Mar 25, 2018, 4:42 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
Word is out on another site (not my post) regarding a company memo about the May 1 "enhancements".
Some key points:
- Return of the salad/appetizer cart, although I suspect it's just going to be the meal cart with a fancy cover, to reduce the number of galley trips with hand-run trays
- Beverage carts coming back to the aisle (similar to DL and the former 3-cabin sUA business class service) with branded cart covers
- Soup is gone in Polaris First (so no more differentiation; the product isn't expected to last the full year, anyway)
- Wine tasting arches are gone
- No bloody mary carts (already announced)
- Hot bites will stay
- Bread refills to be offered (return of the bread basket?)
- Pre-departure chocolates returned to the pre-arrival tray
In many ways, this is going to look like the former three-cabin BusinessFirst service with nicer linens and serviceware. Overall, not the sweeping change (or depth of cuts) I was expecting. No word on provisioning of the other items (gel pillows, mattress pads, slippers, PJs, etc.)
POLARIS SERVICE ENHANCEMENTS
Frequently Asked Questions
1. When do the service updates go into effect?
A: The service updates are effective May 1, 2018, on all long-haul international flights.
2. Why are we making changes to our United Polaris® service?
A: Customers have positively received our United Polaris lounge, and this year we are opening more United Polaris lounges beginning this summer in San Francisco, Houston and New York/Newark and in the fall, Los Angeles. As we continue to add more lounges, we want to take into account the feedback that customers have given us — they’ve emphasized their desire to rest and relax during their journey, especially onboard. The updates to the service flow will allow us to continue providing a premium product with high-quality food, wine, amenities and more, but it’ll be delivered in a more efficient way.
3. What is the new international United Polaris meal service flow?
A: The meal service flow for both first and business class will be the same:
Pre-departure
• Pre-poured sparkling wine, orange juice and water offered from a silver tray, with other beverages available upon request.
Main meal service
• Hot towels
• Linen placement
• Pre-meal beverage cart
• Appetizer and salad cart
• Bread and beverage refills
• Entrées
• Bread and beverage refills
• Dessert and pre-plated cheese cart
• Individual water bottles with hang tags
Mid-flight service (when applicable)
• Display mid-flight snacks on console, self-service unit, fold-down trays or galley countertop.
• Heat and serve hot on-demand items (when applicable) upon customer request.
Pre-arrival service
• Hot towels
• Pre-arrival tray setup with entrée and choice of beverage
• Breads and pastries
4. Will we be able to offer other pre-departure beverages?
A: Yes, upon customer request fulfill other pre-departure beverages in accordance with each departure country’s pre-departure liquor procedures. Refer to the Flight Attendant Policies and Procedures Manual to determine if you are allowed to open beverage carts/carriers that contain alcohol on the ground.
5. Is there still a chocolate offered during pre-departure?
A: Pre-departure chocolates/dessert will be catered on the pre-arrival tray instead for customers to enjoy during or after their flight.
6. What’s changing with the Bloody Mary and wine specialty beverage carts?
A: Wines and Bloody Marys will continue to be available upon request, but the dedicated cart service will change. This was a common flight attendant suggestion for improvement. A new branded cart cover is being sourced to improve presentation in the aisle and will be available shortly after launch.
7. Can we still offer wine tastings?
A: Absolutely. Although the wine arches with the 3 tastings will not be boarded, we can continue to honor customers’ requests to sample select wines.
8. What about the United Polaris first class soup and salad course?
A: The salad and appetizer will be delivered at the same time on a tray setup, instead of having a soup course.
9. What about the turndown service?
A: We will continue to offer the turndown service upon request.
10. Will Express Dining continue to be offered?
A: Yes, Express Dining will continue to be offered and can be requested and delivered at any point during the flight.
11. Will we continue to offer the mini desserts and fruit and cheese?
A: The mini desserts will continue to be offered from the three-tier cart with the signature ice cream service. In addition, pre-plated cheese will be added to the dessert cart. To make room for the fruit and cheese on the dessert cart, the specialty tea box will be removed from the cart, although specialty teas will continue to be available from the galley.
12. Are there any updates to the mid-flight and pre-arrival services?
A: There will be a few updates to both the mid-flight and pre-arrival service.
Mid-flight service (when available) – While we’ll no longer have formal presentation of mid-flight snacks, snack provisioning levels will remain the same and will continue to be displayed near the galley as is done today. Hang tags advising the customers that mid-flight snacks are available will be added to the individual bottle waters distributed after the main meal service. Hot snack items, when available, will also be delivered upon request.
