then time of request until 20 May 2017)


Elite status
  1. Concierge Key
  2. Executive Platinum
  3. Platinum Pro
  4. Platinum
  5. Gold

Upgrade type
  1. Miles and copay award upgrades and systemwide upgrades (SWU)
  2. 500 mile upgrades on purchased tickets
  3. 500 mile upgrades on upgrade eligible awards)

Then, by
  1. Elite qualifying dollars in the past 12 months (rolling)
  2. Booking class
  3. Time of request

See Upgrade Priority Changes to Status, Rolling 365 Day EQD Spend May 20 2017

Link to Gary Leff, View From the Wing 16 May 2017




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ARCHIVE: Chances of Upgrade Clearing and Availability (2019 master thread)

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Old Mar 11, 2019, 2:33 am
  #301  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Denver, CO
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 72
Originally Posted by mcrw00


Congrats on ExPlat!

This should probably be moved to the SWU thread, but I will answer here.

1) Yes. The better agents will assume this and clarify it with you proactively, but you’ll want to make extra sure on the phone that only the long segment is waitlisted initially. Once that clears, you’ll need to call back to have the SWU extended to the shorter segments (either confirming those or waitlisting them depending on availability).

2) Yes. On the AA website, “available” means you can confirm an SWU at that moment, “not available” means you can waitlist, and “not offered” means you cannot use an SWU at all (e.g. basic economy or codeshares). If you put yourself on the waitlist for a segment it can clear any time between now and departure, and the SWU will only be pulled if/when it clears.

3) You upgrade to business for now. However, the terms of the upgrades say “next class of service,” and PE has been largely positioned as a separate class of service over the last two years, so there is much speculation that at some point in the future a SWU will no longer get you from Main Cabin to Business internationally. That remains speculation, though.
I can talk to #3 directly as I just went through a comedy of treatment from AA gate agents in PHL last Thursday evening. Flight from PHL to MUC. Plane was A330 with Economy, PE and Biz "cabins". EXP desk had told me that AA does NOT yet recognize PE as an upgradable cabin, so if I wanted to put in for miles/copay or SWU for upgrade from coach, it wouldn't be a problem (besides, who would use 25K miles +$350 to upgrade to PE from coach??). So I requested a miles/copay upgrade and was waitlisted for airport.

Flash forward to Thursday at the gate. I arrived from DEN, saw I was #1 on the upgrade list for business, Exp Flyer showed 4 open biz seats and 2 blocked. Check in agent back at Denver said it looked good that I would get the upgrade. Get to the gate at PHL 15 mins prior and looked at AA app to notice #4, 5 and 6 on list had cleared, but myself and two others below were skipped. Asked gate agent, Erica (who was massively rude from the second I stepped up), why the top three were skipped, and before I could even finish my sentence, she cut me off and said "because you were trying to jump cabins from economy and we don't do that. PE people go first, then if you want to be upgraded to PE, you ask for that". I challenged her saying AA doesn't have a program in place for that yet, according to the EXP desk when I requested the upgrade, and again before I could finish, she interrupted with "listen, I ain't talking to you about this so talk to my supervisor".

Sup was there and instead of repeating the incorrect "rule" on jumping PE for biz from coach, she just looked at me and said "no more upgrades, no more seats, thank you". So knowing these women had my boarding future in their hands, I simply walked away, called the EXP desk, and reconfirmed that these women were making a mistake, and asked if she could speak to the agent. Back to the desk, asked the agent if she would talk to someone from AA on the phone, and she declined (rudely).

At that point, I decided to bend over and take it from two gate agents that clearly were wrong in their interpretation of the upgrade policy on a PE, Business and Economy cabin flight, mainly to avoid having security called and not being allowed on the plane.

