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Originally Posted by tsastor
(Post 12761130)
So you disagree with my strategy and feel that it is mandatory for tourists to frequent places requiring tipping even if alternatives exist?
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Originally Posted by ma91pmh
(Post 12756570)
... tip low for bad service...
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My problem with tipping in the US (I am American)? I never have cash. Not every transaction allows for tip information to be placed on a credit card receipt between authorization and final charge.
Ironically, I tend to carry cash when in Europe since credit card culture isn't as prevalent and there's often a minimum purchase requirement. And I almost never tip, falling in line with the local custom. Go figure. And FYI - only places I do tend to tip in Europe are pubs if I order food and receive table service - and then never more than 10%. In Australia I was happy to be able to use my card most of the time but still kept to the local custom of not really tipping. |
Originally Posted by tsastor
(Post 12759159)
It is not only a European thing - no one of my many friends in the U.S. seems to like tipping either or at least they think that it has gotten completely out of hand. :rolleyes:
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Originally Posted by Rambuster
(Post 12761422)
So bad service still gets a tip ? :eek:
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Originally Posted by seanthepilot
(Post 12737627)
A friend told me long ago that he coudln't afford to take his family out and tip too. He had the perfect answer, just as yours above, to only use services that didn't require tips. Brilliant creativity, saving money too
and yes yrs ago I myself held a number of those jobs and fully understood that No One was Required to Tip |
Originally Posted by Ichinensei
(Post 12738415)
i don't tip cabbies...i don't tip for breakfast. i don't tip housekeeping. i don't tip the bartender. And I ONLY tip if the restaurant did an excellent job - ie better than the ones in Japan - which in most cases, doesn't happen, so I don't normally tip the customary 15% or whatever. Waiters have to know that tips are like bonuses... They are not guaranteed.
If you can't bear to tip, please don't come to the U.S. and eat in a restaurant then. It's incredibly culturally insensitive to come to a country where tips are thought to be part of the waiter's/server's wages and not tip. As has been pointed out, servers in the U.S. are paid a minimum wage far below others (it's around iirc $2.55 an hour) AND are taxed on the tips they receive ...and if they claim far fewer tips than they've received (say, they've only served non-tippers like yourself) then the IRS can select them for review for tax fraud. The advantage of tipping is that U.S. restaurants are often cheaper than UK or European restaurants of similar quality, so by tipping, you are not paying MORE than you would in another culture, you are just bringing it up to par. |
Originally Posted by Boraxo
(Post 12760196)
Funny I don't find it insulting at all as I know that many Euro and Asian tourist types will stiff the waiters as they pretend to be unfamiliar with our tipping customs. In fact I find it more insulting that they don't tip. Must be your friends. Nobody I know here complains about tipping. But then we all got started in service jobs, so we do have some appreciation for the working stiffs. +100% on "complains about tipping" -- I know no one raised in the U.S. who complains about tipping at restaurants and I've lived in many different states and have been friends with people of varied socio-economic status. ==== I've had good and great service in some European and U.S. restaurants and occasionally bad service at other restaurants in Europe and the U.S. I'd say I've slightly more experiences with bad service in some casual European restaurants but ime, a country with tipping doesn't necessarily have better service. |
Originally Posted by SocietyFlyGirl
(Post 12763549)
:td: They are NOT like bonuses per U.S. law.
