19 years of EXP , had surgery this year and AA will not grant me an extension
#61
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 10,904
https://www.elliott.org/company-contacts/american-airlines/
I'd suggest starting with the customer service execs and working your way up if necessary.
I suggest not making any empty threats. Don't threaten to walk if you aren't willing or able to.
I'd suggest starting with the customer service execs and working your way up if necessary.
I suggest not making any empty threats. Don't threaten to walk if you aren't willing or able to.
#62
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,605
Thanks for the suggestion , but not going to do that .... I just thought my loyalty would have been rewarded ... as you can imagine there have been literally over a hundred flight delays where I never asked for compensation and a lot of times where I booked an AA flight even though it was more expensive ... Not gonna have to worry about that again .
Maybe AA will give you a chance to pay to renew and you can decide whether it is worth paying to renew or to stick with platinum status
Your long time activity has been rewarded with lifetime status
#63
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
Second, how is it irrelevant that OP chose to pay extra to fly AA? That seems highly relevant—and something AA would want OP to keep doing in the future, I would think.
Finally, let's not kid ourselves. Yes, AA can play it strictly by the book, but I have lost track of the number of times AA agents, at least in the past, have made exceptions because of status or loyalty (issuing hotel/meal vouchers, opening up award space when there was none, putting me on different carriers even with weather delays, etc.).
#64
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,605
First, we have no idea if OP "spent less." OP in fact has met the spend requirement for EXP.
Second, how is it irrelevant that OP chose to pay extra to fly AA? That seems highly relevant—and something AA would want OP to keep doing in the future, I would think.
Finally, let's not kid ourselves. Yes, AA can play it strictly by the book, but I have lost track of the number of times AA agents, at least in the past, have made exceptions because of status or loyalty (issuing hotel/meal vouchers, opening up award space when there was none, putting me on different carriers even with weather delays, etc.).
Second, how is it irrelevant that OP chose to pay extra to fly AA? That seems highly relevant—and something AA would want OP to keep doing in the future, I would think.
Finally, let's not kid ourselves. Yes, AA can play it strictly by the book, but I have lost track of the number of times AA agents, at least in the past, have made exceptions because of status or loyalty (issuing hotel/meal vouchers, opening up award space when there was none, putting me on different carriers even with weather delays, etc.).
AA offers methods to retain status such as ability to pay to keep status where the person has failed to meet the requirements
He asked, the expectation should have been that the answer would be no --- it might have said yes, but with the current processes for renewing status, but hey
#65
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Bangkok, Thailand. No longer Palm Coast, FL though still exiled, again, from the Bay Area.
Programs: Only the good ones
Posts: 5,153
Unfortunate, but
No cigar. 19 years and only 3MM? And shoulder surgery in March and not making up the lost time/trips in the remaining 8 to 9 months? I had a serious motorcycle accident in China in Jan 2016 and couldn't properly WALK for weeks, though still flew a week after the accident: PVG-LHR-MXP in J on BA (and the wonderful BA CS people neglected to get me a wheel chair when I arrived from PVG at T5 and I had to limp thru T5 to get to the shuttle,) and then, with stopovers, MXP-PHL-YYZ-ORD-LAX-DFW-LAX-SFO-LAX-PVG (apx 34k EQM's mostly in FC or J) using a cane, all before I could get a proper shoe on my right foot (wearing a slipper in the middle of winter in China, Italy, Toronto) that had been run over in the accident. Shoulder surgery is tough and does require some icing via the ice machine, but I made EXP in 2016 in spite of a major medical issue. And let's not talk about people that get laid off/business travel reductions/financial problems etc. It's not really a loyalty program; it's a rebate deal that has some aspects of status. I had top status on TW before AA took them over and all I got was AA lifetime credit for the apx 1MM miles I earned on TW's program. The station manager at ZRH explained it very clearly to me before my first AA TATL: you need to pay for what you want. That attitude is now more firmly entrenched in AA's corporate thinking as we see from all the changes made to the "former loyalty" program. I've been earning status on AA since that first TATL, for almost 30 years, with a few short breaks, down to my LT PLT, and don't understand the sense of entitlement required to even suggest that EXP be given for free. Get your expectations in check.
Oh yeah, forgot to welcome you to FT. Enjoy.
Oh yeah, forgot to welcome you to FT. Enjoy.