Pre-arrival service – We’re removing tray table linens to reduce trips through the aisle. The tray itself will continue to have a linen liner. The pre-departure chocolate/dessert will be catered on the pre-arrival tray for customers to enjoy during or after the flight.
13. Will there be any new service items introduced to support the new United Polaris service?
A: Yes, there are a few new elements that will be introduced, including:
Cart covers – Similar to some of our competitors, branded cart covers for both the half and full carts will be boarded for use in the aisle on both the beverage and meal tray carts. Cart covers will be available shortly after launch.
Hang tags – To be placed on individual bottle waters at the end of the main meal service to advise customers that mid-flight snacks are available.
14. Will we be changing the domestic meal service procedures to align with the new United Polaris service (e.g. pre-poured pre-departure beverages)?
A: We will continue listening to the feedback of our customers and our flight attendants and will adjust our processes where necessary to deliver the best service for our customers.
Frequently Asked Questions
1. When do the service updates go into effect?
A: The service updates are effective May 1, 2018, on all long-haul international flights.
2. Why are we making changes to our United Polaris® service?
A: Customers have positively received our United Polaris lounge, and this year we are opening more United Polaris lounges beginning this summer in San Francisco, Houston and New York/Newark and in the fall, Los Angeles. As we continue to add more lounges, we want to take into account the feedback that customers have given us — they’ve emphasized their desire to rest and relax during their journey, especially onboard. The updates to the service flow will allow us to continue providing a premium product with high-quality food, wine, amenities and more, but it’ll be delivered in a more efficient way.
3. What is the new international United Polaris meal service flow?
A: The meal service flow for both first and business class will be the same:
Pre-departure
• Pre-poured sparkling wine, orange juice and water offered from a silver tray, with other beverages available upon request.
Main meal service
• Hot towels
• Linen placement
• Pre-meal beverage cart
• Appetizer and salad cart
• Bread and beverage refills
• Entrées
• Bread and beverage refills
• Dessert and pre-plated cheese cart
• Individual water bottles with hang tags
Mid-flight service (when applicable)
• Display mid-flight snacks on console, self-service unit, fold-down trays or galley countertop.
• Heat and serve hot on-demand items (when applicable) upon customer request.
Pre-arrival service
• Hot towels
• Pre-arrival tray setup with entrée and choice of beverage
• Breads and pastries
4. Will we be able to offer other pre-departure beverages?
A: Yes, upon customer request fulfill other pre-departure beverages in accordance with each departure country’s pre-departure liquor procedures. Refer to the Flight Attendant Policies and Procedures Manual to determine if you are allowed to open beverage carts/carriers that contain alcohol on the ground.
5. Is there still a chocolate offered during pre-departure?
A: Pre-departure chocolates/dessert will be catered on the pre-arrival tray instead for customers to enjoy during or after their flight.
6. What’s changing with the Bloody Mary and wine specialty beverage carts?
A: Wines and Bloody Marys will continue to be available upon request, but the dedicated cart service will change. This was a common flight attendant suggestion for improvement. A new branded cart cover is being sourced to improve presentation in the aisle and will be available shortly after launch.
7. Can we still offer wine tastings?
A: Absolutely. Although the wine arches with the 3 tastings will not be boarded, we can continue to honor customers’ requests to sample select wines.
8. What about the United Polaris first class soup and salad course?
A: The salad and appetizer will be delivered at the same time on a tray setup, instead of having a soup course.
9. What about the turndown service?
A: We will continue to offer the turndown service upon request.
10. Will Express Dining continue to be offered?
A: Yes, Express Dining will continue to be offered and can be requested and delivered at any point during the flight.
11. Will we continue to offer the mini desserts and fruit and cheese?
A: The mini desserts will continue to be offered from the three-tier cart with the signature ice cream service. In addition, pre-plated cheese will be added to the dessert cart. To make room for the fruit and cheese on the dessert cart, the specialty tea box will be removed from the cart, although specialty teas will continue to be available from the galley.
12. Are there any updates to the mid-flight and pre-arrival services?
A: There will be a few updates to both the mid-flight and pre-arrival service.
Mid-flight service (when available) – While we’ll no longer have formal presentation of mid-flight snacks, snack provisioning levels will remain the same and will continue to be displayed near the galley as is done today. Hang tags advising the customers that mid-flight snacks are available will be added to the individual bottle waters distributed after the main meal service. Hot snack items, when available, will also be delivered upon request.
