Sep 19, 2017, 10:25 am
Last edit by: 24left
Jan 18 2021 TC issues Airworthiness Directive for the 737 MAX
Link to post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/32976892-post4096.html
Cabin photos
Post 976 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29534462-post976.html
Post 1300 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29780203-post1300.html
Cabin Layout
Interior Specs can be found here https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/fly/onboard/fleet.html
- Window seats may feel narrower to come as the armrests are placed "into" the "curvature" of the cabin.
- Seats with no windows feel even more narrower as there is no space created by the curvature of window.
- All bulkhead seats have very limited legroom.
- Seats 15A, 16A, 16F, 17A and 17F have limited windows.
- Exit rows 19 and 20 have more legroom than regular preferred seats.
Routes
The 737 MAX is designated to replace the A320-series. Based on announcements and schedule updates, the following specific routes will be operated by the 737 MAX in future:
YYZ-LAX (periodic flights)
YYZ-SNN (new route)
YUL-DUB (new route)
YYZ/YUL-KEF (replacing Rouge A319)
YYT-LHR (replacing Mainline A319)
YHZ-LHR (replacing Mainline B767)
Hawaii Routes YVR/YYC (replacing Rouge B767)
Many domestic trunk routes (YYZ, YVR, YUL, YYC) now operated by 7M8, replacing A320 family
Link to post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/32976892-post4096.html
Cabin photos
Post 976 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29534462-post976.html
Post 1300 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29780203-post1300.html
Cabin Layout
Interior Specs can be found here https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/fly/onboard/fleet.html
- Window seats may feel narrower to come as the armrests are placed "into" the "curvature" of the cabin.
- Seats with no windows feel even more narrower as there is no space created by the curvature of window.
- All bulkhead seats have very limited legroom.
- Seats 15A, 16A, 16F, 17A and 17F have limited windows.
- Exit rows 19 and 20 have more legroom than regular preferred seats.
Routes
The 737 MAX is designated to replace the A320-series. Based on announcements and schedule updates, the following specific routes will be operated by the 737 MAX in future:
YYZ-LAX (periodic flights)
YYZ-SNN (new route)
YUL-DUB (new route)
YYZ/YUL-KEF (replacing Rouge A319)
YYT-LHR (replacing Mainline A319)
YHZ-LHR (replacing Mainline B767)
Hawaii Routes YVR/YYC (replacing Rouge B767)
Many domestic trunk routes (YYZ, YVR, YUL, YYC) now operated by 7M8, replacing A320 family
Air Canada Selects Boeing 737 MAX to Renew Mainline Narrowbody Fleet
Oct 15, 2019, 10:14 am
#3301
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Vancouver
Programs: AC SE100K 1MM, FB Platinum, Bonvoy Platinum Elite, IHG Gold Elite, Hilton Gold
Posts: 1,605
It has been almost seven months since the 737MAX aircrafts have been grounded, and aside from the first couple of months when the impacts of equipment swaps and rescheduling were felt significantly, everything seems normal now. At this point, the only entity that really needs the MAX back in the skies is Boeing. The pilots can be re-trained for other types; airlines that didn't put all their eggs in one basket have coped with the impact rather well; and passengers can't really tell the difference.
I personally don't care if the MAX flies again at all. There are more Rouge flights for YYT now, but some of us already assumed it was only a matter of time before AC rouges most domestic routes.
I personally don't care if the MAX flies again at all. There are more Rouge flights for YYT now, but some of us already assumed it was only a matter of time before AC rouges most domestic routes.
The A223's cannot come fast enough. There are 12 Max 8's build already for AC. I wouldn't be surprised to see a top up order with the 11 Max 9's getting exchanged for something else (like more 787's).
Interesting times from a fleet perspective.
Last edited by tcook052; Oct 15, 2019 at 5:32 pm Reason: off topic
Oct 16, 2019, 11:41 am
#3302
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Posts: 18,877
Excellent read and analysis and interesting parallels to the MAX
https://theaircurrent.com/historical...-of-the-dc-10/
.
Oct 16, 2019, 2:13 pm
#3303
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Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
It is indeed, but OP did not include the source of the photo, Sam Chui's video flying YHM-MZJ
********
In another update photo to "Where in the World are AC's MAX birds"............
In today's episode, we have a flock of many colors at MWH
One is on the far right and clearly visible. Another AC MAX is toward the upper left of the photo, top of inside row, next to 2 WN birds.
Oct 16, 2019, 9:41 pm
#3304
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Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
My quote from the Sept 22, 2019 Wall Street Journal
Paging @InTheAirGuy
AC moving the goal posts to Feb 14, 2020, as per posts on this page https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...ect-ac-68.html
(Also the Journal might want to update that article)
Paging @InTheAirGuy
AC moving the goal posts to Feb 14, 2020, as per posts on this page https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...ect-ac-68.html
(Also the Journal might want to update that article)
Oct 16, 2019, 10:07 pm
#3305
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
AC moving the goal posts to Feb 14, 2020, as per posts on this page https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...ect-ac-68.html
(Also the Journal might want to update that article)
(Also the Journal might want to update that article)
Oct 17, 2019, 9:05 am
#3306
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
Programs: AC*SE100K, wood level status in various other programs
Posts: 6,232
Oct 17, 2019, 11:37 am
#3307
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
Oct 18, 2019, 1:35 pm
#3308
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: May 2002
Location: YEG
Programs: HH Silver
Posts: 56,449
https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-s...MWXq7ab0sa7Ls0
New document in 737 Max investigation points to chaos, pressure in MCAS development.