The problem here was that when the upgrades/seats are released to airport control, the agents are free to do whatever they want. The system clearly doesn't prevent them from making up their own rules as they can obviously do whatever, whenever and then rudely talk to customers (and of course blatantly lie to their faces) as if we have no idea how the whole thing works.
acoburn73 is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 5:20 am
  #302  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
Originally Posted by acoburn73
I can talk to #3 directly as I just went through a comedy of treatment from AA gate agents in PHL last Thursday evening. Flight from PHL to MUC. Plane was A330 with Economy, PE and Biz "cabins". EXP desk had told me that AA does NOT yet recognize PE as an upgradable cabin, so if I wanted to put in for miles/copay or SWU for upgrade from coach, it wouldn't be a problem (besides, who would use 25K miles +$350 to upgrade to PE from coach??). So I requested a miles/copay upgrade and was waitlisted for airport.

Flash forward to Thursday at the gate. I arrived from DEN, saw I was #1 on the upgrade list for business, Exp Flyer showed 4 open biz seats and 2 blocked. Check in agent back at Denver said it looked good that I would get the upgrade. Get to the gate at PHL 15 mins prior and looked at AA app to notice #4, 5 and 6 on list had cleared, but myself and two others below were skipped. Asked gate agent, Erica (who was massively rude from the second I stepped up), why the top three were skipped, and before I could even finish my sentence, she cut me off and said "because you were trying to jump cabins from economy and we don't do that. PE people go first, then if you want to be upgraded to PE, you ask for that". I challenged her saying AA doesn't have a program in place for that yet, according to the EXP desk when I requested the upgrade, and again before I could finish, she interrupted with "listen, I ain't talking to you about this so talk to my supervisor".

Sup was there and instead of repeating the incorrect "rule" on jumping PE for biz from coach, she just looked at me and said "no more upgrades, no more seats, thank you". So knowing these women had my boarding future in their hands, I simply walked away, called the EXP desk, and reconfirmed that these women were making a mistake, and asked if she could speak to the agent. Back to the desk, asked the agent if she would talk to someone from AA on the phone, and she declined (rudely).

At that point, I decided to bend over and take it from two gate agents that clearly were wrong in their interpretation of the upgrade policy on a PE, Business and Economy cabin flight, mainly to avoid having security called and not being allowed on the plane.

The problem here was that when the upgrades/seats are released to airport control, the agents are free to do whatever they want. The system clearly doesn't prevent them from making up their own rules as they can obviously do whatever, whenever and then rudely talk to customers (and of course blatantly lie to their faces) as if we have no idea how the whole thing works.
I have also had bad experiences with PHL gate agents and their special blend of both incompetence and rudeness. I don’t fly AA transatlantic much anymore, so thank goodness I don’t have to deal with PHL often.

In general, though, if I am on a waitlist or standby, I try to get to the gate early (before they start clearing upgrades/standbys) and explicitly check in with the gate agent. Once the agent has cleared people, I would imagine they would be very reluctant to undo any mistakes. It used to be that Admirals Club AAngels would be willing to call down to the gate and clear upgrades from the lounge, but as with many things at AA, the days of that happening are very few and far between, if not gone.
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Old Mar 11, 2019, 7:01 am
  #303  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Denver, CO
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 72
Originally Posted by flyingeph12


I have also had bad experiences with PHL gate agents and their special blend of both incompetence and rudeness. I don’t fly AA transatlantic much anymore, so thank goodness I don’t have to deal with PHL often.

In general, though, if I am on a waitlist or standby, I try to get to the gate early (before they start clearing upgrades/standbys) and explicitly check in with the gate agent. Once the agent has cleared people, I would imagine they would be very reluctant to undo any mistakes. It used to be that Admirals Club AAngels would be willing to call down to the gate and clear upgrades from the lounge, but as with many things at AA, the days of that happening are very few and far between, if not gone.
Filed a customer complaint literally on the plane while waiting for rest of flight to board on this issue, and here's what I got. Can't complain really for 10,000 free award miles, but I would have preferred something like "we will go ahead and upgrade you on the return flight without miles or SWU deduction".

March 11, 2019

Hello Mr. ..................:

Thank you for contacting us. We know that upgrade benefits are very important to our most frequent travelers, and we are very sorry that it appears that the upgrade list was not followed on your recent flight.

As a gesture of goodwill, we have added 10,000 bonus miles to your AAdvantage® account. This adjustment will be reflected in your account very soon.

Thank you very much for bringing this to our attention. We appreciate your business very much as an Executive Platinum member and hope to have the opportunity to welcome you aboard again soon, Mr. ..........