Pre-arrival service – We’re removing tray table linens to reduce trips through the aisle. The tray itself will continue to have a linen liner. The pre-departure chocolate/dessert will be catered on the pre-arrival tray for customers to enjoy during or after the flight.
13. Will there be any new service items introduced to support the new United Polaris service?
A: Yes, there are a few new elements that will be introduced, including:
Cart covers – Similar to some of our competitors, branded cart covers for both the half and full carts will be boarded for use in the aisle on both the beverage and meal tray carts. Cart covers will be available shortly after launch.
Hang tags – To be placed on individual bottle waters at the end of the main meal service to advise customers that mid-flight snacks are available.
14. Will we be changing the domestic meal service procedures to align with the new United Polaris service (e.g. pre-poured pre-departure beverages)?
A: We will continue listening to the feedback of our customers and our flight attendants and will adjust our processes where necessary to deliver the best service for our customers.
- Return of the salad/appetizer cart, although I suspect it's just going to be the meal cart with a fancy cover, to reduce the number of galley trips with hand-run trays
- Beverage carts coming back to the aisle (similar to DL and the former 3-cabin sUA business class service) with branded cart covers
- Soup is gone in Polaris First (so no more differentiation; the product isn't expected to last the full year, anyway)
- Wine tasting arches are gone
- No bloody mary carts (already announced)
- Hot bites will stay
- Bread refills to be offered (return of the bread basket?)
- Pre-departure chocolates returned to the pre-arrival tray
In many ways, this is going to look like the former three-cabin BusinessFirst service with nicer linens and serviceware. Overall, not the sweeping change (or depth of cuts) I was expecting. No word on provisioning of the other items (gel pillows, mattress pads, slippers, PJs, etc.)
[Rumor] More Polaris "Enhancements" coming May 1, 2018? ...
Feb 9, 2018, 10:34 am
#121
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
Although the seat is no where near budget airline, if they keep making cuts, the experience will be significantly degraded, and I think I and others will be wondering why we'd pay a premium for it.
Certainly the seat is important, but there is also a point where it's not worth the higher cost, especially if one is paying with one's own money/miles. But I guess they're after the less price-sensitive business market!
Certainly the seat is important, but there is also a point where it's not worth the higher cost, especially if one is paying with one's own money/miles. But I guess they're after the less price-sensitive business market!
And to the extent that there is traffic that does not care about costs, well they usually care about quality of service, and a bunch of MileageMinus miles are not going to make up for UA's shortcomings. To give an e.g. a friend of mine works for one of the two us major oil companies and can fly J on any airline she wants. She travels at lot, all in J (to overseas sites) and switched from UA (and partners) to AF (and partners) back in 2013. She got tired of sub-par product, awful food/wine, particularity the lack of decent coffee, and lack of decent lounges. Her tickets are not cheap (usually $10K+/trip). There is no way that United is ever going to compete for this type of traffic with its sucky service. And I think she is a good example of how one needs to appeal to a broad market. She is only 5'4" so the main concerns I have (too short of seats) is not an issue for her, she is laser focused on decent F/B + showers/food in lounges upon arrival at the connection points.
United is going to keep losing "unmanaged" traffic with its poor offerings.
Feb 9, 2018, 10:38 am
#122
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
As of now, it's just the bloody mary/wine cart at the start of the service. Drinks will be hand-run and the special "bloody mary bar" will be eliminated. I suspect the trays for the wine flights will also be eliminated but do not have any confirmation on that. Wine consumption was way up with greater merchandising of choices, so naturally, the cost-cutting approach leads to the service being pulled.
You couldn't make up this stuff.
Feb 9, 2018, 10:40 am
#123
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York, NY
Programs: UA, AA, DL, Hertz, Avis, National, Hyatt, Hilton, SPG, Marriott
Posts: 9,454
^^^. Pre-Illy, this was a criminal move. At least the regular coffee is drinkable now. I was hopeful the Illy partnership would lead to the machines being reactivated/installed on the rest of the fleet, with one of my favorite espresso roasts, but no dice.
Feb 9, 2018, 10:44 am
#124
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
What they're spending on Polaris wine and spirits is not material relative to United's $11 Billion wage and salary expense. Five seconds with an income statement could show you that.
Feb 9, 2018, 10:47 am
#125
Join Date: Oct 2009
Programs: UA 1K, Hilton ♦ , Hyatt Carbonado, Wyndham ♦, Marriott PE, "Stinking Bum" elsewhere.