If you can't bear to tip, please don't come to the U.S. and eat in a restaurant then. It's incredibly culturally insensitive to come to a country where tips are thought to be part of the waiter's/server's wages and not tip. As has been pointed out, servers in the U.S. are paid a minimum wage far below others (it's around iirc $2.55 an hour) AND are taxed on the tips they receive ...and if they claim far fewer tips than they've received (say, they've only served non-tippers like yourself) then the IRS can select them for review for tax fraud. The advantage of tipping is that U.S. restaurants are often cheaper than UK or European restaurants of similar quality, so by tipping, you are not paying MORE than you would in another culture, you are just bringing it up to par. |
Originally Posted by SocietyFlyGirl
(Post 12763614)
+1 When I was a server during my college years, I had on occasion tables with Europeans, who I would chose to serve [instead of having another server take that table] -- I still remember one table of older Germans whom I'd provided extra service above and beyond -- who then proudly handed me their tip saying "here for you, you've been great" -- it was a dollar or two, far below even 15%!! Now, I know they thought they were being kind and tipping well, but if we'd had the amount of common tips on the bill, it would have saved them from severe undertipping....or devil's advocate, if I wasn't as good a server as I thought -- at least, if I knew that they KNEW it was undertipping, they couldn't have hid behind a lack of knowlege.
I wouldn't expect an insert in menus in the UK saying 'we've noticed you're American, to get the amount of food you're used to, order two entrees'. |
Originally Posted by LHR/MEL/Europe FF
(Post 12744552)
who was commenting on my statement of:
CousinNick - you mave misunderstood my post. I was making comment to a previous poster to me who had said, in essence, that Americans are expected to adapt to local customs, therefore foreigners should adapt to American customs. I was agreeing in part, but was making the point that most non-American customs (for example in respect of tipping) are far less onerous than the American equivalents. For example, it is very easy for an American to adapt to a 'please don't tip' culture than it is for a non-US person to have to adapt to a 'tip me at every possible moment' culture. Having read subsequent comment in this thread about how some workers are taxed as if they earn a minimum tip, my response to that is that sholdn't they should still earn it? If I am provided with bad or aggressive service to be forced to pay a tip I don't care whether you're taxed or not. And that supports my second part of my statement that we should only be required to adapt to customs which are good. Tipping when service is bad just perpetuates a sense of entitlement regardless of service provided. If the people stopped tipping just because they are forced to, then maybe service would improve to the point where we'd actually want to tip. Happy to discuss further :) regards lme ff But I do agree that you shouldn't have to tip for inferior service. |
I've seen, in places that get a lot of foreign tourists in the US, in particular, Orlando, big notes on the menu, or even the wall, about expected tips.
I remember, a few years ago, having to send back a steak in a steakhouse in Orlando and watching it sitting on a shelf next to the waitress for a couple of minutes, when it came back, while she chatted to a friend. When the bill came, she had written on it something like "My name is Arlene, it is customary to tip 20% in the USA"; I added "I know" and left one cent. |
Originally Posted by garethmorgan
(Post 12764182)
I've seen, in places that get a lot of foreign tourists in the US, in particular, Orlando, big notes on the menu, or even the wall, about expected tips.
I remember, a few years ago, having to send back a steak in a steakhouse in Orlando and watching it sitting on a shelf next to the waitress for a couple of minutes, when it came back, while she chatted to a friend. When the bill came, she had written on it something like "My name is Arlene, it is customary to tip 20% in the USA"; I added "I know" and left one cent. |
Originally Posted by garethmorgan
(Post 12764182)
I remember, a few years ago, having to send back a steak in a steakhouse in Orlando and watching it sitting on a shelf next to the waitress for a couple of minutes, when it came back, while she chatted to a friend.
When the bill came, she had written on it something like "My name is Arlene, it is customary to tip 20% in the USA"; I added "I know" and left one cent. But it's very rare. Most common form of bad service I experience is when a place is busy and you just don't get much attention - for that I'll tip low, not no. |
Originally Posted by garethmorgan
(Post 12764182)
When the bill came, she had written on it something like "My name is Arlene, it is customary to tip 20% in the USA"
I wonder, though. There must have been items on the menu that had different prices. Perhaps the bowl of tomato soup didn't cost as much as the sirloin steak. Would Arlene have carried the steak more carefully, though, to justify the higher tip she was earning? Just a hunch, but I imagine Arlene actually takes more time and trouble when carrying the soup. |
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