Sincerely,

<redacted>
Customer Relations
American Airlines
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Last edited by JY1024; Mar 11, 2019 at 8:55 am Reason: Removing name of non-exec employee
acoburn73 is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 8:34 am
  #304  
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 65
Originally Posted by acoburn73
I can talk to #3 directly as I just went through a comedy of treatment from AA gate agents in PHL last Thursday evening. Flight from PHL to MUC. Plane was A330 with Economy, PE and Biz "cabins". EXP desk had told me that AA does NOT yet recognize PE as an upgradable cabin, so if I wanted to put in for miles/copay or SWU for upgrade from coach, it wouldn't be a problem (besides, who would use 25K miles +$350 to upgrade to PE from coach??). So I requested a miles/copay upgrade and was waitlisted for airport.

Flash forward to Thursday at the gate. I arrived from DEN, saw I was #1 on the upgrade list for business, Exp Flyer showed 4 open biz seats and 2 blocked. Check in agent back at Denver said it looked good that I would get the upgrade. Get to the gate at PHL 15 mins prior and looked at AA app to notice #4 , 5 and 6 on list had cleared, but myself and two others below were skipped. Asked gate agent, Erica (who was massively rude from the second I stepped up), why the top three were skipped, and before I could even finish my sentence, she cut me off and said "because you were trying to jump cabins from economy and we don't do that. PE people go first, then if you want to be upgraded to PE, you ask for that". I challenged her saying AA doesn't have a program in place for that yet, according to the EXP desk when I requested the upgrade, and again before I could finish, she interrupted with "listen, I ain't talking to you about this so talk to my supervisor".

Sup was there and instead of repeating the incorrect "rule" on jumping PE for biz from coach, she just looked at me and said "no more upgrades, no more seats, thank you". So knowing these women had my boarding future in their hands, I simply walked away, called the EXP desk, and reconfirmed that these women were making a mistake, and asked if she could speak to the agent. Back to the desk, asked the agent if she would talk to someone from AA on the phone, and she declined (rudely).

At that point, I decided to bend over and take it from two gate agents that clearly were wrong in their interpretation of the upgrade policy on a PE, Business and Economy cabin flight, mainly to avoid having security called and not being allowed on the plane.

The problem here was that when the upgrades/seats are released to airport control, the agents are free to do whatever they want. The system clearly doesn't prevent them from making up their own rules as they can obviously do whatever, whenever and then rudely talk to customers (and of course blatantly lie to their faces) as if we have no idea how the whole thing works.
Total garbage. One would think, if their interpretation of AA's rules are correct and that PE should be prioritized in all cases above Y upgrades, the system would have done so and placed #4 -6 above #1 -3...

Just complete lack of reasoning and logic, topped off with rudeness.
axck is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 8:55 am
  #305  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CLT
Programs: AA EXP; Avis PC; Hertz PC; Marriott LT Gold; Hilton Diamond
Posts: 1,133
For a transcon next month, which is J7 I0 D0, does it make sense to request miles+copay upgrade now and, if it doesn't clear before T-100, cancel the request and roll the dice with e500s? I'm EXP and don't mind paying to be confirmed early, but would hate to pay for something I would otherwise get for free (I understand the priority and that I may lose out by choosing the free option as it has lower priority than paid within EXP - willing to chance that). Or is it better to not request and monitor EF for C and then call in and confirm with miles+copay? Thanks!
HofstraJet is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 8:59 am
  #306  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Denver, CO
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 72
Originally Posted by axck
Total garbage. One would think, if their interpretation of AA's rules are correct and that PE should be prioritized in all cases above Y upgrades, the system would have done so and placed #4 -6 above #1 -3...

Just complete lack of reasoning and logic, topped off with rudeness.
Agreed, but it's my understanding from EXP desk rep last week that these gate agents have the option of picking whomever they want from the list to give the upgrade to (or they cannot override unless previous pax that got the upgrade and called to the desk didn't show up to take upgrade, or didn't scan new mobile boarding pass when boarding was over). So these gals took it upon themselves to just give 4-6 the seats and jump 1-3 just because 1-3 were economy and they misunderstood the "3-cabin flight" they were managing.

