Apr 9, 2016, 5:10 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
Boeing 787-8 (788) Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business Class Seats Selection Guide & Reviews
There were 20 787-8 Dreamliners at the end of 2018, now gradually expanding to 42 total 788s in the AA fleet.
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner with Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business class seating and service
For the 787-9, see Boeing 787-9 / 789: Business (Rockwell Collins (ne B/E) Super Diamond Seat, Service (master thd)
The 787-8 offers 20 modified Zodiac "Concept D" Business Suite all aisle access "podded" seats in 1-2-1 with back to back seating in the center pairs, and alternating front and rear facing window seats. They are said to be 21-26" wide, and have 60-61" pitch upright in pods with full aisle access and 77" in the horizontal "bed" position. True AVOD offering up to 250 movies, 160 TV shows, 13 radio channels, 375 albums and 20 games, is offered via cabled handset controllers to large flat touch screens. Power offered is 110 VAC via universal plugs and 5 VDC USB. Bose QuietComfort headsets with noise reduction are provided (picked up about one hour prior to arrival). Ku-Band satellite WiFi is offered for sale.
The Dreamliner "big sister" model (22 787-9, first in service September 2016, has Collins (ne B/E Aerospace) Super Diamond Solo seats that largely avoid the Zodiac problems, is the "big sister"). The second batch of 787-8s (787T) differ from the first batch and are fitted with Collins Super Diamond seats.
Zodiac "Concept D Business Suite" seats connected "at the head" are affected by movement from the seat they are connected to, often referred to on FT as "motion over the ocean". The Business seats that are unconnected and stable in 787-8 J are 1D&H, 5A&L.
Due to the modifications AA required of Zodiac for these seats, there are some peculiarities reported:
Link to photos taken by SFO777 here, from his trip on AA2320 DFW-ORD 07:10 - 09:36 Inaugural flight, shared with 68 FlyerTalkers.
There were 20 787-8 Dreamliners at the end of 2018, now gradually expanding to 42 total 788s in the AA fleet.
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner with Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business class seating and service
For the 787-9, see Boeing 787-9 / 789: Business (Rockwell Collins (ne B/E) Super Diamond Seat, Service (master thd)
The 787-8 offers 20 modified Zodiac "Concept D" Business Suite all aisle access "podded" seats in 1-2-1 with back to back seating in the center pairs, and alternating front and rear facing window seats. They are said to be 21-26" wide, and have 60-61" pitch upright in pods with full aisle access and 77" in the horizontal "bed" position. True AVOD offering up to 250 movies, 160 TV shows, 13 radio channels, 375 albums and 20 games, is offered via cabled handset controllers to large flat touch screens. Power offered is 110 VAC via universal plugs and 5 VDC USB. Bose QuietComfort headsets with noise reduction are provided (picked up about one hour prior to arrival). Ku-Band satellite WiFi is offered for sale.
The Dreamliner "big sister" model (22 787-9, first in service September 2016, has Collins (ne B/E Aerospace) Super Diamond Solo seats that largely avoid the Zodiac problems, is the "big sister"). The second batch of 787-8s (787T) differ from the first batch and are fitted with Collins Super Diamond seats.
Zodiac "Concept D Business Suite" seats connected "at the head" are affected by movement from the seat they are connected to, often referred to on FT as "motion over the ocean". The Business seats that are unconnected and stable in 787-8 J are 1D&H, 5A&L.
Remedial seat stability fix announced 9 Oct 2016 by John Walton, Runway Girl Network (link)
"Jay Mapston, Americans manager of onboard products, cabin design, spoke to Runway Girl Network with praiseworthy candor about the airlines current situation and plans. To start, Mapston explains the 787-8 fleets (Zodiac) Concept D (Business Suite) will see remedial stability work to fix the much-discussed issue where the seats shake when an adjoining passenger moves."
As of July 2019, no such fix has been put in place. The seat modification has to be designed, submitted to the FAA for certification (STC) and approved, the parts manufactured and seats modified. Normally, the seat manufacturer would do this, but as AA terminated the Zodiac contract for failure to perform. Its anyones guess when and if a fix is forthcoming.
