masonp123

It really was quite an operation - carts were 'linked' and it really looked impenetrable from pax side (except for clambering over the top of the whole assembly).

Have no idea what was going on in the row 17 crew rest seats.

There were exactly 0 FA's on duty at the time I did my lav run - or if any were on duty they were hiding in the fort and were unobservable.

I'm not extremely traveled, but have been on probably 50+ int'l trips the last 2-3 years or so, very few in Y, the majority in AA J and a decent number on UA J and this crew (J only, didn't observe Y and no F on this plane) was on-the-go from the moment boarding started until everybody passed out. I have never seen a more coordinated, active and solicitous group. I'm serious about sending out a complimentary email leaving out the 'fort' issue. I do agree its not a good thing, but in every other way they were the most outstanding team (and they really were a team) I've ever experienced.

C17PSGR

The ability to set pay based on merit and professionalism instead of seniority was bargained away many many years ago. No unionized airline has the ability based on merit was bargained away long ago.

There are few promotional opportunities for FA's apart from going into management.

FA's can be punished for failing to adhere to service standards but .... the problem is AA doesn't track performance of service standards.

In the retail world, employer's track service standards by employees who have much worse comp and benefit packages than FA's. Meeting those service standard metrics is a critical part of their performance evaluations and sometimes compensation. Those who meet the service standards are paid better. Those who continuously fail need to find alternative employment. Ask a hotel manager/assistant manager what happens to their comp if they score and 8 out of 10 on customer surveys.

Instead of tracking service standards, AA has gotten to the point that FA's are going to track the impact of making beds. Clearly even the FA's recognize the value of metrics (even those collected unscientifically). As for AA, it seems like I saw a survey a few years ago. Not sure this is unique to AA.

As AA doesn't care, service standards are left to FA's own moral compass and peer pressure. With that in mind, I find service is good to great on most domestic flights but not as good on international or transcon flights.

As for this flight, I assume its US to deep South America. If this crew was exhausted, its not because of AA scheduling. I could be wrong but I'm under the impression FA's working these flights make 3-5 round trips like this per month. They'll have at least 12 hours rest time (sometimes a whole day or more) between flights. I'm not denigrating the challenges of the lifestyle or work on the aircraft, but this provides a lot more downtime than the vast majority of American's have.

It would be pretty easy to survey pax to ensure performance. There are incentives for GA's to get flights out on time. Why not find similar incentives to FA's to meet service standards? Or does AA think its saving enough money (a) on Coke products that it doesn't really care whether the FA's provide a second drink service on a mid-con when it is supposed to under its own standards or (b) on drinks in F/J when the FA's disappear for extended periods of time.

Frankly, I can't imagine AA can't develop an incentive system for FA's working F/J internationally or transcon that wouldn't bring more high end business to AA that offsets the cost of a few extra drinks to passengers.

GB

With the adage that "We are here primarily for your safety" I would say there is a troubling issue with this scenario. How can FA's be alert, observant, and available for either passengers or the flight crew when they are obviously sleeping and have further isolated themselves to not only be invisible to passengers but more importantly, not have their own visibility of what is occurring in the cabin.
Just one more serious AA issue of AA FA's feeling they are above the rules and professional standards set out in their job descriptions to ultimately provide service to the passengers.

xooz

I'm afraid I would have had to take a picture and sent to AA. No excuse for no active, awake flight attendant, especially if " your safety is our primary concern".

masonp123

Without question, the deep South American AA FAs have about the best schedule you could imagine-plus the pax are unconcious or at best semi-ambulatory for 80% of the flight! It's like a plane full of placid zombies. No wonder they're always so happy. Second best schedule I think are the NRT crews. One NRT FA had a basically regular, full-time SECOND JOB! Wow! That's the exception, of course.

Blumie

Do you really think your safety is at all at risk when you're cruising at 36,000 feet without a babysitter monitoring the cabin for you? If so, I highly suggest that you hire attendants to cross the street with you and drive with you in your car, since both activities are much more dangerous.