Posts: 5,000
Maybe UA is targeting their service reductions to pax like me.
Even on 14 hour TPACs, I skip the pre-arrival meal. Why eat airplane food when I can get dinner in Hong Kong by waiting two more hours?
I do appreciate the hot snacks midflight though, and always looked forward to the noodle soup. I'd rather see UA cut the pre-arrival meal and upgrade the midflight snack.
I do appreciate the hot snacks midflight though, and always looked forward to the noodle soup. I'd rather see UA cut the pre-arrival meal and upgrade the midflight snack.
Last edited by zombietooth; Feb 9, 2018 at 10:52 am
Feb 9, 2018, 10:51 am
#126
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ORD
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 16,901
Although the seat is no where near budget airline, if they keep making cuts, the experience will be significantly degraded, and I think I and others will be wondering why we'd pay a premium for it.
Certainly the seat is important, but there is also a point where it's not worth the higher cost, especially if one is paying with one's own money/miles. But I guess they're after the less price-sensitive business market!
Certainly the seat is important, but there is also a point where it's not worth the higher cost, especially if one is paying with one's own money/miles. But I guess they're after the less price-sensitive business market!
While I like the Turkish service, I find their cabins way too hot and their J seats too short. I don't really care about food, drinks and service. I just want to get to my destination comfortably and be able to sleep during the flight. I can pick the UA bulkhead seats to get the longer versions and thus, be more comfortable than on TK, BR or SQ (haven't flown Emirates).
Maybe UA is targeting their service reductions to pax like me.
^I have never once in my flying career eaten the pre-arrival meal.
Maybe UA is targeting their service reductions to pax like me.
^I have never once in my flying career eaten the pre-arrival meal.
I'm actually a fan of the LOT 787 experience and fly via Warsaw every change I get. The food is actually good, they board the nice wines that the menu says they have, service is pleasant, seats are great. Amenities like seat covers are actually provided without having to ask. And you can't beat the price. A bonus is that Warsaw is a dream airport for transfers, and when I was late landing one time there was someone waiting at the gate to help me who walked me through a back way to my next gate.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Feb 10, 2018 at 2:07 am Reason: merging consecutive posts by same member
Feb 9, 2018, 10:59 am
#127
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 553
United is not getting a "premium" in any respect at this point. Its rack rates are not usually lower than OALs, but it offers very large (up to 50%, and someone posted here their corporate discount was more than 60% off rack rates in J) discounts for "managed" traffic.
And to the extent that there is traffic that does not care about costs, well they usually care about quality of service, and a bunch of MileageMinus miles are not going to make up for UA's shortcomings. To give an e.g. a friend of mine works for one of the two us major oil companies and can fly J on any airline she wants. She travels at lot, all in J (to overseas sites) and switched from UA (and partners) to AF (and partners) back in 2013. She got tired of sub-par product, awful food/wine, particularity the lack of decent coffee, and lack of decent lounges. Her tickets are not cheap (usually $10K+/trip). There is no way that United is ever going to compete for this type of traffic with its sucky service. And I think she is a good example of how one needs to appeal to a broad market. She is only 5'4" so the main concerns I have (too short of seats) is not an issue for her, she is laser focused on decent F/B + showers/food in lounges upon arrival at the connection points.
United is going to keep losing "unmanaged" traffic with its poor offerings.
And to the extent that there is traffic that does not care about costs, well they usually care about quality of service, and a bunch of MileageMinus miles are not going to make up for UA's shortcomings. To give an e.g. a friend of mine works for one of the two us major oil companies and can fly J on any airline she wants. She travels at lot, all in J (to overseas sites) and switched from UA (and partners) to AF (and partners) back in 2013. She got tired of sub-par product, awful food/wine, particularity the lack of decent coffee, and lack of decent lounges. Her tickets are not cheap (usually $10K+/trip). There is no way that United is ever going to compete for this type of traffic with its sucky service. And I think she is a good example of how one needs to appeal to a broad market. She is only 5'4" so the main concerns I have (too short of seats) is not an issue for her, she is laser focused on decent F/B + showers/food in lounges upon arrival at the connection points.
United is going to keep losing "unmanaged" traffic with its poor offerings.
And completely agree: just because someone is relatively insensitive to price does not mean they don't care about the service. (In fact, quite the opposite in my experience.) On a lot of international routes, there's plenty of competition, and if one has no corporate contract and is paying $5-8k+ for J/F, I would certainly look closely at other options if they cut much more.
