Jul 18, 2014, 8:16 am
Last edit by: Prospero
(Link) to “United Kingdom Air Passenger Duty (APD) Charged UK Departing Passengers”
Link to html full APD tax law
APD rates as of 01 Apr 2020:
Band A (0 to 2,000 miles) £13 Reduced, £26 Standard
Band B (anything over 2,000 miles): Reduced £80, Standard £176
Infants and children
“Children below the age of 2 years who are not allocated a separate seat before boarding the aircraft are not chargeable passengers. If a seat is purchased for the infant then APD is chargeable.
From 1 May 2015, children who are under the age of 12 years on the date of the flight, and in the lowest class of travel, are not chargeable passengers. Children 12 years and over, or travelling in any other class, are chargeable passengers and APD is due.
From 1 March 2016 children who are under the age of 16 years on the date of the flight, and in the lowest class of travel, are not chargeable passengers. Children 16 years and over, or travelling in any other class, are chargeable passengers and APD is due.”
General notes:
distances calculated between national capitals - e.g. HNL calculated as WAS.
Link to Source: U.K. Excise Notice 550: Air Passenger Duty
APD is due when passengers pay to upgrade any stage of their journey
N.B. Arriving at a UK airport will not incur APD. Connections with less than 24 hours will generally not require APD*; you may have to have the rate desk intervene if you are not on a through ticket. As noted, "band distance" is calculated Capital to Capital.
APD is not charged on flights originating in the Scottish Highlands (INV) or Islands. APD is not payable on direct, Band B, flights departing Northern Ireland.
* Connecting flights exemption (UK APD regulation)
“The connected flights must be detailed on the same ticket or conjunction tickets to qualify for the exemption. Tickets can only be regarded as conjunction tickets if:
a. they are in one booklet, or
b. where they are in separate booklets:
each refers to the other and states that they are to be read in conjunction
there is a summary of the flights constituting the passengers journey including the flights in question
Although the flights may meet all the other criteria for determining whether Two flights are connected, they will only qualify for the exemption if the connection is evidenced on the ticket or a flight summary.”
AA (c/o JonNYC, post #219):
septix by JonNYCme, on Flickr
Link to html full APD tax law
APD rates as of 01 Apr 2020:
Band A (0 to 2,000 miles) £13 Reduced, £26 Standard
Band B (anything over 2,000 miles): Reduced £80, Standard £176
Infants and children
“Children below the age of 2 years who are not allocated a separate seat before boarding the aircraft are not chargeable passengers. If a seat is purchased for the infant then APD is chargeable.
From 1 May 2015, children who are under the age of 12 years on the date of the flight, and in the lowest class of travel, are not chargeable passengers. Children 12 years and over, or travelling in any other class, are chargeable passengers and APD is due.
From 1 March 2016 children who are under the age of 16 years on the date of the flight, and in the lowest class of travel, are not chargeable passengers. Children 16 years and over, or travelling in any other class, are chargeable passengers and APD is due.”
General notes:
distances calculated between national capitals - e.g. HNL calculated as WAS.
Link to Source: U.K. Excise Notice 550: Air Passenger Duty
APD is due when passengers pay to upgrade any stage of their journey
N.B. Arriving at a UK airport will not incur APD. Connections with less than 24 hours will generally not require APD*; you may have to have the rate desk intervene if you are not on a through ticket. As noted, "band distance" is calculated Capital to Capital.
APD is not charged on flights originating in the Scottish Highlands (INV) or Islands. APD is not payable on direct, Band B, flights departing Northern Ireland.
* Connecting flights exemption (UK APD regulation)
“The connected flights must be detailed on the same ticket or conjunction tickets to qualify for the exemption. Tickets can only be regarded as conjunction tickets if:
a. they are in one booklet, or
b. where they are in separate booklets:
each refers to the other and states that they are to be read in conjunction
there is a summary of the flights constituting the passengers journey including the flights in question
Although the flights may meet all the other criteria for determining whether Two flights are connected, they will only qualify for the exemption if the connection is evidenced on the ticket or a flight summary.”
AA (c/o JonNYC, post #219):
septix by JonNYCme, on Flickr
UK APD / Air Passenger Duty charged for UK departures (Master Thread)
May 25, 2016, 10:16 pm
#181
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: California
Programs: AA EXP...couple hotels and cars too
Posts: 4,548
I just wanted to make an oservation from a post I made in Feb 2015 in this thread....
(I recall being told I was nuts for battling AA over this issue.)
Here are the rules back then. NOTE THE WORD "or" in their rules:
Looks like that word has been dropped in a recent iteration? Just an observation
(I recall being told I was nuts for battling AA over this issue.)