New document in 737 Max investigation points to chaos, pressure in MCAS development.
Oct 18, 2019, 5:53 pm
#3309
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Mississauga Ontario
Posts: 4,105
I was going to post this and take a shot at the folks here who said that the plane itself was fine, and that it was third world pilots who were the problems, and those of us who said we would not fly the bird were shrill idiots.
But then, I thought, I would not say that. That would be rude
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...732_story.html
In the messages, Mark A. Forkner, then chief technical pilot for Boeing’s 737, wrote to technical pilot Patrik Gustavsson that the MCAS was engaging “itself like craxy, ” calling the problem “egregious.”
Forkner, who had a major role in the Max, also indicated that the Boeing employees misled the Federal Aviation Administration. “So I basically lied to the regulators (unknowingly),” he wrote.
----
But I will say, I'm not getting on the plane.
And in fact, I'm still prepared to stake out my position that I will probably never have to make that decision, because, simply, it won't be back in the air.
But then, I thought, I would not say that. That would be rude
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...732_story.html
In the messages, Mark A. Forkner, then chief technical pilot for Boeing’s 737, wrote to technical pilot Patrik Gustavsson that the MCAS was engaging “itself like craxy, ” calling the problem “egregious.”
Forkner, who had a major role in the Max, also indicated that the Boeing employees misled the Federal Aviation Administration. “So I basically lied to the regulators (unknowingly),” he wrote.
----
But I will say, I'm not getting on the plane.
And in fact, I'm still prepared to stake out my position that I will probably never have to make that decision, because, simply, it won't be back in the air.
Oct 18, 2019, 10:03 pm
#3310
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: YYC
Programs: BA bronze, Aeroplan peon
Posts: 4,746
But who knows? If the various agencies make it go through a new type evaluation it probably cannot be certified as is, and I don't know if software is enough to make it pass, plus adding more AoA sensors.
Oct 19, 2019, 12:50 am
#3311
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Vancouver
Programs: Aeroplan, Mileage Plus, WestJet Gold, AMEX Plat
Posts: 2,026
I basically agree with you, with a "but". As we saw in the earlier article, there are so many historical parallels with the DC-10 from 1979 and it went on to have a long flying life, so I suspect that the MAX will eventually get back in the air somehow. Probably not in the form we see now, possibly reverting back the to the wing/engine configuration of the NG and the MAX as such will cease to exist.
But who knows? If the various agencies make it go through a new type evaluation it probably cannot be certified as is, and I don't know if software is enough to make it pass, plus adding more AoA sensors.
But who knows? If the various agencies make it go through a new type evaluation it probably cannot be certified as is, and I don't know if software is enough to make it pass, plus adding more AoA sensors.
I agree these aircraft will eventually fly again. Hopfully with out changes to the engine or wing. If they need to significantly compromise fuel efficiency they may all become cargo aircraft. Sounds like Amazon is looking to buy cargo 737s anyway.
Perhaps it is time for airbus to visit AC with a power point deck on their latest A220 and A320 offering.
Oct 19, 2019, 8:12 am
#3312
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC SEMM / HH Diamond
Posts: 3,167
I basically agree with you, with a "but". As we saw in the earlier article, there are so many historical parallels with the DC-10 from 1979 and it went on to have a long flying life, so I suspect that the MAX will eventually get back in the air somehow. Probably not in the form we see now, possibly reverting back the to the wing/engine configuration of the NG and the MAX as such will cease to exist.
But who knows? If the various agencies make it go through a new type evaluation it probably cannot be certified as is, and I don't know if software is enough to make it pass, plus adding more AoA sensors.
But who knows? If the various agencies make it go through a new type evaluation it probably cannot be certified as is, and I don't know if software is enough to make it pass, plus adding more AoA sensors.
But I strongly suspect that this is the end of the line for the 737 type. For both technical reasons, and now emotional ones, I can't imagine Boeing deciding in N years that they will try to squeeze yet another iteration out of the 737 design, and developing a 737 NEWEST. It's been documented that they were on the fence about building an entirely new type prior to the MAX being chosen, and so surely this debacle will tip the scales when they eventually decide they need yet another new plane.
Oct 19, 2019, 8:39 am
#3313
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YYC
Posts: 23,805
If they are forced to change to the NG engines that is significant rework. There is a lot of aerodynamic optimization that goes into airflow around the wing and the engine. Who knows if such a configuration is sufficiently fuel efficient to make it economically viable.
Oct 19, 2019, 9:23 am
#3314
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
They won't be able to convert an existing Max back into an NG aircraft. "Reworking" the engines, the wings and all the other structural differences - would be more difficult and expensive than simply building a new NG airframe. Where would they do all these conversions and who would perform them? If the decision is made to alter the current design of the Max, the existing models will be rightfully scrapped.
Oct 19, 2019, 9:45 am
#3315
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YYC
Posts: 23,805
They won't be able to convert an existing Max back into an NG aircraft. "Reworking" the engines, the wings and all the other structural differences - would be more difficult and expensive than simply building a new NG airframe. Where would they do all these conversions and who would perform them? If the decision is made to alter the current design of the Max, the existing models will be rightfully scrapped.