Feb 9, 2018, 11:01 am
#128
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2002
Location: NC
Programs: AAConciergeKey/1MM, DL DM/2 MM, UA Gold,Hilton Diamond, IHG Plat, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 11,980
just flew Sydney to Houston. Hot bites were available, but offered with a lot of eye rolls. From the moment I ordered it, it took 2 hours and 37 minutes to be delivered. I timed it.
Feb 9, 2018, 11:13 am
#129
Join Date: Oct 2009
Programs: UA 1K, Hilton ♦ , Hyatt Carbonado, Wyndham ♦, Marriott PE, "Stinking Bum" elsewhere.
Posts: 5,000
I'm not a big fan of TK. The service actually isn't all that great, and the J seats are the worst semi-lie-flat seats I've even been in. Horrible. Ground service is hopelessly inept, onboard is better but not world class.
I'm actually a fan of the LOT 787 experience and fly via Warsaw every change I get. The food is actually good, they board the nice wines that the menu says they have, service is pleasant, seats are great. Amenities like seat covers are actually provided without having to ask. And you can't beat the price. A bonus is that Warsaw is a dream airport for transfers, and when I was late landing one time there was someone waiting at the gate to help me who walked me through a back way to my next gate.
I'm actually a fan of the LOT 787 experience and fly via Warsaw every change I get. The food is actually good, they board the nice wines that the menu says they have, service is pleasant, seats are great. Amenities like seat covers are actually provided without having to ask. And you can't beat the price. A bonus is that Warsaw is a dream airport for transfers, and when I was late landing one time there was someone waiting at the gate to help me who walked me through a back way to my next gate.
Feb 9, 2018, 11:15 am
#130
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: SFO/SJC
Programs: UA 1K & 2MM, Bonvoy Titanium & LTP, HH Gold, Accor Silver, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 2,350
Just try the spicy omelette once and you might change your habits!
Until today, I thought I was the most easy-going and patient passenger any airline could hope for. I surrender any claim to that title.
Feb 9, 2018, 11:45 am
#131
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC: UA 1K, DL Platinum, AAirpass, Avis PC
Posts: 4,599
To be clear - the other US majors - AA and DL also offer very large discounts for managed corporate traffic. Have for decades.
Feb 9, 2018, 11:57 am
#132
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,324
Although the seat is no where near budget airline, if they keep making cuts, the experience will be significantly degraded, and I think I and others will be wondering why we'd pay a premium for it.
Certainly the seat is important, but there is also a point where it's not worth the higher cost, especially if one is paying with one's own money/miles. But I guess they're after the less price-sensitive business market!
Certainly the seat is important, but there is also a point where it's not worth the higher cost, especially if one is paying with one's own money/miles. But I guess they're after the less price-sensitive business market!
The on-board soft-product is still broadly competitive worldwide. I'd argue it's better than some like BA, AF, QF and even OZ.
Venture outside of this forum on FT and you'll see a lot of similar proclamations about how each respective airline is going to drive away all traffic because of stuff like changes to the cheese platter...This extends to the SQ, CX, and LX forums, by the way.
No question, but it is obvious the momentum has shifted from a mode of improving (actually "enhancing") the customer experience to a cutback-oriented regime. These are low-hanging fruits, but as fuel continues to rise and the company is under pressure to control CASM/expand margins while revenue growth is slower than competitors, what's next?
As Orange says, "we'll see what happens".
Material increases to the company's YOY expenses related to new joint labor agreements, along fuel prices that are expected to climb means low hanging fruit, as it was previously termed, can be easy and irresistible targets. Whether management sticks with this playbook is another question. Now, five seconds reminiscing the last five years could have shown you that.
Last edited by tuolumne; Feb 9, 2018 at 12:10 pm
Feb 9, 2018, 11:57 am
#133
Join Date: Nov 2012
Programs: BA Bronze, United 1K, HH Gold, SPG Platinum, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 3,477
Feb 9, 2018, 12:42 pm
#135
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York, NY
Programs: UA, AA, DL, Hertz, Avis, National, Hyatt, Hilton, SPG, Marriott
Posts: 9,454
I'd actually argue that the optics for them from the broad base of flyers outside of blogs and Flyertalk will be positive this year - new clubs are opening, and the retrofit pace is picking up steam. This is what really matters, in the end.
As Orange says, "we'll see what happens".
As Orange says, "we'll see what happens".
I'm very interested to see how (or if) the Polaris Lounge product is diluted when the first non-ORD location opens, which will be approximately 18 months after the original.