Last edited by rbAA; Dec 20, 2018 at 1:34 am
#66
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
Air carrier, not just AA, marketing people must look at social media threads such as this and smile. They are doing their job well. An incidental benefit becomes larger than life and consumes someone and then others act as though it really is a big deal.
OP has not "lost" or been "disqualified" from anything. I presume from the rough numbers that he will start the year as a Plat. That is better than the vast majority of fliers. If he is flying as much as in the past, he will earn his way to PP and then EXP and at that point he will be back where he started.
The same people who rant that EXP is meaningless because they can't get UG's and so on are the first people to say that despite tougher rules, any one fact pattern ought to be an exception. As pointed out by those who manage and make compensation decisions, this is a zero sum game. It is only fair if there is a line which is clear. If it is at shoulder surgery, then so be it.
OP has not "lost" or been "disqualified" from anything. I presume from the rough numbers that he will start the year as a Plat. That is better than the vast majority of fliers. If he is flying as much as in the past, he will earn his way to PP and then EXP and at that point he will be back where he started.
The same people who rant that EXP is meaningless because they can't get UG's and so on are the first people to say that despite tougher rules, any one fact pattern ought to be an exception. As pointed out by those who manage and make compensation decisions, this is a zero sum game. It is only fair if there is a line which is clear. If it is at shoulder surgery, then so be it.
#67
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum / Marriott Gold / Hilton Gold / IHG Platinum ... A former AA Platinum
Posts: 106
AA's concern is probably that if they establish another category of qualifying for EXP as being having a medical issue in the prior year, it would open the floodgates. People have no problem getting doctor's letters for emotional comfort animals; I imagine the number of elite maladies would increase exponentially.
I'm nowhere near the level of elite of the OP, and I look at this as a negative _for me_ if AA can't recognize fidelity at that level.
OP, definitely don't stop there: Write the chairperson or something, and post the letter to Twitter ... Good luck!
#68
Maybe it's a generational thing. Younger people understand you have to fulfill requirements to get benefits. The entitled older generations have this "I did thing X for Y number of years, so I continue to deserve it even though I didn't do thing X." I find it silly.
#69
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
OK. Here is a tabletop exercise. You are charged with writing a policy to deal with hardship exceptions to the FFP rules.
1. Injury or illness interrupting travel for a significant part of the year. How much of the year?
2. Longevity of status? Is it just at CP or EXP or does it include "climbing the ladder" from Gold? How many years? Is it 5, 10, or 15?
3. If it just the passenger? What if she can't travel for a year because she is home watching the kids because her spouse is hospitalized and can't do it?
4. What if it is a job loss? Does it matter if the job is lost because the passenger is a drunk or the employer went bankrupt?
5. What if it is a weather issue, e.g., you live in Puerto Rico and a Cat. 5 hurricane wipes out the economy?
I am in no way minimizing OP's circumstances. He suffered a serious and debilitating injury. The question is where he fits into the matrix. Why does there need to be a matrix? Because it is only fair to other customers and because the people who make these decisions can't sit around large conference rooms debating individual cases.
Now, the tough questions for the CFO and the head of marketing.
1. What do the above choices cost?
2. How will the above choices affect others who are spending in the program?
1. Injury or illness interrupting travel for a significant part of the year. How much of the year?
2. Longevity of status? Is it just at CP or EXP or does it include "climbing the ladder" from Gold? How many years? Is it 5, 10, or 15?
3. If it just the passenger? What if she can't travel for a year because she is home watching the kids because her spouse is hospitalized and can't do it?
4. What if it is a job loss? Does it matter if the job is lost because the passenger is a drunk or the employer went bankrupt?
5. What if it is a weather issue, e.g., you live in Puerto Rico and a Cat. 5 hurricane wipes out the economy?
I am in no way minimizing OP's circumstances. He suffered a serious and debilitating injury. The question is where he fits into the matrix. Why does there need to be a matrix? Because it is only fair to other customers and because the people who make these decisions can't sit around large conference rooms debating individual cases.
Now, the tough questions for the CFO and the head of marketing.
