Sep 19, 2017, 10:25 am
Last edit by: 24left
Jan 18 2021 TC issues Airworthiness Directive for the 737 MAX
Link to post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/32976892-post4096.html
Cabin photos
Post 976 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29534462-post976.html
Post 1300 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29780203-post1300.html
Cabin Layout
Interior Specs can be found here https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/fly/onboard/fleet.html
- Window seats may feel narrower to come as the armrests are placed "into" the "curvature" of the cabin.
- Seats with no windows feel even more narrower as there is no space created by the curvature of window.
- All bulkhead seats have very limited legroom.
- Seats 15A, 16A, 16F, 17A and 17F have limited windows.
- Exit rows 19 and 20 have more legroom than regular preferred seats.
Routes
The 737 MAX is designated to replace the A320-series. Based on announcements and schedule updates, the following specific routes will be operated by the 737 MAX in future:
YYZ-LAX (periodic flights)
YYZ-SNN (new route)
YUL-DUB (new route)
YYZ/YUL-KEF (replacing Rouge A319)
YYT-LHR (replacing Mainline A319)
YHZ-LHR (replacing Mainline B767)
Hawaii Routes YVR/YYC (replacing Rouge B767)
Many domestic trunk routes (YYZ, YVR, YUL, YYC) now operated by 7M8, replacing A320 family
Link to post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/32976892-post4096.html
Cabin photos
Post 976 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29534462-post976.html
Post 1300 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29780203-post1300.html
Cabin Layout
Interior Specs can be found here https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/fly/onboard/fleet.html
- Window seats may feel narrower to come as the armrests are placed "into" the "curvature" of the cabin.
- Seats with no windows feel even more narrower as there is no space created by the curvature of window.
- All bulkhead seats have very limited legroom.
- Seats 15A, 16A, 16F, 17A and 17F have limited windows.
- Exit rows 19 and 20 have more legroom than regular preferred seats.
Routes
The 737 MAX is designated to replace the A320-series. Based on announcements and schedule updates, the following specific routes will be operated by the 737 MAX in future:
YYZ-LAX (periodic flights)
YYZ-SNN (new route)
YUL-DUB (new route)
YYZ/YUL-KEF (replacing Rouge A319)
YYT-LHR (replacing Mainline A319)
YHZ-LHR (replacing Mainline B767)
Hawaii Routes YVR/YYC (replacing Rouge B767)
Many domestic trunk routes (YYZ, YVR, YUL, YYC) now operated by 7M8, replacing A320 family
Air Canada Selects Boeing 737 MAX to Renew Mainline Narrowbody Fleet
Oct 20, 2019, 6:18 pm
#3331
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 8,005
Here's an article from May's issue of Business Commercial Aviation.
You need a valid e-mail address to read it.
Several interesting talking points.
MCAS is a new flight control computer law that was added to the MAX because the latest 737’s new Leap 1B turbofans are considerably larger than their predecessors, mounted higher and farther ahead of the wing for ground clearance and produce considerable vortex lift at high angles of attack
MCAS horizontal stab trim runaway most likely would be preceded by an impressively distracting and disorienting IAS disagree/ALT disagree/stall warning stick shaker/runaway stall margin red “zipper” on the airspeed scale.
Including training:
Such rigorous sim training no longer is routine in the airline industry.
“We’re just checking boxes for the FAA,” says one Seattle-based 737 airline pilot.
Critics point to the scant 200 hr. of flight time logged by the copilot of Ethiopian Flight 302.
“There’s no way they can claim they had a qualified crew on that flight..."
You need a valid e-mail address to read it.
Several interesting talking points.
MCAS is a new flight control computer law that was added to the MAX because the latest 737’s new Leap 1B turbofans are considerably larger than their predecessors, mounted higher and farther ahead of the wing for ground clearance and produce considerable vortex lift at high angles of attack
MCAS horizontal stab trim runaway most likely would be preceded by an impressively distracting and disorienting IAS disagree/ALT disagree/stall warning stick shaker/runaway stall margin red “zipper” on the airspeed scale.
Including training:
Such rigorous sim training no longer is routine in the airline industry.
“We’re just checking boxes for the FAA,” says one Seattle-based 737 airline pilot.
Critics point to the scant 200 hr. of flight time logged by the copilot of Ethiopian Flight 302.
“There’s no way they can claim they had a qualified crew on that flight..."
Oct 20, 2019, 10:15 pm
#3332
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
To the critics: it's 200+ hours in the Boeing 737; he had 361 total. Not much, granted, but proficiency depends less on the number of hours versus the quality of the training. We have 20 year old kids flying solo in our CF-18s with a whopping 300 hours total time in their logbooks. They're the culmination of a rigorous selection and training program and are certainly qualified crew. I won't speculate on how Ethiopian trains their cadet pilots, but there are plenty of top-notch airlines who funnel pilots from zero-to-hero at an accelerated rate, to partner with an experienced - in this case 8000+ hours - captain.
Oct 21, 2019, 3:28 pm
#3333
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Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
Moving along....and if the title is clickbait, contact Reuters
Posted 2 hours ago
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-e...-idUSKBN1X021S
Posted 2 hours ago
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-e...-idUSKBN1X021S
Oct 21, 2019, 4:01 pm
#3334
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Halifax
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Lifetime Platinum Elite. NEXUS
Posts: 4,570
What does "in January at earliest" mean? Not quite conflicting clarifications, but confusing clarifications to be sure. I've stopped trusting hte author at this point to use accurate language. So: Which does the headline mean?
