Mar 12, 2015, 5:52 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
Initial announcement thread - 2015 MileagePlus Change - RDMs Will Be Calculated by Spend, Not Distance
Update 2019 -- includes all partner flights on 016 ticket
for non-016 ticket , see Earning Status (PQP) on non-016 Tickets and Partner Metal
Spend-based mileage (RDM) earning for all UA metal flights effective March 1, 2015.
Redeemable Miles (RDM) changes highlights:
Multipliers based on Premier status: & (breakeven CPM)
For example, a 1K would earn 1100 miles for a $100 ticket while a Silver would earn 700 miles for the same ticket.
Note that for itineraries which span the March 1 changeover date, the existing scheme will apply to any segment departing prior to March 1 , the new scheme will apply to the segments departing March 1 or after.
Appears no extra mileage for using a Chase MP card than the standard card mileage earning
As there is a maximum number of miles per ticket earned - this disincentives purchasing any ticket (excluding government taxes and fees) over the following:
A way to avoid this is booking one-ways if the fare rules permit.
Premier Qualifying Miles (PQM) are not affected by this change.
Announcement Sitewww.mileageplusupdates.com
There is a tool on the site that allow you to enter how much you spent on a ticket along your premier status in order to calculate how many miles you will earn under the new system. The tool is aware of the miles per ticket limit.
There is a FAQ here: http://mileageplusupdates.com/faq.html
Relevant UA Insider posts:
Post 57: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/23008349-post57.html
Answered Questions:
Class of service bonuses have been discontinued under the new system. There is already an adjustment for 1K over general members.
For tickets that will earn award miles based on ticket price, the class-of-service bonus and Premier bonus will be included in the number of award miles you earn per dollar. Basically COS has been removed.
E-mail received by GS lists 1K and GS together.
Unanswered Questions:
Unknown, but the FAQ indicates that all UA and UAx flights issued by ANY airline would be subjected to the new earning rates. There are exceptions (group tickets, bulk tickets, etc) like "Specialty Tickets" as mentioned below.
It is mentioned in the FAQ: If applicable, Premier bonus award miles will be based on a member’s Premier status and the lower of the distance flown or miles awarded, per the chart above. Basically the bonus miles will be awarded but based on the lower number (i.e. distance flown for higher fares or the % based on fare). A 1K passenger purchasing F-fare from EWR-SFO would get only a 2565 mile bonus while a N-fare would get (50% of 2565) 1283 mile bonus. Still unclear what are the percentage bonus of each premier level but assume that it is the same (100% GS/1K, 75% Plat, 50% Gold, 25% Silver).
Specialty Tickets:
Update 2019 -- includes all partner flights on 016 ticket
for non-016 ticket , see Earning Status (PQP) on non-016 Tickets and Partner Metal
Spend-based mileage (RDM) earning for all UA metal flights effective March 1, 2015.
Redeemable Miles (RDM) changes highlights:
- Miles earned will now be based on the ticket price instead of the number of miles flown
- Ticket price is defined as base fare plus carrier-imposed surcharges (PQD)
- Class of service bonuses have been discontinued (e.g. X% more on A fares).
- There is a limit of 75,000 miles earned per ticket (see below for spending limits by status)
Multipliers based on Premier status: & (breakeven CPM)
- x5 General Members -- (20 cpm)
- x7 Silver -- (17.86 cpm)
- x8 Gold -- (18.75 cpm)
- x9 Plat -- (19.44 cpm)
- x11 1K/GS -- (18.18 cpm)
For example, a 1K would earn 1100 miles for a $100 ticket while a Silver would earn 700 miles for the same ticket.
Note that for itineraries which span the March 1 changeover date, the existing scheme will apply to any segment departing prior to March 1 , the new scheme will apply to the segments departing March 1 or after.
Appears no extra mileage for using a Chase MP card than the standard card mileage earning
As there is a maximum number of miles per ticket earned - this disincentives purchasing any ticket (excluding government taxes and fees) over the following:
- $6818.18 for 1K/GS
- $8333.33 for Platinum
- $9375.00 for Gold
- $10714.28 for Silver
- $15000.00 for General Members
A way to avoid this is booking one-ways if the fare rules permit.
Premier Qualifying Miles (PQM) are not affected by this change.
Announcement Sitewww.mileageplusupdates.com
There is a tool on the site that allow you to enter how much you spent on a ticket along your premier status in order to calculate how many miles you will earn under the new system. The tool is aware of the miles per ticket limit.