AA canceled the contract with Zodiac for inability to comply with scheduled delivery times, causing seatless Dreamliners to sit out availability idled in the desert and causing considerable delay for the 777-200ER refurbishment. The seats were NOT used for the 787-9 nor more than half the 47 aircraft 772 fleet, and it is likely the newly ordered 788s will be equipped with Super Diamond Seats.
"Jay Mapston, Americans manager of onboard products, cabin design, spoke to Runway Girl Network with praiseworthy candor about the airlines current situation and plans. To start, Mapston explains the 787-8 fleets (Zodiac) Concept D (Business Suite) will see remedial stability work to fix the much-discussed issue where the seats shake when an adjoining passenger moves."
As of July 2019, no such fix has been put in place. The seat modification has to be designed, submitted to the FAA for certification (STC) and approved, the parts manufactured and seats modified. Normally, the seat manufacturer would do this, but as AA terminated the Zodiac contract for failure to perform. Its anyones guess when and if a fix is forthcoming.
AA canceled the contract with Zodiac for inability to comply with scheduled delivery times, causing seatless Dreamliners to sit out availability idled in the desert and causing considerable delay for the 777-200ER refurbishment. The seats were NOT used for the 787-9 nor more than half the 47 aircraft 772 fleet, and it is likely the newly ordered 788s will be equipped with Super Diamond Seats.
- Many seats are interlaced with others - passenger in one moves, the linked seat moves. "Motion over the ocean" is induced by the partner seat attached at the head,
- Forward facing seats may have more restricted shoulder room / width when flat than aft facing
- Middle seat privacy dividers were balky and continually slipped into the retracted position, so they were "fixed" in place so they are not passenger operable. Apparently crew fixes them in several configurations: all up, making them great for privacy but nearly impossible for couples wanting to share conversation; all down, making for lower privacy; facing forward up, facing aft down. Some aircraft have them repaired and passenger operable, some not.
- Rows 1 and 2 center seats have no overhead bins; they were displaced by the crew rest area in the fore fuselage crown.
- 1A and L are close to lav and galley.
- Many prefer seats 5A or L as they are unaffected by other seats / passenger movement in seats.
- 5A and 5L have one window, rather than two.
Link to photos taken by SFO777 here, from his trip on AA2320 DFW-ORD 07:10 - 09:36 Inaugural flight, shared with 68 FlyerTalkers.
Dreamliner 787-8 / 788 Zodiac Business Seats & Reviews (master thd)
Mar 18, 2016, 1:29 pm
#256
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: NY
Programs: AA: ExPlat & 3MM; UA: 1k; KL: Plat 4 Life; Hyatt: Plat; SPG, Marriott, Hilton: Gold
Posts: 2,709
Flying alone DFW-PVG and back. Sounds like rear facing window seats best but 2L has issue with seat in front of it.
Currently I have 2A on way there, but 1A, 4A, 4L and 5L also open. What's best seat?
On way back, I have 4L and 4A open. Any difference?
Currently I have 2A on way there, but 1A, 4A, 4L and 5L also open. What's best seat?
On way back, I have 4L and 4A open. Any difference?
Mar 19, 2016, 6:08 pm
#257
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Monte Sereno, California
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, AA EXP, 2 mm, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,398
For me I preferred 6L to 2L. (corner seats)
I did not even know the bathroom was behind me until I got up to use it. What I liked about the seat it felt more private in a corner of the cabin. Also, rear facing seats appeared to have more room and your head faces away from the aisle. When I slept I wore ear plugs, no issues.
When I was in 2L the persons in front of me or behind me were not an issue, It just felt less private.
IMO, I guess the private feeling of a corner seat makes easier to sleep.
I did not even know the bathroom was behind me until I got up to use it. What I liked about the seat it felt more private in a corner of the cabin. Also, rear facing seats appeared to have more room and your head faces away from the aisle. When I slept I wore ear plugs, no issues.
When I was in 2L the persons in front of me or behind me were not an issue, It just felt less private.
IMO, I guess the private feeling of a corner seat makes easier to sleep.
Mar 19, 2016, 6:42 pm
#258
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Sacramento, CA
Programs: AA Exec Plat, Hyatt,Marriott,BA,AS
Posts: 4,430
Mar 19, 2016, 7:16 pm
#259
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Monte Sereno, California
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Posts: 1,398
Yes,
The corner seats seem more private forwards and backwards.
