Nov 20, 2017, 2:16 pm
Last edit by: Argonaut1000
Click here to go to a picture of the White Compensation Form and its stub
View Deflated Seat History Here (Database for submitted occurrences)
Enter New Deflated Seat Occurrence Here (Submit one if you have experienced deflated seat and it will show up in the database above)
----
From post #49 in this thread, here's one potential way to (re)inflate an AC seat:
A better method is for a crew member to use the reset switch under the seat, on the aisle side.
Compensation offers (green/white sheet completed)
40K AE- Apr 18 (50% back of the J class one way redemption)
2018 Jun - $500 coupon
2018 Sep $1,000 eCoupon or 40K AP (P fare TPAC)
2018 Sep $500 eCoupon (P fare TPAC) (no change on protest- update - 6 months later the $150 was increased to $500 - admitted they had made an error)
Compensation offers (no green/white sheet completed)
100K - May 5 (C$150 eCoupon; was moved to a functioning seat after meal service)
2017 Sept - 8,000 AE miles - reported via complaint web page after realizing it was a faulty seat, not standard discomfort; Asked for return of eUps but they declined.
2017 Nov & 2018 Feb - $500 coupons both times (second time on protest that $500 had been offered the previous time)
2018 Sep. $250 coupon (on a paid J TATL).
2018 Nov - $500 eCoupon (J TATL)
Standard eCoupon compensation offers (no haggling; following a recurring pattern)
~10+ hours: $1000
Long TPAC (TPE-YVR)
~6 to ~10 hours: $500
Short TPAC (NRT-YVR)
TATL
South America: YYZ-GRU
less than ~6 hours: 300
TCON
Have a Service Director (SD) That Is Giving You the Case of the Shrugs? Like the real life version of this ASCII emoji -> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ?
No success with the SD and/or crew rectifying your deflated seat and you can't be/aren't accommodated to another J seat? If you asked for a compensation form and the SD says they have no idea what you are talking about, you can use the below picture of the stub portion to help freshen their memory (better than nothing)...
Please note that for the longest time, the "Green Compensation Form" version was used, and there have been recent reports of the "White Compensation Form" replacing the Green version. Reports here have indicated that the two forms are virtually identical except for the colour.
There is now an even newer White Form which explicitly lists "deflated seat" and "deflated seat and fixed", among many other items.
Here is a snapshot of the NEWEST full form (as of August 2019), courtesy of lallied
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31421855-post2093.html
This is only the stub portion, courtesy of lallied
Mattress pads purchased and listed in this thread
View Deflated Seat History Here (Database for submitted occurrences)
Enter New Deflated Seat Occurrence Here (Submit one if you have experienced deflated seat and it will show up in the database above)
----
From post #49 in this thread, here's one potential way to (re)inflate an AC seat:
- Go the home screen "Your Seat". (find this on the seat side panel; not the main video screen)
- Hold the top left hand corner "Air Canada" (with AC logo) for 3 seconds. Updated (Apr 9 18): may need to hold for as long as 45 seconds for key pad to appear
- Dial pad shows up - hit 3-2-1.
- Press "Reset Lumbar Support"
A better method is for a crew member to use the reset switch under the seat, on the aisle side.
Compensation offers (green/white sheet completed)
40K AE- Apr 18 (50% back of the J class one way redemption)
2018 Jun - $500 coupon
2018 Sep $1,000 eCoupon or 40K AP (P fare TPAC)
2018 Sep $500 eCoupon (P fare TPAC) (no change on protest- update - 6 months later the $150 was increased to $500 - admitted they had made an error)
Compensation offers (no green/white sheet completed)
100K - May 5 (C$150 eCoupon; was moved to a functioning seat after meal service)
2017 Sept - 8,000 AE miles - reported via complaint web page after realizing it was a faulty seat, not standard discomfort; Asked for return of eUps but they declined.
2017 Nov & 2018 Feb - $500 coupons both times (second time on protest that $500 had been offered the previous time)
2018 Sep. $250 coupon (on a paid J TATL).
2018 Nov - $500 eCoupon (J TATL)
Standard eCoupon compensation offers (no haggling; following a recurring pattern)
~10+ hours: $1000
Long TPAC (TPE-YVR)
~6 to ~10 hours: $500
Short TPAC (NRT-YVR)
TATL
South America: YYZ-GRU
less than ~6 hours: 300
TCON
Have a Service Director (SD) That Is Giving You the Case of the Shrugs? Like the real life version of this ASCII emoji -> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ?
No success with the SD and/or crew rectifying your deflated seat and you can't be/aren't accommodated to another J seat? If you asked for a compensation form and the SD says they have no idea what you are talking about, you can use the below picture of the stub portion to help freshen their memory (better than nothing)...