There is a FAQ here: http://mileageplusupdates.com/faq.html
Relevant UA Insider posts:
Post 57: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/23008349-post57.html
Hi everyone,
Today we’re announcing changes to how MileagePlus members will earn award miles in 2015. We’ve posted complete details and a FAQ on united.com, but I wanted to share an excerpt of the key points with you directly:
As of March 1, 2015, the award miles you earn on most United and United Express tickets will be based on your ticket price (that is, base fare plus carrier-imposed surcharges) and your MileagePlus status, instead of the distance you travel. The new criteria for earning award miles will look like this:
<portion removed for brevity>
The changes to earning award miles will apply to all MileagePlus members worldwide, and will be based on status at the time of flight on or after March 1, 2015. These changes will not affect the qualification requirements for 2015 Premier status. PQM and PQS will still be based on the number of paid flight miles traveled and the fare purchased. And where applicable, PQD will still be determined by the base fare and carrier-imposed surcharges.
As mentioned above, there are more details and a FAQ posted online, and over the next few days we’ll be communicating this information to our members.
Today we’re announcing changes to how MileagePlus members will earn award miles in 2015. We’ve posted complete details and a FAQ on united.com, but I wanted to share an excerpt of the key points with you directly:
As of March 1, 2015, the award miles you earn on most United and United Express tickets will be based on your ticket price (that is, base fare plus carrier-imposed surcharges) and your MileagePlus status, instead of the distance you travel. The new criteria for earning award miles will look like this:
<portion removed for brevity>
The changes to earning award miles will apply to all MileagePlus members worldwide, and will be based on status at the time of flight on or after March 1, 2015. These changes will not affect the qualification requirements for 2015 Premier status. PQM and PQS will still be based on the number of paid flight miles traveled and the fare purchased. And where applicable, PQD will still be determined by the base fare and carrier-imposed surcharges.
As mentioned above, there are more details and a FAQ posted online, and over the next few days we’ll be communicating this information to our members.
Unanswered Questions:
It is mentioned in the FAQ: If applicable, Premier bonus award miles will be based on a member’s Premier status and the lower of the distance flown or miles awarded, per the chart above. Basically the bonus miles will be awarded but based on the lower number (i.e. distance flown for higher fares or the % based on fare). A 1K passenger purchasing F-fare from EWR-SFO would get only a 2565 mile bonus while a N-fare would get (50% of 2565) 1283 mile bonus. Still unclear what are the percentage bonus of each premier level but assume that it is the same (100% GS/1K, 75% Plat, 50% Gold, 25% Silver).
Specialty Tickets:
Specialty tickets that earn award miles in the current program (including, but not limited to consolidator/bulk, group, tour and other tickets where the fare paid is not disclosed on the ticket) will earn award miles based on a percentage of the distance flown and the purchased fare class as of March 1, 2015. Please refer to the chart below for details.
Eligible fare classes
Flight operated by United and United Express
150% - J, C, D, Z, P, F, A
100% - Y, B, M
75% - E, U, H, Q, V, W
50% - S, T, L, K, G, N
Eligible fare classes
Flight operated by United and United Express
150% - J, C, D, Z, P, F, A
100% - Y, B, M
75% - E, U, H, Q, V, W
50% - S, T, L, K, G, N
RDM earnings for UA tickets / UA operated flights - based on spend (PQD, now PQPs)
Mar 12, 2015, 8:33 am
#241
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,480
That experience is an outlier. My flights have been mostly packed for the past year or so. In 2015, I find F is booking full (or very close to it - maybe 1 or 2 open seats) a week or two prior to departure. So for now, UA feels it doesn't need to incent loyalty. We can all debate whether that's a sound long-term strategy. But then most American business don't focus on the long-term, Wall Street doesn't reward that.
Mar 12, 2015, 8:49 am
#242
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: BWI
Programs: AA Gold, HH Diamond, National Emerald Executive, TSA Disparager Gold
Posts: 15,180
Disagree with your disagreement...
This change happens regardless of any of the mergers, and it only makes sense. Sure if you were used to getting cheap fares and earning huge miles its the pits. But seriously ask yourself if that is what a business should be rewarding in its loyalty program? (Hint it sure isn't)
This change happens regardless of any of the mergers, and it only makes sense. Sure if you were used to getting cheap fares and earning huge miles its the pits. But seriously ask yourself if that is what a business should be rewarding in its loyalty program? (Hint it sure isn't)
Like it or not revenue based earning is the way of the future for all the airlines, it so strongly rewards premium cabin purchases that you would be foolish to buy biz seats on an airline that doesn't base it on spend. Theoretically with two one way tickets a pax can bank 150,000 miles in a single trip. The last thing any airline wants is to see the people actually buying first class jumping ship because Delta offers them 1000% more miles on the same fare.