Now if this were a 3-cabin with economy, biz and first, then the can't-jump-cabin policy would count. But then I'd not be trying to use my miles/copay for a jump from economy to first anyway because all I really want on these flights is a lie-flat bed, privacy and some decent food/bevs.
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Old Mar 11, 2019, 10:53 am
  #307  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 102
Looking for advice.

Planning flexible travel for wife and I during 1st 2 weeks of October to Europe. From our hub, we usually fly through DFW. We were thinking CDG or MAD. These are serviced primarily with 772, 788 or 789 aircraft. We would also consider LHR and then bounce somewhere else. That brings 77W into play.

I'm EP with about $18,000 spend and have SWUs available. I hate waiting until near takeoff to find out if upgrade clears, but I guess that is the game these days.

Any recommendations that would significantly increase chances of SWU clearing? Travel on certain day of the week, any of the routes or aircraft more likely to clear. Assume I would buy PE tickets as I am still confused about clearing SWU from economy.

Probably would simply plan another trip if you think odds low of SWU clearing on any of these routes.
jrb CO is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 11:01 am
  #308  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, LT Gold
Posts: 3,148
Originally Posted by jrb CO
Looking for advice.

Planning flexible travel for wife and I during 1st 2 weeks of October to Europe. From our hub, we usually fly through DFW. We were thinking CDG or MAD. These are serviced primarily with 772, 788 or 789 aircraft. We would also consider LHR and then bounce somewhere else. That brings 77W into play.

I'm EP with about $18,000 spend and have SWUs available. I hate waiting until near takeoff to find out if upgrade clears, but I guess that is the game these days.

Any recommendations that would significantly increase chances of SWU clearing? Travel on certain day of the week, any of the routes or aircraft more likely to clear. Assume I would buy PE tickets as I am still confused about clearing SWU from economy.

Probably would simply plan another trip if you think odds low of SWU clearing on any of these routes.
Flights to LHR on the 77W on a Tues/Weds would be the easiest to clear... and I would almost bet my wallet that you will clear those in early October.

No confusion about clearing from economy to biz with SWU... currently AA treats your economy ticket the same as a PE ticket in terms of upgradability and priority. Could it change before then? Possibly. But as of today, it doesn't matter if you're in Y or PE.
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econometrics is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 11:16 am
  #309  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Denver, CO
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 72
Originally Posted by econometrics
Flights to LHR on the 77W on a Tues/Weds would be the easiest to clear... and I would almost bet my wallet that you will clear those in early October.

No confusion about clearing from economy to biz with SWU... currently AA treats your economy ticket the same as a PE ticket in terms of upgradability and priority. Could it change before then? Possibly. But as of today, it doesn't matter if you're in Y or PE.
Unless you go through PHL, who's gate agents have their own idea that PE is its own cabin...(see my rant above from last week's experience).

And to answer the OP's question, subscribe to ExpertFlyer. I did that and researched how many of the fights I preferred prior to buying, so that when I bought I could immediately call AA and have them apply and confirm the SWUs. Did this in January for an April flight with my wife from DEN-ORD-FCO. Put in the ORD-FCO as a saved search for available C seats on Expert Flyer (before booking seats), got a notification, booked the flights online, and immediately called AA EXP desk. Done in 5 minutes - full first leg upgraded (first on DEN-ORD, business ORD-FCO).
acoburn73 is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 11:37 am
  #310  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 102
Originally Posted by acoburn73
Unless you go through PHL, who's gate agents have their own idea that PE is its own cabin...(see my rant above from last week's experience).

And to answer the OP's question, subscribe to ExpertFlyer. I did that and researched how many of the fights I preferred prior to buying, so that when I bought I could immediately call AA and have them apply and confirm the SWUs. Did this in January for an April flight with my wife from DEN-ORD-FCO. Put in the ORD-FCO as a saved search for available C seats on Expert Flyer (before booking seats), got a notification, booked the flights online, and immediately called AA EXP desk. Done in 5 minutes - full first leg upgraded (first on DEN-ORD, business ORD-FCO).
I do have an EF subscription. I guess my question then is it better to pick the route most likely to have C space, buy tickets and put yourself on the upgrade list. Or wait for an alert to buy tickets. In theory, I assumed C may never show if someone else was already on the list for an upgrade (that I may have been ahead of).