Please note that for the longest time, the "Green Compensation Form" version was used, and there have been recent reports of the "White Compensation Form" replacing the Green version. Reports here have indicated that the two forms are virtually identical except for the colour.
There is now an even newer White Form which explicitly lists "deflated seat" and "deflated seat and fixed", among many other items.
Here is a snapshot of the NEWEST full form (as of August 2019), courtesy of lallied
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31421855-post2093.html
This is only the stub portion, courtesy of lallied
Mattress pads purchased and listed in this thread
Deflategate; new executive pods deflating in-flight
Nov 4, 2018, 10:26 pm
#617
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
Programs: AC*SE100K, wood level status in various other programs
Posts: 6,232
Nov 4, 2018, 10:27 pm
#618
Moderator, Air Canada; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE MM, FB Plat, WS Plat, BA Silver, DL GM, Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 16,775
Nov 4, 2018, 11:05 pm
#619
Join Date: Jan 2001
Programs: AC SEMM
Posts: 724
So so with all due respect, what was said by the FA is not ridiculous. It is a load case that, however unlikely in the eyes of frequent travellers on this forum, should be considered in the design.
Last edited by visitor; Nov 4, 2018 at 11:06 pm Reason: Typo
Nov 5, 2018, 2:36 am
#620
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Moncton, NB, Canada
Programs: AC MM+
Posts: 197
So then what did the SD say when s/he handed you the white claim form despite being told it is done on the iPad?
Also, did you have to fill out the white form? Seat no., flight no., select specific issue from a bunch of checkboxed items, describe the specific issue with a short couple of sentences, etc.? Was there a detachable portion like on the green forms with a reference no. to keep as your "receipt"?
Also, did you have to fill out the white form? Seat no., flight no., select specific issue from a bunch of checkboxed items, describe the specific issue with a short couple of sentences, etc.? Was there a detachable portion like on the green forms with a reference no. to keep as your "receipt"?
Yes to all of the above. Relatively the same as the green sheet in the past.
Nov 5, 2018, 7:16 am
#621
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: YYZ
Programs: FOTSG Tangerine Ex E35k (AC)
Posts: 5,612
While I don’t know when this fix was discovered and stared being rolled out it seems to be taking a long time to deploy. I get planes are often on quick turnarounds but there are periods when they’re not in flight surely.
Maybe it takes an hour to fix each seat though. Perhaps AC should prioritize the broken seats ... based in their collection of multi coloured forms or the wiki we’ve created for them.
Maybe it takes an hour to fix each seat though. Perhaps AC should prioritize the broken seats ... based in their collection of multi coloured forms or the wiki we’ve created for them.
Nov 5, 2018, 7:39 am
#622
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto - YYZ
Programs: Aeroplan/Hilton Gold/Marriott Bonvoy Titanium/Accor/Hyatt Gold Passport
Posts: 5,899
What was said is that it was a manufacturing defect in a plastic weld, and that the supplier has redesigned the part. The service condition(s) that exposed the defect were not shared. It is not ridiculous that unanticipated use/abuse of the seat cushions is part of the story. If it were truly just a manufacturing defect, there would be no need to go to the significant expense of redesign and recertification. You would just fix the manufacturing process, improve quality control on new parts, develop a scheme to check all in-service parts, replace those that fail the test. Even if based on some sampling it were clear that it would be cheaper to just replace all seat cushions (for example the testing costs are significant) there would still be no need for a redesign and recert.
So so with all due respect, what was said by the FA is not ridiculous. It is a load case that, however unlikely in the eyes of frequent travellers on this forum, should be considered in the design.
Last edited by ACYYZ/SD; Nov 5, 2018 at 7:46 am
Nov 5, 2018, 9:52 am
#623
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: YEG
Programs: AC Lifetime SE100K, 3MM, SPG Lifetime Plat, Hertz PC, National Executive Elite
Posts: 2,901
While I don’t know when this fix was discovered and stared being rolled out it seems to be taking a long time to deploy. I get planes are often on quick turnarounds but there are periods when they’re not in flight surely.
Maybe it takes an hour to fix each seat though. Perhaps AC should prioritize the broken seats ... based in their collection of multi coloured forms or the wiki we’ve created for them.
Maybe it takes an hour to fix each seat though. Perhaps AC should prioritize the broken seats ... based in their collection of multi coloured forms or the wiki we’ve created for them.
I don't have any idea if the repositioning of seat cushions has increased the incidence of the weld fail, so I won't specifically comment on that. I also don't know whether or not any valve failures have been detected. I just know that the weld failure is the primary cause of the deflation.