1. What do the above choices cost?
2. How will the above choices affect others who are spending in the program?
#70
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
No cigar. 19 years and only 3MM? And shoulder surgery in March and not making up the lost time/trips in the remaining 8 to 9 months? I had a serious motorcycle accident in China in Jan 2016 and couldn't properly WALK for weeks, though still flew a week after the accident: PVG-LHR-MXP in J on BA (and the wonderful BA CS people neglected to get me a wheel chair when I arrived from PVG at T5 and I had to limp thru T5 to get to the shuttle,) and then, with stopovers, MXP-PHL-YYZ-ORD-LAX-DFW-LAX-SFO-LAX-PVG (apx 34k EQM's mostly in FC or J) using a cane, all before I could get a proper shoe on my right foot (wearing a slipper in the middle of winter in China, Italy, Toronto) that had been run over in the accident. Shoulder surgery is tough and does require some icing via the ice machine, but I made EXP in 2016 in spite of a major medical issue. And let's not talk about people that get laid off/business travel reductions/financial problems etc. It's not really a loyalty program; it's a rebate deal that has some aspects of status. I had top status on TW before AA took them over and all I got was AA lifetime credit for the apx 1MM miles I earned on TW's program. The station manager at ZRH explained it very clearly to me before my first AA TATL: you need to pay for what you want. That attitude is now more firmly entrenched in AA's corporate thinking as we see from all the changes made to the "former loyalty" program. I've been earning status on AA since that first TATL, for almost 30 years, with a few short breaks, down to my LT PLT, and don't understand the sense of entitlement required to even suggest that EXP be given for free. Get your expectations in check.
Oh yeah, forgot to welcome you to FT. Enjoy.
Oh yeah, forgot to welcome you to FT. Enjoy.
I commend you for your dedication to flying while injured, but I don’t think it’s unreasonable that when one has a major medical issue (or a child) they cut back on flying for a while. And when one has been loyal to an airline for 19 years, I think one would be entitled to at least think that the airline show some level of appreciation and/or loyalty in return, above and beyond the status granted each year (in fact, isn’t that the idea behind CK to some extent?). 3MM miles in 19 years is 150+k miles per year (and who knows how much in $$). I would hazard a guess and say it’s substantial, given the years OP was CK and the fact that OP has met the EQD requirement yet is only at 50% EQM requirement this year.
Like I’ve been saying, AA can do whatever it wants, and maybe OP will stick with AA to some extent regardless. But based on what I’ve seen from AA lately, I think (in my view at least) they’ve been taking a quite narrow, short-sighted view to things.
Also, generally, I think the attitude of the AA forum in particular can sometimes be off-putting, but that’s a different issue. Cheers.
Last edited by flyingeph12; Dec 20, 2018 at 8:24 am
#71
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2006
Programs: AAdvantage PP
Posts: 13,913
AA knows that in most cases while the customer may not be happy with the decision they will stick with AA. In the case of the OP they will remain PLT, which is far better than starting over as a nobody on some other airline. Particularly if they are an AA hub captive.
#72
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: PHL / NYC / PSA-BLQ
Programs: AA PPRO, Marriott/Hilton Gold, AMX-Plat, Global Entry
Posts: 3,110
On the other hand, I think it bodes well for me that a FF program recognizes those who are flying, and isn't tossing out status to people who people who haven't flown enough to earn it in a particular year.
Maybe it's a generational thing. Younger people understand you have to fulfill requirements to get benefits. The entitled older generations have this "I did thing X for Y number of years, so I continue to deserve it even though I didn't do thing X." I find it silly.
Maybe it's a generational thing. Younger people understand you have to fulfill requirements to get benefits. The entitled older generations have this "I did thing X for Y number of years, so I continue to deserve it even though I didn't do thing X." I find it silly.
#73
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: jfk area
Programs: AA platinum; 2MM AA, Delta Diamond, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 10,291
Haven't there been instances (noted here on FT) where flyers have been given EXP status without doing a "challenge"?
Also, since OP has met the EQD requirement AA could let him do any or all of: (1)buy-up to EXP, (2)do a "challenge", (3)some combination of (1) and (2)?
Also, since OP has met the EQD requirement AA could let him do any or all of: (1)buy-up to EXP, (2)do a "challenge", (3)some combination of (1) and (2)?
#74
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2006
Programs: AAdvantage PP
Posts: 13,913
IIRC there's been promotional campaigns in which non status flyers have been given EXP status with the need to meet some conditions in order to retain EXP status after the promotional period ends. Presumably these individuals were identified through some kind of filtering as likely or potential high fly individuals. However, I would think these kind of promotions going away.