And no, no plans to connect through PHL.
jrb CO is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 11:52 am
  #311  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, LT Gold
Posts: 3,148
Originally Posted by jrb CO

I do have an EF subscription. I guess my question then is it better to pick the route most likely to have C space, buy tickets and put yourself on the upgrade list. Or wait for an alert to buy tickets. In theory, I assumed C may never show if someone else was already on the list for an upgrade (that I may have been ahead of).

And no, no plans to connect through PHL.
Buy the tickets if you like the price. Waiting on C space could be (read: will be) a futile endeavor.
econometrics is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 1:15 pm
  #312  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: LFT
Programs: AA Plat, lots of AA, AS, DL, UA miles, former top level CO Elite (sigh...)
Posts: 10,795
Curious what my upgrade chances might be DFW-LHR just over two weeks from now....

Currently AA Gold and purchased a PE ticket last November. Also requested miles & copay upgrade to business at that time and have been on the wait list ever since. Departing on AA 50 (77W) on Tuesday, March 26.

Thanks in advance.
jlemon is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 1:25 pm
  #313  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, LT Gold
Posts: 3,148
Originally Posted by jlemon
Curious what my upgrade chances might be DFW-LHR just over two weeks from now....

Currently AA Gold and purchased a PE ticket last November. Also requested miles & copay upgrade to business at that time and have been on the wait list ever since. Departing on AA 50 (77W) on Tuesday, March 26.

Thanks in advance.
The flight is still J7, but with only 16 open seats right now.

Unfortunately, I don't think your chances are that great as a Gold. It's possible, but not looking the best. I'm sure there are probably 10+ CK/EXPs on that flight with requests for upgrades in already.
econometrics is offline  
Old Mar 11, 2019, 1:29 pm
  #314  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
Originally Posted by jrb CO
Looking for advice.

Planning flexible travel for wife and I during 1st 2 weeks of October to Europe. From our hub, we usually fly through DFW. We were thinking CDG or MAD. These are serviced primarily with 772, 788 or 789 aircraft. We would also consider LHR and then bounce somewhere else. That brings 77W into play.

I'm EP with about $18,000 spend and have SWUs available. I hate waiting until near takeoff to find out if upgrade clears, but I guess that is the game these days.

Any recommendations that would significantly increase chances of SWU clearing? Travel on certain day of the week, any of the routes or aircraft more likely to clear. Assume I would buy PE tickets as I am still confused about clearing SWU from economy.

Probably would simply plan another trip if you think odds low of SWU clearing on any of these routes.
I agree with others above the 77W to LHR probably has the highest odds of clearing. That said, you're going in October, and if you travel midweek, I'd say generally your chances of clearing on the other routes is probably pretty good as well. By going through LHR, you're not only adding a stop but also a (likely) terminal transfer at LHR and a leg in BA Y. The upshot, though, is that a later arrival into CDG, MAD, or wherever means that your hotel room is more likely to be ready upon arrival.
flyingeph12 is offline  
Old Mar 13, 2019, 9:15 pm
  #315  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 50
Hi. Your input on my current situation (below) would be much appreciated.

Question: Does J0 generally mean SWU not likely?

Additional context: AA175 DFW-NRT to depart next week. Purchased (W fare/Premium Economy fare) and SWU requested over 4 months out--back in early Nov 2018. I am EXP w/ EQD around $14k, traveling alone.

This flight is a LOT more crowded than I thought it would be, and it looks like this on EP:
J0 R0 D0 I0 W0 P0 Y6 B0 H6 K6 M5 L5 G0 V4 S0 N2 Q0 O0 E0

I don't think I have ever failed to get SWUs on the DFW-NRT route since I became EXP several years ago...but, then, I don't think I've ever been on a flight that showed J=0 the week before. So, I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this. Thanks so much for any input you might be able to give!
nyc10036 is offline  


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