cerealmarketer

And the years it made money were the years Delta was running all-coach Song aircraft and Virgin America had not yet launched.

It's no longer the duopoly it was from 2004-2007.

ijgordon

Well, come on, I wouldn't call Brooklyn in "proximity" to EWR, you have to cross two bodies of water, and that's a lot of potential choke points. From WTC, however, it's certainly easier to EWR than to JFK by car (and if they extend PATH even to the AirTrain, that would be competitive with MTA to JFK), but clearly living in Brooklyn strongly tips the balance to JFK. Understandable.

Actually, I live not too far north of Columbus Circle. Late-nights are meant for a car service ($60-70, not $90), and it's zip-zip, 20-25 minutes, as fast as LGA from the UWS. And if you wanted public transport, there's this thing called the Newark Airport Express Bus to the Port Authority that was every 15-20 minutes, probably even better than late-night AirTrain to LIRR where frequencies aren't great either.

I haven't flown UA since they merged rez systems (was former loyal CO flyer) and thus have only been to EWR maybe 2-3 times in the last few years, but it really wasn't a bad option from the UWS.

jamesinclair

Theres absolutely stuff going on behind the scenes with this.

My bet: No PATH extension, but youll see the new Aitrain monorail extended to Newark Penn (ie, the current one demolished and replaced with a 35mph version).

Remember the Atlantic City debacle? United is in deep with the PANY crony brigade.

Owenc

What transatlantic routes will be cancelled then?

jamesinclair

Heres an angle that might be thrown in:

Amtrak.

Right now, very few Amtrak trains stop at EWR, but they do offer United codeshare to Philly and Stamford.

What if United cooks up a deal with Amtrak to get more people ticketed straight into New York Penn?

Amtrak goes between EWR and NYP 5-10 minutes faster than NJT, and does so with significantly more room for baggage.

As long as the schedules make sense, it would be many times easier than JFK, and dont even try and suggest that the business flyer would rather a yellow cab than an Amtrak.

haddon90

i don't mind the layover...and since i'm at SNA (i know there is the EWR-SNA flight), i actually like breaking the trip up via ORD/DEN. LGA is just so much more convenient.

cestmoi123

While it would be an improvement over NJT+Airtrain, I can easily see a business traveler preferring a single seat "office to terminal" cab or car service ride to a "taxi/subway to Penn Station, Amtrak to EWR stop, Airtrain to terminal" ride.

I would probably go with the public transport routes during the business day, since I value predictability, but I know I'm in the minority of my colleagues.

Bonehead

This might be a better link:

http://www.gothamair.com/

Right now (6 PM EDT) Google maps is showing 1:13 to EWR and 1:04 to JFK from 121 W 41st in Midtown.

If you live in Queens or points east it's a different story.

ijgordon

Fair enough, though I don't think it's just the midtown east law firms that drive this business. Bankers, while often passing through expenses, don't charge clients by the hour, and still adhere to corporate policies (with exceptions when flying WITH clients...).

ACVBear

the problem there is schedule. now i know NYC is better than New Haven for amtrak but still, I'll often look at trips with EWR and think, great, i'll amtrak to EWR, and fly out, then i look at the amtrak schedule and think, never mind I'll drive and park.

jamesinclair

But thats only now because most Amtrak trains skip EWR. Theres dozens more that go by without stopping. Never mind NJT that skips EWR during peak hours as well.

With proper coordination, tied in with the premium service arrival and departure times, United could work with Amtrak to get the right trains stopping at EWR at the right times.

One barrier: The 90 minute " transfer". From my experience booking the Amtrak connection, youre not allowed to book a train that arrives in EWR less than 90 minutes before departure, even though you can get from train to gate in 30 minutes.

If that illogical bureaucratic detail is eliminated, and the schedules are coordinated, it's a whole new story.

If.

Lots of ifs.

Of course I'm assuming someone at United gives a damn about things like the customer.


Incidentally, in another fantasy world where companies and agencies coordinate...

Most NJT trains actually terminate in Queens - but dont allow people to ride there. If they offered through service and picked up riders in Jamaica, that whole pesky Brooklyn/Queens inconvenience thing flies out the window.