Here are the rules back then. NOTE THE WORD "or" in their rules:
4.4 Tickets
In addition to the time related criteria, the agreement for carriage must be evidenced by a ticket which must show the:
airport from which the passenger intends to depart
date and time of his intended departure, and
airport at which he intends to arrive
The connected flights must be detailed on the same ticket or conjunction tickets to qualify for the exemption. Tickets can only be regarded as conjunction tickets if:
a. they are in one booklet, or
b. where they are in separate booklets:
each refers to the other and states that they are to be read in conjunction, or
there is a summary of the flights constituting the passengers journey including the flights in question.
Although the flights may meet all the other criteria for determining whether two flights are connected, they will only qualify for the exemption if the connection is evidenced on the ticket or a flight summary.
In addition to the time related criteria, the agreement for carriage must be evidenced by a ticket which must show the:
airport from which the passenger intends to depart
date and time of his intended departure, and
airport at which he intends to arrive
The connected flights must be detailed on the same ticket or conjunction tickets to qualify for the exemption. Tickets can only be regarded as conjunction tickets if:
a. they are in one booklet, or
b. where they are in separate booklets:
each refers to the other and states that they are to be read in conjunction, or
there is a summary of the flights constituting the passengers journey including the flights in question.
Although the flights may meet all the other criteria for determining whether two flights are connected, they will only qualify for the exemption if the connection is evidenced on the ticket or a flight summary.
May 26, 2016, 1:13 am
#182
Moderator: American AAdvantage, Signatures
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there is an accepted inductry definition of conjunction ticket and that guidance note does not provide a different one - just states it must be a conjunction ticket and be cross referenced
Can you actually provide a definition from HMRC that stipulates what a conjunction ticket is? - that guidance note does not do so
Can you actually provide a definition from HMRC that stipulates what a conjunction ticket is? - that guidance note does not do so
And with the facts laid bare, the discussion of HMRC definitions is put to bed.
~Moderator
May 26, 2016, 1:20 am
#183
Moderator: American AAdvantage, Signatures
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May 26, 2016, 7:07 am
#184
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Just to reinforce this, with my most recent experience of such bookings, I made a Qantas Award booking of return travel between MEL and LAX for March next year. This was 50 weeks beforehand.
A month later, after supplying my 081- ticket number to the agency I used they were able to book a 'conjunction' ticket on 001- stock with reduced +++ for travel originating at LAX.
In this case the savings were not as much as when I have done similar with them in relation to ex UK and APD, but still more than enough to cover their $40 fee.
A month later, after supplying my 081- ticket number to the agency I used they were able to book a 'conjunction' ticket on 001- stock with reduced +++ for travel originating at LAX.
In this case the savings were not as much as when I have done similar with them in relation to ex UK and APD, but still more than enough to cover their $40 fee.
May 26, 2016, 2:18 pm
#185
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This lines up with what JonNYC posted above, and I'd say these two posts together provide the best guidance and example of how a traveller should handle the APD question when flights connect at LHR under separate bookings. Much of the rest of the recent content in this thread is completely irrelevant to passengers in this situation.
Jul 7, 2016, 6:30 pm
#186
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 158
Good lord.
In all seriousness, thank you to the thread contributors for helping to build my understanding of the issue here.
Now, to practically assist travelers, can we start documenting experiences and contributing this to the wiki? I've read that BA is a big no-go, but that AA and UA can sometimes be coaxed into a refund on separate tickets. I may be able to contribute my own experience with either BA and/or AA soon enough.
Special shout-out to @JonNYC who, as usual, steps up to the plate with information from AA to share with the world!
In all seriousness, thank you to the thread contributors for helping to build my understanding of the issue here.
Now, to practically assist travelers, can we start documenting experiences and contributing this to the wiki? I've read that BA is a big no-go, but that AA and UA can sometimes be coaxed into a refund on separate tickets. I may be able to contribute my own experience with either BA and/or AA soon enough.
Special shout-out to @JonNYC who, as usual, steps up to the plate with information from AA to share with the world!
Jul 23, 2016, 6:41 am
#187
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: PIT-SCE-AOO-PHL-NYC-WAS
Programs: free agent
Posts: 1,036
After few calls with EXP agents, they looked at me like which planet I come from, when I press them on APD refund. My united flight arrive LHR around 10 am, and my AA award (Etihad) flight depart 9ish am on next day...
Any recommendation what I should do to get refund? Bring proof of united flight that I took to AA's check-in area at LHR? I suspect that they are more familiar with APD refund than EXP agents on phone? If check-in area is best option, then any idea what time it'll opens?