The only corner seat I don't like is 1L and 1A. I noticed on my last flight the activity in the galley would bother me. This is the galley where the FA prepares the meals, etc., also the light from the galley peaks though the curtain, the seat faces inwards so you would get a head on view of the curtain.
I don't know if you read this review but it's pretty right on spot.
http://viewfromthewing.boardingarea....eats-you-want/
The corner seats seem more private forwards and backwards.
The only corner seat I don't like is 1L and 1A. I noticed on my last flight the activity in the galley would bother me. This is the galley where the FA prepares the meals, etc., also the light from the galley peaks though the curtain, the seat faces inwards so you would get a head on view of the curtain.
I don't know if you read this review but it's pretty right on spot.
http://viewfromthewing.boardingarea....eats-you-want/
Mar 19, 2016, 7:40 pm
#260
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Sacramento, CA
Programs: AA Exec Plat, Hyatt,Marriott,BA,AS
Posts: 4,430
Yes,
The corner seats seem more private forwards and backwards.
The only corner seat I don't like is 1L and 1A. I noticed on my last flight the activity in the galley would bother me. This is the galley where the FA prepares the meals, etc., also the light from the galley peaks though the curtain, the seat faces inwards so you would get a head on view of the curtain.
I don't know if you read this review but it's pretty right on spot.
http://viewfromthewing.boardingarea....eats-you-want/
The corner seats seem more private forwards and backwards.
The only corner seat I don't like is 1L and 1A. I noticed on my last flight the activity in the galley would bother me. This is the galley where the FA prepares the meals, etc., also the light from the galley peaks though the curtain, the seat faces inwards so you would get a head on view of the curtain.
I don't know if you read this review but it's pretty right on spot.
http://viewfromthewing.boardingarea....eats-you-want/
Mar 19, 2016, 10:52 pm
#261
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Location: Monte Sereno, California
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, AA EXP, 2 mm, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,398
Well I'm 6ft and it was fine, I've been able to sleep well on this plane. Also one thing I've noticed on the 787 Dreamliner the air quality has been improved, it's a great plane I love flying on it.
Thanks very much. My wife and I have selected 5A and 5L. We've been married for 35 years so we can certainly go for 9 hrs. on an overnight flight without something new to say to each other ! That seat looks like it's meant for someone very thin. Neither of us are terribly tall or overweight, but the seat width looks - in the photos- to be narrower than AA economy. Maybe a deceptive photo.
Apr 4, 2016, 3:27 pm
#263
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SFO
Programs: UA 1k; AA Ex Plat; National Exe; Marriott Gold; IHG Gold
Posts: 11
Flew LAX-PVG-LAX on the 787 and tried 6L outbound and 5L inbound.
6L I found to be excellent, plenty of space, good for sleeping, no connected seat issues, no noise from the bathroom. Really liked the reverse position, seemed very private. Only complaint, was it was the worst business class service I ever had. Once the main meal was served I expected to get a drink refill within some time period but I think they completely forgot, rang the bell, which I never do, but they did not respond. Finally after 20 minutes someone from coach came by and helped. The dessert was never delivered to the mini cabin, I went and asked 30 minutes after the dinner was cleared and it seems they just forgot about us. I went to the walkup bar for drink refills after that because no one every came through to checkup.
5L was ok, the space was a lot tighter around the shoulder when upright compared to 6L, I am only 5' 7" and average size. When in bed mode it was fine, I tent to be a side sleeper on planes. The seat is very private and the service was excellent.
I'm not sure if the mini cabin tends to get ignored or I just got unlucky but I'd still choose 6L in the future.
My next trip LAX-HND 1H was the only unconnected seat still opened so I grabbed it. Any thoughts if I should take 2A or any other middle row instead?
6L I found to be excellent, plenty of space, good for sleeping, no connected seat issues, no noise from the bathroom. Really liked the reverse position, seemed very private. Only complaint, was it was the worst business class service I ever had. Once the main meal was served I expected to get a drink refill within some time period but I think they completely forgot, rang the bell, which I never do, but they did not respond. Finally after 20 minutes someone from coach came by and helped. The dessert was never delivered to the mini cabin, I went and asked 30 minutes after the dinner was cleared and it seems they just forgot about us. I went to the walkup bar for drink refills after that because no one every came through to checkup.