- Not before January 1 will the EU clear the MAX, and possibly not ever
- The EU will clear the MAX, but not before January 1, but possibly by January 31
Oct 21, 2019, 4:06 pm
#3335
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: YYC
Programs: BA bronze, Aeroplan peon
Posts: 4,746
I read the headline to mean the earliest the EU could clear it would be sometime during the month of January.
In the article they go into more detail that test flights are scheduled for mid December, so January is the earliest possibility of clearance to return to service.
In the article they go into more detail that test flights are scheduled for mid December, so January is the earliest possibility of clearance to return to service.
Oct 21, 2019, 4:07 pm
#3336
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Posts: 18,877
Oct 21, 2019, 4:08 pm
#3337
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,353
What does "in January at earliest" mean? Not quite conflicting clarifications, but confusing clarifications to be sure. I've stopped trusting hte author at this point to use accurate language. So: Which does the headline mean?
- Not before January 1 will the EU clear the MAX, and possibly not ever
- The EU will clear the MAX, but not before January 1, but possibly by January 31
Or in other words, not much new information.
Oct 21, 2019, 4:11 pm
#3338
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: YYC
Programs: AC 50k 1MM, Marriott LT Titanium Elite
Posts: 3,402
I read the headline to mean the earliest the EU could clear it would be sometime during the month of January.
In the article they go into more detail that test flights are scheduled for mid December, so January is the earliest possibility of clearance to return to service.
In the article they go into more detail that test flights are scheduled for mid December, so January is the earliest possibility of clearance to return to service.
The aircraft will return to service... on the 5th of Never.
Oct 21, 2019, 6:26 pm
#3339
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
Given that AC has announced a possible Max return in mid-February at the earliest and it will take months to recertify pilots and reintroduce the type one by one, I wouldn't bet on the planes parked in Arizona coming home before the snow melts here. Also, aircraft are insentient.
Oct 21, 2019, 6:57 pm
#3341
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: YYJ
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Posts: 2,439
Oct 21, 2019, 7:06 pm
#3342
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Posts: 18,877
October 21 2019
QUOTES:
The messages made public Friday included an exchange from a top Boeing pilot to a colleague in 2016 that expressed his worries about an aggressive flight control system on the Max, whose performance he called “egregious.” The pilot, who now works for Southwest, said in the exchange that he “unknowingly” lied to regulators. That same pilot months later told the FAA to remove the system, known as MCAS, from pilot procedures and training materials.
The FAA said Boeing knew about the messages for months and scolded Boeing in a letter for not releasing the documents earlier. Boeing defended its training materials for the 737 Max, which regulators deemed safe in 2017, and said it told regulators on “multiple occasions” about the broadened capabilities of the now-questioned system.
“Our working thesis has been that the failures on the 737 Max development by the company centered on fault intolerant design compounded by poor assumptions of pilot response,” it wrote in its downgrade. “We now have to append that assessment further based on source material provided to Congress and the FAA on Friday that reinforces the perception of and heightens the potential of incomplete disclosure, which inherently puts more money/trust & time at stake.”
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/21/boei...s-with-it.html
QUOTES:
The messages made public Friday included an exchange from a top Boeing pilot to a colleague in 2016 that expressed his worries about an aggressive flight control system on the Max, whose performance he called “egregious.” The pilot, who now works for Southwest, said in the exchange that he “unknowingly” lied to regulators. That same pilot months later told the FAA to remove the system, known as MCAS, from pilot procedures and training materials.
The FAA said Boeing knew about the messages for months and scolded Boeing in a letter for not releasing the documents earlier. Boeing defended its training materials for the 737 Max, which regulators deemed safe in 2017, and said it told regulators on “multiple occasions” about the broadened capabilities of the now-questioned system.
“Our working thesis has been that the failures on the 737 Max development by the company centered on fault intolerant design compounded by poor assumptions of pilot response,” it wrote in its downgrade. “We now have to append that assessment further based on source material provided to Congress and the FAA on Friday that reinforces the perception of and heightens the potential of incomplete disclosure, which inherently puts more money/trust & time at stake.”
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/21/boei...s-with-it.html
Oct 22, 2019, 2:03 pm
#3343
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: YXU
Programs: AC SE100K, National E/E, HH Diamond, IHG Diamond, MB, Avis PC
Posts: 970
I think you took things a few steps beyond my simple observation that there is indeed an alternative to the Max. As long as delays might be to procure an Airbus product in the event of a Max program cessation, the concept of procuring a type uncertified to fly is a non-starter.
Just to repeat my position on the whole affair: I'm not a B737 fan and I still think AC made a mistake ordering it. Just as I thought 6 years ago as it can be seen in my posts in this topic from that time*. But I would never expect problems on this scale.
*I was wrong as far as the PW engine PIP is concerned. Not only there is no PIP yet as it was promised 6 years ago, but PW still couldn't make the PW1100 working as promised.
Oct 22, 2019, 3:27 pm
#3344
Join Date: Mar 2012
Programs: Mileage Plus 1K; Marriott Platinum; Hilton Gold
Posts: 6,355
Boeing's head of commercial aviation is leaving
According to the NY Times, this is the highest casualty of the MAX crisis, thus far:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/22/b...callister.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/22/b...callister.html