Indelaware

It is not that people on the west coast dislike EWR, it is people that dislike EWR dislike EWR. I am on the west coast. I like EWR. I can’t stand JFK – even more than I can’t stand LGA.

UA seems to be able to change station profits into losses overnight. Just look what they did to CLE. They decided they didn’t want to be there, they decided to restructure things to make losses there. Some thing, no doubt, at JFK.

Nonsense. EWR to Manhattan is an easy train ride. Shorter than the train from JFK.

Enough. You may not have liked CO, but it was a top notch airline and largely flew to the same airports at UA. Attack J.S., not one of the two airlines he brought down. We have had enough of the UA CO infighting.

That said, IMO, JFK is a 34d rate airport – along with LGA. Not so for EWR.

Who would connect at JFK onto a *A airline? Few. It is so much better to connect at EWR, ORD, or IAH. Or if one is going TPAC, at SFO.

I use EWR when I need to go to Queens/Brooklyn. I quick train ride to Penn Station, a quick hot dog, and then another quick train ride to Queens/Brooklyn; far better than having to deal with ugly and inefficient JFK or LGA and the unfortunate staffs there.

It is there loss – and their employers loss – if they aren’t using public transit. Most people, travelling on business, however aren’t working for firms with deep pockets – they are taking the train. Others ride in blue Super Shuttle vans.

Except, anyone going TPAC is going to connect at EWR, ORD, SFO, or LAX – surely not at JFK. Perhaps the only *A that will be hurt by this is MS.

No one ever needs to take a taxi. That is a choice. Really, where in NYC can’t one get by public transit?

I think it may be more likely that TK will add IST-EWR to its present IST-JFK offerings – if they want to grow TK-UA connecting traffic. They certainly had none – or close to none – at JFK. Those connecting TK-UA have been doing so at ORD & other stations.

Really, just how many people from other countries transit JFK en-route to LAX or SFO? Why wouldn’t they connect at ORD or just fly non-stop to SFO/LAX?

OAK isn’t bad. EWR isn’t bad. But JFK is an armpit with nasty employees there – do you forget that they are New Yorkers? Not so much at EWR.

UA doesn’t care about its employees. The ones at JFK will be offered positions at LGA and EWR, no doubt; others might transfer to ORD. But don’t worry – its not that they don’t care about employees at JFK. They don’t care about the ones at EWR or anywhere else either. They only care about senior management and short term stock changes. Not the employees, not the customers, and certainly not their long term growth.

Transcons at LGA would violate the perimeter rule. However, though there may be room for more LGA-DEN-SFO & LGA-DEN-LAX direct flights, even ones without scheduled equipment changes.

Perhaps it is that JFK is symbolic for airlines that like old, dumpy, ugly, inefficient airports and those New Yorkers who think they need a passport to cross the Hudson. Those on the cutting edge go to EWR.

fly18725

I think this describes the strategy of the US network carriers and Southwest in recent years (with the exception of Delta's expansion in Seattle, which is no consolation to the people in CVG and MEM).

AA, DL and B6 have no other option than JFK. That's why they're sticking it out even though financials on the routes have deteriorated for everyone. United, on the other hand, has a good alternative.

Pi7473000

Wow! THat is too bad! EWR is far from premium and the UA clubs there are dated and have poor service! I used UA from JFK to NRT and London in the 1990s and CA in the 2000s when they had 3 class service. It is too bad to see the new United become less premium all the time. United to New York for me is not an option now with them only serving 2 out of the 3 airports and their tiny LGA presence. EWR is not an airport I like to use for NYC travel. I guess American and JetBlue are the only premium airlines to NYC. This would be like UA leaving LHR in England. Thanks for the great service to JFK over the years United Airlines! UA used to be the airline for transcontinental travel to NEw York!

NJMichigan

I for one think this is a positive. I am actually writing this from the afternoon PS SFO-JFK. I fly in J and tickets can be very hard to get last minute. I was actually checking the app frequently this AM, waiting for something to open up, and had my admin book it immediately.

I am in finance and work in Midtown. My experience is that from the office, most of my colleagues are agnostic on JFK vs EWR. However, the NYC airport is much more important relative to your home. I may be biased as a Hoboken resident, but this is fantastic.