5L was ok, the space was a lot tighter around the shoulder when upright compared to 6L, I am only 5' 7" and average size. When in bed mode it was fine, I tent to be a side sleeper on planes. The seat is very private and the service was excellent.
I'm not sure if the mini cabin tends to get ignored or I just got unlucky but I'd still choose 6L in the future.
My next trip LAX-HND 1H was the only unconnected seat still opened so I grabbed it. Any thoughts if I should take 2A or any other middle row instead?
Apr 4, 2016, 3:32 pm
#264
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Denver DEN-APA
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You do realize that other airlines that actually provide good service (SQ, JL and NH) fly that route?
Apr 5, 2016, 10:01 am
#265
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 91
Wife is flying over to Asia in 5L. On our return I currently have 1L/2L.
She wants front facing, I'm fine with rear. I like a window, she is indifferent.
Options are
5A/5D
5D/5H
6L/6H
6A/6D
3 through 5 D/H
All of A.
Read some negative comments on 1L with the galley view/noise, and 2L will have some movement. I had thought 1L/2L might put our heads near each other so we could communicate some, but seems unlikely on second thought.
It's 14 hours and we are perennially exhausted, so I assume at least some sleep.
I'm leaning towards either 5A/5D, I lose my rearview out the window, but in front cabin and not right next to lav.
Other option for rearview is 6H/6L, but in minicabin and based on seatguru layout I think it is safe to assume that 1/3 of Y will be using that restroom as well.
She wants front facing, I'm fine with rear. I like a window, she is indifferent.
Options are
5A/5D
5D/5H
6L/6H
6A/6D
3 through 5 D/H
All of A.
Read some negative comments on 1L with the galley view/noise, and 2L will have some movement. I had thought 1L/2L might put our heads near each other so we could communicate some, but seems unlikely on second thought.
It's 14 hours and we are perennially exhausted, so I assume at least some sleep.
I'm leaning towards either 5A/5D, I lose my rearview out the window, but in front cabin and not right next to lav.
Other option for rearview is 6H/6L, but in minicabin and based on seatguru layout I think it is safe to assume that 1/3 of Y will be using that restroom as well.
Apr 5, 2016, 10:47 am
#266
Join Date: May 2007
Programs: AAdvantage, Hilton
Posts: 3,191
6AD and 6LH will at least allow you to make eye contact with each other with the turn of a head. The only time you will not be able to see each other is in the sleeping position. It's a good pair for companion travel.
7AD and 7LH face each other so that would work as well.
7AD and 7LH face each other so that would work as well.
Apr 5, 2016, 10:53 am
#267
Join Date: May 2007
Programs: AAdvantage, Hilton
Posts: 3,191
I flew with a companion who rarely flies in premium. He preferred the 772 ski slope seat and the 737-800 seat (for its roominess in the upright position) than the crap that is the 787 seat.
As far as I'm concerned all the J seats on this aircraft just suck.
Apr 5, 2016, 7:56 pm
#268
Join Date: Feb 2011
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 810
LOL let's get real - the 772 J seats are a far cry from the 787. The 787 has plenty of space, privacy, outlets, updated IFE, tons of storage in the corner seats, is a much quieter ride, and by all accounts an upgrade to the 772
Apr 5, 2016, 8:58 pm
#269
Join Date: Dec 2009
Programs: BA Gold; AA Lfe Time PLT ; Marriott Titanium, LFT GLD
Posts: 1,276
Last time my wife's dinner was not cleared and she was not offered desert. She ended up bussing her own table and had to go foraging for desert. The designated flight attendant seemed really out of it.
We have concluded than the main J cabin on AA is the best place to sit.
Apr 6, 2016, 1:02 pm
#270
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: AAdvantage Gold, AS Gold, SPG Gold, Emerald Club
Posts: 237
This has likely been asked already, but: Has anyone tried the middle pairs of seats in row 6 or 7? Any big pros/cons to those seat pairs?
This would be for a couple traveling together.
This would be for a couple traveling together.