Refused transport because of 8.5lb dog... why?
Jun 9, 2019, 1:00 pm
#106
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: YYZ
Posts: 57
It took 8 weeks for Lennox to refund me $200 for my furnace (parts that should have been under warranty but that I incurred during regular maintenance with technician) because Costco made them do it. Giving back money to customers is anathema to most corporations and they take forever to do it. Does not help but I would perhaps enjoy my summer before launching legal proceedings.
I can totally appreciate these big corporations have millions of customers- I expected a refund would take them 3-4 weeks and would even go as far to consider that reasonable.
A little back story I left out from my original post...
- AC only refunded once Global News contacted them (just days before I was told NO in writing).
- When I called them multiple times (3-4 weeks later) I was told “I was already refunded” to “submit a claim” to my fare was not eligible for refunds/ I was considered a “no show”.
- AC has yet to respond to multiple emails in early May
(not even a “my apologies it took so long” - emails were sent to both customer care and some contacts at the Executive Office).
NOTHING.
The law office sent them registered mail on May 15 (delivered with receipt). How miraculous it was processed the SAME day and posted to my account on May 20th. Of course this is at my expense- and we will go after them for legal fees etc.
(Just for comparison sake my husband had a flight cancelled due to the Max8 groundings).
He “claimed a refund” via their website on April 9 and acknowledgement email was received at the end of April (with future travel code)
...His refund appeared on May 7th to his Amex.
Jun 9, 2019, 1:47 pm
#107
Join Date: Aug 2012
Programs: AC E35K, NEXUS
Posts: 4,368
I sent a complaint to AC over an access issue at the airport contract station in the US, and they were all "u wanna fight me, bro - see you at the CTA"
They made a million excuses and quite graciously closed with an invitation to file with CTA and DOJ, so I did. CTA sent me a bunch of documents to respond to with a deadline of less than a week, received the day I came home from major surgery. I was not in any shape to involve any of the passenger advocate groups. I somehow got my comments together (basically saying the same thing I had said: what happened) but CTA foreseeably took their side (compliance!)
(I would note that DOJ issued them a direction to do better under the ADA, and none of the airport contract staff were ever seen again, replaced by a different contractor.)
I didn't want compensation. All I wanted was for them to say "what we did was poor service and we will do it better in future". I provided some free "consulting" about a no-cost solution to make my problem go away. I anticipated having to use that service again and again and I did not want a repetition in my future experience. They said everything but that.
They rely on "compliance" rather than doing the right thing.
In response, I do what they told me to do, which creates a lot of extra work for them. If you ever see someone pushing through a departure lounge containing all the passengers of a full widebody awaiting boarding, and displaying a BP to the gate agent and then standing aside right there and boarding before zone 1 - that's me, working to rule.
Lack of customer service just might be policy because, at AC, it's about compliance not service.
They made a million excuses and quite graciously closed with an invitation to file with CTA and DOJ, so I did. CTA sent me a bunch of documents to respond to with a deadline of less than a week, received the day I came home from major surgery. I was not in any shape to involve any of the passenger advocate groups. I somehow got my comments together (basically saying the same thing I had said: what happened) but CTA foreseeably took their side (compliance!)
(I would note that DOJ issued them a direction to do better under the ADA, and none of the airport contract staff were ever seen again, replaced by a different contractor.)
I didn't want compensation. All I wanted was for them to say "what we did was poor service and we will do it better in future". I provided some free "consulting" about a no-cost solution to make my problem go away. I anticipated having to use that service again and again and I did not want a repetition in my future experience. They said everything but that.
They rely on "compliance" rather than doing the right thing.
In response, I do what they told me to do, which creates a lot of extra work for them. If you ever see someone pushing through a departure lounge containing all the passengers of a full widebody awaiting boarding, and displaying a BP to the gate agent and then standing aside right there and boarding before zone 1 - that's me, working to rule.
Lack of customer service just might be policy because, at AC, it's about compliance not service.
Jun 9, 2019, 3:27 pm
#108
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The denied boarding compensation is only required when the denial is due to an oversell. It's not for other cases of denied boarding (be it that you're too drunk to fly or the agent says your dog is too big).
So unless you have evidence the flight was overbooked, I'd drop that aspect of the claim and just focus on the rest.
Jun 9, 2019, 3:52 pm
#109
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: YYZ
Posts: 57
While I think you have a good case, this is not accurate.
The denied boarding compensation is only required when the denial is due to an oversell. It's not for other cases of denied boarding (be it that you're too drunk to fly or the agent says your dog is too big).
So unless you have evidence the flight was overbooked, I'd drop that aspect of the claim and just focus on the rest.
The denied boarding compensation is only required when the denial is due to an oversell. It's not for other cases of denied boarding (be it that you're too drunk to fly or the agent says your dog is too big).
So unless you have evidence the flight was overbooked, I'd drop that aspect of the claim and just focus on the rest.