Another thing with rewarding with that many miles - one could conceivably pay for only half of their C tix. 150K will get you most places UA flies in C. So rake in the miles for this flight, take the next one free. Sounds like BOGO to me. For some reason, I don't think UA wants people paying for only half of their premium flights.
There are ways to reward bigger spenders while keeping leisure flyers happy. Take a look at what AA is doing. It's offering tons of bonuses now which it claims offers more than what UA and DL are doing - plus it doesn't screw everyone else. It doesn't have to go to a straight revenue model. That just happens to be the easiest and least creative way to do it.
Not saying everyone can or will do this, but it's certainly something that's in the realm of possibility.
Mar 12, 2015, 8:55 am
#243
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: where lions are led by donkeys...
Programs: Lifetime Gold, Global Entry, Hertz PC, and my wallet
Posts: 20,350
You are spot on with that. As an example of them not rewarding loyalty, trying to use a GPU between LHR-SFO-LHR I am 0/6 this year and not even a sniff of a chance. LHR-LAS-LHR with a slightly more flexible schedule R=0 no matter what route I tried over +/-3 days. They have found out the price point for those seats and most go for dollars methinks. Still not enough to make me switch for business travel, but for personal, they rarely get a look-in at the first roll of the dice.
Mar 12, 2015, 9:09 am
#244
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: BWI
Programs: AA Gold, HH Diamond, National Emerald Executive, TSA Disparager Gold
Posts: 15,180
Mar 12, 2015, 10:08 am
#245
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,975
Check your RDM carefully. (posted some details previously) - Had a $781 PQD flight. Should have received 7029 RDM (which was confirmed by MP customer service). Awarded 5167 RDM.
After going back and forth with United's MP customer service multiple times (they kept insisting the lower earning was correct) I finally got an admission by email that United messed up and have no idea why the miles are not calculating correctly.
Anyone else have a similar issue?
After going back and forth with United's MP customer service multiple times (they kept insisting the lower earning was correct) I finally got an admission by email that United messed up and have no idea why the miles are not calculating correctly.
Anyone else have a similar issue?
Mar 12, 2015, 12:02 pm
#246
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Midwest
Programs: UA GS, UA 1.6MM, AA LT PLT, AA 2.6MM, Intercontinental Royal Ambassador
Posts: 838
...You're making the assumption that RDMs are the only reason for buying premium fares. There are plenty of reasons to buy tickets on other airlines. Most foreign carriers offer better hard and soft products than their US counterparts. That alone is often worth more than a crap ton of miles on a mediocre carrier. Factor in schedule, on the ground service, lounges, etc, and it becomes a losing proposition for UA...
...There are ways to reward bigger spenders while keeping leisure flyers happy. Take a look at what AA is doing. It's offering tons of bonuses now which it claims offers more than what UA and DL are doing - plus it doesn't screw everyone else. It doesn't have to go to a straight revenue model. That just happens to be the easiest and least creative way to do it.
Not saying everyone can or will do this, but it's certainly something that's in the realm of possibility.
...There are ways to reward bigger spenders while keeping leisure flyers happy. Take a look at what AA is doing. It's offering tons of bonuses now which it claims offers more than what UA and DL are doing - plus it doesn't screw everyone else. It doesn't have to go to a straight revenue model. That just happens to be the easiest and least creative way to do it.
Not saying everyone can or will do this, but it's certainly something that's in the realm of possibility.
As for the AA program versus UA and DAL, I think we need to recast the facts here. It's not that a revenue program is designed to reward only the HVFs and penalize others, it's that the program is designed to spit out FEWER RDMs overall. In doing so, these programs give out more perks to fewer passengers or fewer perks to more passengers depending on which side of the coin you want to examine. This reduces each airline's financial liability as fewer RDMs are being issued annually.
This is why AA will likely adopt the same position. It needs to reduce its accrued RDM liability to stay in line with DAL and UA. A revenue mileage program accomplishes this most effectively.
Mar 12, 2015, 12:23 pm
#247
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: gggrrrovvveee (ORD)
Programs: UA Pt, Marriott Ti, Hertz PC
Posts: 6,091
Check your RDM carefully. (posted some details previously) - Had a $781 PQD flight. Should have received 7029 RDM (which was confirmed by MP customer service). Awarded 5167 RDM.
After going back and forth with United's MP customer service multiple times (they kept insisting the lower earning was correct) I finally got an admission by email that United messed up and have no idea why the miles are not calculating correctly.
Anyone else have a similar issue?
After going back and forth with United's MP customer service multiple times (they kept insisting the lower earning was correct) I finally got an admission by email that United messed up and have no idea why the miles are not calculating correctly.
Anyone else have a similar issue?