Any recommendation what I should do to get refund? Bring proof of united flight that I took to AA's check-in area at LHR? I suspect that they are more familiar with APD refund than EXP agents on phone? If check-in area is best option, then any idea what time it'll opens?
Jul 23, 2016, 11:13 am
#188
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NYC
Programs: BA Gold, HH Diamond, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,261
I've had mixed success:
1) I am flying BOM-LHR(AA award) and my LHR-JFK(AA rev) flight leaves after 2 hours transit. Once my SWU cleared, I was asked to pay luxury tax - I told them as I'm in transit - I need not pay. They put in the documentation and didn't collect the luxury tax. Note my LHR-JFK is a paid ticket for which I paid the coach APD bundled in ticket price. I'm not sure how to recoup that.
2) I had a pre-deval MAD-LHR-BOM ticket in J(AA award). I wanted to drop the MAD-LHR segment. I would then fly JFK-LHR(on a separate AAward) and connect to the LHR-BOM. Tried 2 agents and both said if I drop the MAD-LHR, I'll have to pay the higher tax. They cannot change it.
1) I am flying BOM-LHR(AA award) and my LHR-JFK(AA rev) flight leaves after 2 hours transit. Once my SWU cleared, I was asked to pay luxury tax - I told them as I'm in transit - I need not pay. They put in the documentation and didn't collect the luxury tax. Note my LHR-JFK is a paid ticket for which I paid the coach APD bundled in ticket price. I'm not sure how to recoup that.
2) I had a pre-deval MAD-LHR-BOM ticket in J(AA award). I wanted to drop the MAD-LHR segment. I would then fly JFK-LHR(on a separate AAward) and connect to the LHR-BOM. Tried 2 agents and both said if I drop the MAD-LHR, I'll have to pay the higher tax. They cannot change it.
Jul 24, 2016, 10:46 am
#189
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NYC
Programs: BA Gold, HH Diamond, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,261
I've had mixed success:
1) I am flying BOM-LHR(AA award) and my LHR-JFK(AA rev) flight leaves after 2 hours transit. Once my SWU cleared, I was asked to pay luxury tax - I told them as I'm in transit - I need not pay. They put in the documentation and didn't collect the luxury tax. Note my LHR-JFK is a paid ticket for which I paid the coach APD bundled in ticket price. I'm not sure how to recoup that.
1) I am flying BOM-LHR(AA award) and my LHR-JFK(AA rev) flight leaves after 2 hours transit. Once my SWU cleared, I was asked to pay luxury tax - I told them as I'm in transit - I need not pay. They put in the documentation and didn't collect the luxury tax. Note my LHR-JFK is a paid ticket for which I paid the coach APD bundled in ticket price. I'm not sure how to recoup that.
Jul 24, 2016, 2:07 pm
#190
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Well, that sounds specious as the coach APD is technically the reduced Air Passenger Duty; the Business - First tax is the standard Air Passenger Duty (as in Wikipost at top of page). There is no such thing as "the luxury tax".
Jul 24, 2016, 3:58 pm
#191
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NYC
Programs: BA Gold, HH Diamond, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,261
Correct its the reduced APD which was included in the coach ticket price. To make matters worse - its booked via Citi TYP - so even in if AA refunded - I'm not sure how Citi would refund it. If only UK airports had an APD refund desk just like the GST refunds in some countries(Singapore)
Agent had a hard time even understanding my request. She was about to cancel my award ticket as I had asked about 'refund of APD" and luckily I stopped her before she did that(its a pre-deval 30K BOM-LHR in J)
Jul 25, 2016, 9:40 am
#192
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Correct its the reduced APD which was included in the coach ticket price. To make matters worse - its booked via Citi TYP - so even in if AA refunded - I'm not sure how Citi would refund it. If only UK airports had an APD refund desk just like the GST refunds in some countries(Singapore)
Agent had a hard time even understanding my request. She was about to cancel my award ticket as I had asked about 'refund of APD" and luckily I stopped her before she did that(its a pre-deval 30K BOM-LHR in J)
Agent had a hard time even understanding my request. She was about to cancel my award ticket as I had asked about 'refund of APD" and luckily I stopped her before she did that(its a pre-deval 30K BOM-LHR in J)
Last edited by Prospero; Jul 25, 2016 at 2:42 pm Reason: Typo
Jul 28, 2016, 11:42 am
#193
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Jul 29, 2016, 12:49 pm
#195
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JonNYC, thank you for sharing this image. Did you see additional details outside of that image where passengers should reach out for APD refund purposes, my guess is AA refund department? I am debating, press my refund case BEFORE or AFTER my trip. In my situation, I'll take UA award ticketed trip to LHR with 23 hours connection before start my AA-award trip.