Last edited by YEG_SE4Life; Nov 5, 2018 at 10:01 am
Nov 5, 2018, 12:13 pm
#624
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: SFO/YYZ
Programs: AC 25K, AS MVP Gold, BA Bronze, UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,469
As I stated up thread, the new bladders are available this month. AC is prioritizing known problem seats. They are also scheduling the fleet for bladder replacement. The current ones are defective. They will all be replaced.
I don't have any idea if the repositioning of seat cushions has increased the incidence of the weld fail, so I won't specifically comment on that. I also don't know whether or not any valve failures have been detected. I just know that the weld failure is the primary cause of the deflation.
I don't have any idea if the repositioning of seat cushions has increased the incidence of the weld fail, so I won't specifically comment on that. I also don't know whether or not any valve failures have been detected. I just know that the weld failure is the primary cause of the deflation.
Nov 5, 2018, 12:45 pm
#625
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 492
Nov 5, 2018, 5:39 pm
#626
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: YEG
Programs: AC Lifetime SE100K, 3MM, SPG Lifetime Plat, Hertz PC, National Executive Elite
Posts: 2,901
Nov 9, 2018, 1:35 pm
#627
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
Programs: AC*SE100K, wood level status in various other programs
Posts: 6,232
Although I am actively avoiding any AC 777/787 flights until there's some indication that the problem has gone away, I did book a trip with a 787 leg a while back that I flew today. Across the Atlantic. In a deflated seat. Again.
I checked the seat upon boarding and it seemed okay. But it was one of the slowly leaking seats, and required me to perform the reset process (as documented in the Wiki and sadly now memorized by me) about every 60-90 minutes. This was easy to remember since I woke up every time my bony hips were being displaced by the metal frame underneath, which was my cue to re-inflate.
After a bit of this, I pointed out this issue to our SD. I've encountered my fair share of ignorance and/or apathy from SDs and FAs on this matter, and his response fell into the latter category. He said words to the effect of "oh well, at least it's a slow leak" and he'd make a note of it (he scrawled my seat number on one the tags on a nearby catering bin) and sent me on my merry way so that he could have his supper. No offer of a form and frankly I was too tired to remind him that I was the customer here. Why should we have to fight for something we are paying for? Both J and PY were full, so no alternate seat option (again) either. I will fill out the online form and see what happens.
Oh well, at least the catering ex-CDG was good and the shower in YYZ DOM MLL didn't try to attack me. And there will be no more AC 777/787s in the foreseeable future either.
For the record, this was FIN 845 operating as AC 881 (CDG-YYZ) and the seat in question was 5G. Edit: Issue tracker updated.
I checked the seat upon boarding and it seemed okay. But it was one of the slowly leaking seats, and required me to perform the reset process (as documented in the Wiki and sadly now memorized by me) about every 60-90 minutes. This was easy to remember since I woke up every time my bony hips were being displaced by the metal frame underneath, which was my cue to re-inflate.
After a bit of this, I pointed out this issue to our SD. I've encountered my fair share of ignorance and/or apathy from SDs and FAs on this matter, and his response fell into the latter category. He said words to the effect of "oh well, at least it's a slow leak" and he'd make a note of it (he scrawled my seat number on one the tags on a nearby catering bin) and sent me on my merry way so that he could have his supper. No offer of a form and frankly I was too tired to remind him that I was the customer here. Why should we have to fight for something we are paying for? Both J and PY were full, so no alternate seat option (again) either. I will fill out the online form and see what happens.
Oh well, at least the catering ex-CDG was good and the shower in YYZ DOM MLL didn't try to attack me. And there will be no more AC 777/787s in the foreseeable future either.
For the record, this was FIN 845 operating as AC 881 (CDG-YYZ) and the seat in question was 5G. Edit: Issue tracker updated.
Last edited by Bohemian1; Nov 10, 2018 at 11:57 am Reason: Added Issue Tracker update
Nov 9, 2018, 8:12 pm
#628
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,334
6G on 739 on Wednesday had the upper portion deflated. A reset seemed to correct it for the rest of the flight, but I wasn't the one sitting in it.
My colleague had never flown J before, so he didn't quite understand the issue.
My colleague had never flown J before, so he didn't quite understand the issue.
Nov 10, 2018, 4:36 am
#629
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Titanium & LTP, NEXUS
Posts: 613
Just got off of AC17 (FIN 846). My seat was fine (5K) but after 11 hours of discomfort my wife pointed out that hers was deflated (6K). SD was able to reset it for the last hour and a half of the flight.
Nov 10, 2018, 5:01 am
#630
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: YYZ
Programs: Aeroplan, Flying Blue Gold, Accor Silver, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 662
Would someone have a picture of what the form looks like? It could come in handy when asking for it and the SD have no clue what we are talking about. Perhaps adding it to the WIKi (if it takes images) as well.
I just want to be prepared in case I experience it on my upcoming flight.
I just want to be prepared in case I experience it on my upcoming flight.