I also compared my 2015 RDM earnings vs. what I would have had under the old scheme and I'm currently well ahead with the new scheme. Then again, most of my flights so far this year have been relatively close-in domestic flights.
Mar 12, 2015, 12:59 pm
#249
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: BWI
Programs: AA Gold, HH Diamond, National Emerald Executive, TSA Disparager Gold
Posts: 15,180
As for the AA program versus UA and DAL, I think we need to recast the facts here. It's not that a revenue program is designed to reward only the HVFs and penalize others, it's that the program is designed to spit out FEWER RDMs overall. In doing so, these programs give out more perks to fewer passengers or fewer perks to more passengers depending on which side of the coin you want to examine. This reduces each airline's financial liability as fewer RDMs are being issued annually.
This is why AA will likely adopt the same position. It needs to reduce its accrued RDM liability to stay in line with DAL and UA. A revenue mileage program accomplishes this most effectively.
DL and UA are treating loyalty as a cost and a liability. For now, at least, AA's treating it like an investment.
Mar 12, 2015, 1:04 pm
#250
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Houston
Programs: UA Plat, Marriott Gold
Posts: 12,694
If some airline wants to lavish on you a free domestic RT in exchange for that, you should fly them as much as you can.
Or on UA you're welcome to buy up to whatever fare you'd like that delivers the miles you're looking for.
For international fliers, it is disconcerting to see that the 'international surcharge' is not counted towards the PQD.
My Newark to Manila ticket is $1,196 fare plus $446 taxes (of which $326 is the international surcharge). The PQD calculated is $1,198.
United says the PQD should the fare plus any carrier-imposed surcharges. How does one definite 'international surcharge?' In the past, a carrier would argued the surcharge was to cover higher fuel costs or foreign expenses. Has anyone tried to reach out to United about this?
My Newark to Manila ticket is $1,196 fare plus $446 taxes (of which $326 is the international surcharge). The PQD calculated is $1,198.
United says the PQD should the fare plus any carrier-imposed surcharges. How does one definite 'international surcharge?' In the past, a carrier would argued the surcharge was to cover higher fuel costs or foreign expenses. Has anyone tried to reach out to United about this?
Contact your travel agent.
Mar 12, 2015, 2:50 pm
#251
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: AADULtArer
Posts: 5,694
There are many, many more than 10 routes to Bahrain.
Way! Wah! Wah! I can no longer fly for 4cpm and get a 2 Cpm rebate! There's no loyalty!
I dont see a huge push to get miles liability off the books from Wall Street. It's barely mentioned in quarterlies, and if analysts worried about it, it would be discussed. Since the airlines totally control award charts and availability, the financial liability is at complete control of the airline. It can be reduced with a few keystrokes.
Way! Wah! Wah! I can no longer fly for 4cpm and get a 2 Cpm rebate! There's no loyalty!
I dont see a huge push to get miles liability off the books from Wall Street. It's barely mentioned in quarterlies, and if analysts worried about it, it would be discussed. Since the airlines totally control award charts and availability, the financial liability is at complete control of the airline. It can be reduced with a few keystrokes.
Last edited by LaserSailor; Mar 12, 2015 at 3:27 pm
Mar 12, 2015, 3:31 pm
#253
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Japan
Posts: 5,577
Well, we know everything is very different now. MRs on UA are already unappealing. But the low ball fares put out by UA are still there, as always. It just does not make sense anymore to fly them as a MileageRunner. I "bolded" the last part of your post and just ask, if UA puts out these low fares, would you expect these "people" to not book the lower fares? Don't understand your reasoning. How does UA make more money with people paying more if the advertised fares are super low?
Mar 12, 2015, 3:51 pm
#254
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM SK EBG LATAM BL
Posts: 23,314
And on every 747, there are 38 mileage runners?
Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds?
If there are 38 mileage runners across the entire fleet on any given day, I'd be shocked - despite the old wives tales you may read on FT.
Mar 12, 2015, 3:59 pm
#255
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: AADULtArer
Posts: 5,694
Well, we know everything is very different now. MRs on UA are already unappealing. But the low ball fares put out by UA are still there, as always. It just does not make sense anymore to fly them as a MileageRunner. I "bolded" the last part of your post and just ask, if UA puts out these low fares, would you expect these "people" to not book the lower fares? Don't understand your reasoning. How does UA make more money with people paying more if the advertised fares are super low?
In the example given, MR were 10% of the load. That's obviously very high, but the fact is that Now that MR is gone, load can be adjusted to the new load.
Fares will be made available based on fare management as always.
The fallacy given below is that since MR brings in incremental revenue, eliminating it impacts profit negatively. It fails because UA can adjust capacity, not to mention 2500 per year customers who consume 10000 usd in benefits