ESpen36

Those Deep South America flights are quite nice, indeed. I know many FAs who retire on these routes (flying EZE/SCL/GRU/GIG exclusively for 15-20 years or more) because they offer a lot of flight hours in a relatively compressed number of working days, plus NO jet lag! (and you get 12 hours on the ground at the outstation--some FAs bring their clothes to be tailored for pennies, or they go to local medical/beauty appts that are super cheap down there)

One of my favorite IDF-based Pursers says she loves that she can work a few flights down to EZE per month, away for a couple of days each, and then spend the rest of her time with her grandchildren! That's a pretty nice full-time job if you ask me! (of course, it took her 42 years of service to AA to reach the level of seniority needed to hold this line!)

One question to the OP: are you saying that the front galley was full of sleeping FAs? I'm pretty sure that one of the big FAA regulations relating to in-flight safety is that there needs to be at least one on-duty, conscious FA present in the front galley at all times during the flight. Am I correct?

LAXJetter

As long as one flight attendant was awake in the front of the cabin, I don't see a BIG problem. Given the choice between the floor and a subpar crew rest designated area, I would probably take the floor. Yes they weren't following protocol but other than that...


This is very true with most jobs. I've always been taught that whatever you do, you should do it well out of respect for yourself.

TWA884

Do keep in mind that it is a total of twelve to fourteen hours on the ground, during daytime, between two consecutive nights of working long haul flights.

masonp123

I don't know. I know that one was asleep - he was spawled/squeezed on the floor in full view. I saw some feet/legs around the corner whom I assumed was out. I have no idea if anyone else was back there (couldn't see and didn't investigate) but I do believe there were two more FA's on the other side (opposite the lav). They may very well have been doing some FA duties or playing cards or something.

Again: this was the BEST crew I've ever had in my flying career. Fantastic boarding, dinner, drinks, everything. They communicated very well with each other (one guy would take a random drink order, then another guy would show up 2 mins later w/ the drink). They were magnificent! Then they built a fort!!

I would take the fort-builders on every flight if I could.

C17PSGR

I have a lot of experience with sleep management in unusual situations and places that often involves short naps rather than a defined sleep period ... so I get that daytime sleep can disrupt sleep rhythms.

For the deep SA FA's, however, I believes it's no more than 3-6 times per month. And, if someone was on their feet working a cabin for several hours (with a couple of defined breaks), I suspect they'd fall asleep quickly when they get to the hotel and get a solid sleep.

I know pilots who work long-haul routes. They go to their hotel, get a meal, go to sleep, get dinner in a local restaurant and head to the airport. The rest period is the same but pilots must take advantage of the sleep.

For both pilots and FA's, they aren't called or contacted during their rest period, that's so they can rest ... not enjoy the experience of being a semi-Porteno. They can be a Porteno on the 20 days a month they aren't flying.

masonp123

True, but the beauty of these flights is they leave relatively late in the evening (8-10 pm) and fly 8.5-10 hours all within one-three time zones. So invariably 90% of pax are unconscious within 3 hours of take off, and most stay that way until immediately before touch-down. FA's are working through the early hours, but that really means very little since everybody (except for us flight-alcoholics) is out cold.

Edit: C17PSGR said it better above.

hillrider

Shocking.

Are you implying that the bad FAs are lying to us when they use the excuse that they're "there primarily for our safety" for not providing good service??

TWA884

Yes, they are not called by the airline, but there are the occasional loud hotel guests in the hallways and chamber maids who check to see if the room is occupied. Then there are the hustle and bustle sounds of the city.

These are not the ideal rest conditions.

84fiero

I remember building forts from the couch cushions as a child. Fun stuff. If only my cubicle weren't so open, I could pull a George Costanza and build a nap center under my desk.

Perhaps hiding out at work goes with AA territory. We once had AWOL gate agents at ORD during irrops. Our already delayed departure was further held up due to no GAs. Actually they had been there for about 10 minutes a couple hours before, gave some attitude to a few pax, and then disappeared. An off-duty FA traveling on our flight went looking around. She found the two GAs hiding out behind one of those mobile "kiosk" carts that was in an out-of-the-way corner of the concourse. They were still on duty, just hiding out - and the irrate FA called whoever the GAs work for at ORD and raised heck. Still took them another 5 minutes to come down to the gate.