Yes, I know, and I was being slightly flippant. ;)

Nevertheless, the parallels are interesting, I think...

And I still don't understand why one shouldn't expect people in the service industry to perform their jobs well, without expecting extra money for doing so, and why one shouldn't also expect that their employers should pay them a living wage accordingly — which, of course, the customer would ultimately pay: so it's not a question of my wanting to pay less as the customer, it's a question of the whole rationale behind the process.

Anyway, it's little things like this that make travel interesting, I guess. :)

This is not true.

Any up-front payment, such as to jump a line at a nightclub (or to get in at all), or to get a better room in a hotel, is a bribe. A tip is a means of thanking for good service already received.

Well, a bribe can be paid afterwards, with the job being done in the expectation of payment to follow. And a tip can be given in advance, for instance at the beginning of the evening in a bar.

In the West, we certainly have the absolute expectation that government employees and civil/public servants won't expect or get extra payment for doing their job and furthermore that they will be unmoved by offers of payment in exchange for doing their job (or for performing extra or speedier services).

But why do we not, for example, tip the airline check-in person who provides good service, perhaps up-grading us or giving us a bulk-head seat when we're travelling with children? Why not the supermarket employee who helps us to find where the eggs are? Or the bus driver who holds the bus for us when we're running to catch it? Or the person in the book shop who can work out what book it is that we want to buy from a half-baked description? And so on...

In Egypt, I recall having bribes extorted from me. Going into some tombs, you had to bribe the custodian to allow you to take photos (which were strictly forbidden). However, they would not let you simply adhere to the rules and not take photos.

And in Viet Nam, I had to bribe the border guards to stamp my passport and let me in.

To anyone visiting the USA and not wishing to tip I have the following simple tip: stay at home and don't bother. As has been pointed out people who are generally tipped rely on those tips to make a living. They are paid sub-standard and make it up with tips. So tip low for poor service and tip well for bad service. If you don't like it, this ain't the place for you. And I'm a Brit. And when I go to Nobu I ask for iced water. That gets you London's finest tap with ice. Works everywhere else too.

The only thing that does wind me up on the tipping side is the additional tip section on room service. So I've already had $5 service charge plus 18% tip added "for my convenience". I would rather have zero added and tip the poor bugger who's had to drag my tray upstairs cash.

(1) It isn't extra money - it is standard fee-for-service if you will. Think of it as buying an airline ticket and paying extra to check your bags. Except that restaurant service isn't optional (except at fast food).

(2) I agree that it would be nice if employers in the US paid a living wage so that tips were really only paid for extraordinary service, but that's not the way our system works. Understand that it is a cultural norm, just as showing the back of hand is an insult in some cultures. Deal with it.

Deep down 90% of these objections are from cheap Euros who don't like paying tips because they don't have to at home.

But giving you the benefit of the doubt I must admit I don't understand why tipping is so unpleasant for you. Most people get pleasure out of giving money to others, some even get pleasure from spending, so deep down I suspect the unpleasantness is just a reluctance to spend the money for something that you get for free in your home country. Be that as it may, you are certainly entitled to avoid tipping for whatever reason you like. Maybe you should find one of the restaurants where tips are already included in the bill before it arrives. Would that solve the problem?

I don't believe that at all.

Do you file a tax return? Do you take steps to maximise the amount you have to pay?

Do you buy your goods from the most expensive retailer you can find?

Lots of people try to spend the least amount of money they can, presumably why Wal-Mart is the US' most popular retailer.

Being under an obligation to hand over an additional few dollars to the taxi driver or to the restaurant is completely at odds with that natural desire to hang on to that which is yours.

Paying taxes which are confiscated by the government upon threat of imprisonment is quite a different feeling for me than paying a tip to someone who is paid minimum wage to serve my meal.

I don't shop walmart so I can't comment on that but I do feel good about spending my money at Target and Amazon and Safeway which at least provide health care to their employees

If your theory was universally applied, no one would give to charity or beggars. The fact that people do suggests they feel good about giving money under the right circumstances. Everyone I know feels good about tipping here - like I said it's a Euro thing.

The whole system is rotten, but nevertheless it is a system, and one that has real people at it's lowest rungs. These are people the OP will be interacting with, and some will provide OP with excellent service while others will not. If OP receives excellent service he should tip according to US standards. If he receives poor service, he should consider tipping below US standards or not at all.

Actually, I find OP's position to be a personal irritant. As someone with Eurasian heritage and a strong English accent, if I go out to a restaurant or interact with a hotel concierge in certain areas, like Orlando, FL for instance, I find that the service I get is generally not as good as that I would receive if I was perceived by staff as being a native (American) (You know what I mean). I am positive that this has something to do with people not familiar with the US either not tipping, or leaving a very small tip. My workaround is to remain silent and let my wife or business colleagues do all the talking.

The restaurant and bar/coffee-shop staff around Manhattan often complain about most Europeans not tipping them and they say that is why they serve visiting Americans and other known locals better than and before the visiting Europeans. These complaints often come from service staff who are immigrants themselves from many of those same European countries with which they have complaints.

Generally they are not really "cheap", as most of those non-tipping European visitors to the US are paying on average substantially more for the included service costs in their home market.

The reason that the US has the tipping culture we do is because the government allows so many employers to pay so many employees with sub-standard base pay and tell the employees that they may make it up with the variable pay element of tips, which customers may or may not provide. For employers, this creates a more flexible labor market. Whether or not tipping leads to better sub-employed employee performance overall or not is secondary to the financial benefit to business interests in being able to shift the risk of poor market demand for business services onto the employees of the business.

It seems like you are suggesting no matter good service or bad service we must tip !

Servers expect some give good tips, some give bad tips, some give no tips. If they don't like the way it is, they can move to another profession which has a regular salary.

We ought not to tip just because someone make their living off tips, only good service deserve a tip, and I should strentch that if someone don't give tip then the server provide bad service, that person should not even be in this industry.

Customer service jobs should never base on tipping regarding one in any kind of industry. It should view tipping as a bonus not requirement.

Geez just get with the program folks... tip low for bad service... tip okay for good service... tip high for good or better service. it it's truly awful don't tip but that really has to be bad. what's the big deal? make it a fun thing. tell you what buy some coins from the US mint... and actually put them into circulation by paying tips!!!

enough of the mr pink from reservoir dogs attitude!

i moved here from uk few years back and love the tipping culture... breeds good service... our local sushi place we had great service and i tipped generously... next time we went got the royal treatment... and i tipped well again... pretty much always tipped well. then got slightly dodgy service, i tipped less but still remembered the guy would be taking home nothing and maybe he was having a bad day.

like i say, if you don't like rome, you can stay at home.

I'm assuming you meant GoodFellas the movie?...No, that would be intimidation, but someone pointed that waiters and servers actually enter your information into a computer and remember you, so a good tip is leaves a good impression. :rolleyes:

you are not convincing... if it is something that is expected - call it a tax then.
btw-UK govt finally recognized this scam and bartenders and waiters are now (or will be soon) subject to the same minimum wages as the rest of the country (~£5 per hour).

I am sorry - are you suggesting I need management approval not to tip for unacceptable service? When I would find a reason to speak to the management due to poor service, I expect them to waive part of the cost - not an element which is SUPPOSED to reward good service.

AX