... which is what makes this entire ordeal so ridiculous. I believe they are determined to use the dog as a scapegoat.
Jun 9, 2019, 4:25 pm
#110
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I am not surprised with anything than happens with AC. Did they deny you both or you refused to fly without the dog? I ask this because denied boarding compensation is not exclusively for over booking of the flight only.
Jun 9, 2019, 6:21 pm
#111
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Posts: 57
We were issued paper boarding passes as the counter and were actually denied boarding around 7:05pm. 10 minutes later security was called and we were escorted out of the terminal by YQB security (as per AC’s instructions) flight actually took off at 7:40pm.
Jun 11, 2019, 5:55 am
#112
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If you were denied boarding and it is not only the dog then for sure you should write to the Canadian Transport Agency. I can assure you that they respond very quickly. I also presume that you had a sort of altercation at the gate agent too or else he probably would not call the security. CTA would want to know the whole story before they would act on it.
Jun 11, 2019, 6:47 am
#113
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If you were denied boarding and it is not only the dog then for sure you should write to the Canadian Transport Agency. I can assure you that they respond very quickly. I also presume that you had a sort of altercation at the gate agent too or else he probably would not call the security. CTA would want to know the whole story before they would act on it.
Jun 11, 2019, 10:13 am
#114
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(I have a copy of the security report and just to confirm our behaviour is described as “pleasant and appreciative”). I am still waiting for internal reports from Air Canada (referred to “pipida” I believe).
Last edited by vernonc; Jun 11, 2019 at 10:21 am
Jun 11, 2019, 10:18 am
#115
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And "AC Security" (who were not there, but I'm sure have since injected themselves) have a history of hyperbole and making inaccurate assertions & accusations.
Jun 11, 2019, 6:04 pm
#116
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: YYZ
Posts: 57
If you were denied boarding and it is not only the dog then for sure you should write to the Canadian Transport Agency. I can assure you that they respond very quickly. I also presume that you had a sort of altercation at the gate agent too or else he probably would not call the security. CTA would want to know the whole story before they would act on it.
I can certainly post the copies. Even Global News has copies of this and mention it.
Airport security staff report summary was posted by the OP - seems like security had no issues and said they were polite. Security was just following AC staff instructions.
(I have a copy of the security report and just to confirm our behaviour is described as “pleasant and appreciative”). I am still waiting for internal reports from Air Canada (referred to “pipida” I believe).
(I have a copy of the security report and just to confirm our behaviour is described as “pleasant and appreciative”). I am still waiting for internal reports from Air Canada (referred to “pipida” I believe).
I asked them if they were going to have this incident documented and he said “sure but you would have to provide me with your information” and pulled out a little pad of paper. I’ve never been escorted by security - anywhere so I don’t know how they usually deal with people.
...my husband was in contact with them the next day and there was a bit of a struggle to get our hands on them (hence the recorded phone call) but eventually we did. I did not want them saying we were removed from the terminal for our behaviour.
I should also mention I have a photo we (secretly) snapped when security was trying to talk to the gate agent time stamped at 7:16pm (flight was supposed to leave) and you can still see passengers boarding. The doors didn’t close for another 14 minutes 7:30pm and the flight took off around 7:30pm. Even then it boggled our minds WHY the rush to have us removed?
Last edited by Adam Smith; Aug 11, 2022 at 5:09 pm Reason: Merge consecutive posts by same user
Jun 11, 2019, 7:03 pm
#117
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Yes the security would attend if requested by the airline or the airport. It does not mean the passengers have done anything wrong. I know the CTA does takes passenger problems seriously and would raise this with the airline if requested by the passenger. Now they could deny the dog boarding if they feel it is too big but that does not mean they can deny the passengers boarding based on the dog.
Jun 11, 2019, 7:12 pm
#118
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Yes the security would attend if requested by the airline or the airport. It does not mean the passengers have done anything wrong. I know the CTA does takes passenger problems seriously and would raise this with the airline if requested by the passenger. Now they could deny the dog boarding if they feel it is too big but that does not mean they can deny the passengers boarding based on the dog.
Jun 11, 2019, 8:45 pm
#119
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On the merits, which I think you have, I don't have any reason to believe they are biased.
Jun 11, 2019, 9:22 pm
#120
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I suggest that you have nothing to lose with a CTA complaint. Yes, it is a bureaucratic exercise, and yes the agency can move slower than a snail on Xanax, but you have a solid case and it is your right to seek a remedy. I have read this thread since the time you first posted, and my feeling is that the GA and local management screwed up. No, the airline keeps obfuscating, delaying etc. because it has backed itself into a corner. Hopefully, the case reaches the desk of senior legal counsel and she/he says enough, let's do the right thing. I don't think Air Canada was expecting someone as restrained, calm and organized as you to keep at this. Stay the course and see it through. And with each passing month that Air Canada delays in providing fair compensation, it puts itself in a more difficult position.