Feb 28, 2021, 12:23 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
Archive thread, active thread is
Consolidated "Why is this UA fare so expensive?" thread
Potential reasons for high fares
-- the lower fare classes are sold out
-- the lower fare classes are not available due to fare rule restrictions
..... day of the week travel restrictions, Saturday night stay requirement, minimum stay requirement, advance purchase requirements, ...
-- desired fares are not combinable
-- discount fares not available for one-ways, only roundtrips Why are international OWs so expensive, such high fare classes?
-- discount inventory for codeshare marketing airline is gone, but flight operator may have discount fare (or the reverse)
-- Plating -- airlines restrict the best fare to their ticket stock, meaning ticketing that flight on another ticket stock will be more expensive
-- Airline is figuring it will still sell (due to last minute purchases0 even if the competition is lower earlier. Such as peak leisure periods or special events.
-- Airline is placing a premium on non-stop (monopoly?) versus alternative connecting routings
If you find an expensive flight, start by checking the fare class and compare to the less expensive option -- that generally will explain a lot.
Consolidated "Why is this UA fare so expensive?" thread
Potential reasons for high fares
-- the lower fare classes are sold out
-- the lower fare classes are not available due to fare rule restrictions
..... day of the week travel restrictions, Saturday night stay requirement, minimum stay requirement, advance purchase requirements, ...
-- desired fares are not combinable
-- discount fares not available for one-ways, only roundtrips Why are international OWs so expensive, such high fare classes?
-- discount inventory for codeshare marketing airline is gone, but flight operator may have discount fare (or the reverse)
-- Plating -- airlines restrict the best fare to their ticket stock, meaning ticketing that flight on another ticket stock will be more expensive
-- Airline is figuring it will still sell (due to last minute purchases0 even if the competition is lower earlier. Such as peak leisure periods or special events.
-- Airline is placing a premium on non-stop (monopoly?) versus alternative connecting routings
If you find an expensive flight, start by checking the fare class and compare to the less expensive option -- that generally will explain a lot.
Consolidated "Why is this fare so expensive?" Thread [Archive]
Mar 1, 2017, 8:00 am
#1186
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
You are looking at a premium cabin flying through a fortress hub (EWR or IAD) at least 6 months out. That generally means someone with fixed dates and therefore no reason for UA to discount its fares yet.
UA is most certainly competing on the DUB-US route and on the Northeast - MCO route and it has sophisticated RM/IM software examining 100's of datapoints to which you do not have access.
Those likely show that as of now, people will likely purchase the more expensive fares so no need for UA to drop its fares. But, if UA is wrong, it can drop its fares and sell the cheaper fares later.
The real question is whether you wish to compete for those seats. If you want to lock them in now, you will pay the premium. If not, you can hope that they remain unsold and that the price drops.
Or better yet, fly the competition. That is what a smart consumer ought to do. Not as though the UA hard/soft product is so astounding on those two routes that you are seeing some intangible value.
UA is most certainly competing on the DUB-US route and on the Northeast - MCO route and it has sophisticated RM/IM software examining 100's of datapoints to which you do not have access.
Those likely show that as of now, people will likely purchase the more expensive fares so no need for UA to drop its fares. But, if UA is wrong, it can drop its fares and sell the cheaper fares later.
The real question is whether you wish to compete for those seats. If you want to lock them in now, you will pay the premium. If not, you can hope that they remain unsold and that the price drops.
Or better yet, fly the competition. That is what a smart consumer ought to do. Not as though the UA hard/soft product is so astounding on those two routes that you are seeing some intangible value.
Mar 1, 2017, 8:19 am
#1187
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Norn Iron
Posts: 247
I am really using my dates as an example, I (quite exhaustively) use multiple sites, kayak, momondo, skyscanner and others. I use google flights price graph view to look at adjacent dates and also united's own month at a time view. I know there are cheaper dates than the ones I am looking at but they generally have excessively long stopovers (your link has an interesting flight but with a 14 hour stop in ZRH and the £2200 flights are still uncompetitive). On United's month at a time view there are 5 dates in September that are £1573 and there is one of them I might be able to make work.
I think it is reasonable fair to say that UA has good prices on 5 dates in Sept (from a UK regional pricing standpoint) but AA and DL have them on everyday in September - I would prefer to stick to my dates and I do have the choice of sticking with UA with date changes or moving to AA/DL.
I know I am generalizing but on all but 5 dates in September UA are £3000+ but AA/DL are £2000- that to me is uncompetitive!
Often1, I had thought of that and I'm glad you have pointed it out - still not sure that for the entire month of February this disparity has existed, I would have though the algorithms used by the airlines would all be broadly similar - but what do I know!
I think it is reasonable fair to say that UA has good prices on 5 dates in Sept (from a UK regional pricing standpoint) but AA and DL have them on everyday in September - I would prefer to stick to my dates and I do have the choice of sticking with UA with date changes or moving to AA/DL.
I know I am generalizing but on all but 5 dates in September UA are £3000+ but AA/DL are £2000- that to me is uncompetitive!
Often1, I had thought of that and I'm glad you have pointed it out - still not sure that for the entire month of February this disparity has existed, I would have though the algorithms used by the airlines would all be broadly similar - but what do I know!
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Mar 1, 2017 at 9:17 am Reason: merging consecutive posts by same member
Mar 1, 2017, 8:27 am
#1188
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: BWI
Programs: UA 1MM & 1K, Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 255
Different cities that they service, different hubs, different clientele. Even if the algorithms were the same, the outputs would not necessarily be equal. I would also guess that the algorithms used by each airline are incredibly complex and vastly different.
Mar 1, 2017, 8:43 am
#1189
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Norn Iron
Posts: 247
United's new president, vice president for international planning and Andrew Nocella whose role is unconfirmed but has a background in network planning all came from American. Scott Kirby has said he is especially interested in building United’s Chicago hub to make it more formidable against competition from American - I might be able to give him a pointer on that (TIC)
Mar 11, 2017, 8:54 am
#1190
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: BOS
Programs: Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott/SPG/Hilton Gold, PreCheck + Clear
Posts: 2,306
I wouldn't say long ago. Many routes have had round trip fares in the last twelve months, and some still do. SFO/BOS is one of the holdouts and AFAIK has always done this. SFO/IAH is one of the most egregious offenders though - cheapest o/w is an M! Reasoning is the same old: people who don't stay Friday or Saturday night are business travelers and will fork over whatever is asked of them.
If you can posit a rationale, would you guess it's temporary or permanent? I find myself once again in the position of having two e-certs to apply, and I was thrilled to discover that for travel in April, r/t fares appear to be based on 2x o/w, meaning I can apply both e-certs to a single trip. Just wondering if this new, sensible pricing strategy is likely to remain in place, since moving forward I'd often like to fly UA in one direction, B6 back.
Of course I'm aware no one has a crystal ball. But some on FT have an uncanny knack for explaining pricing strategy!
Mar 11, 2017, 10:15 am
#1191
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Japan
Posts: 5,577
Europe pricing from he West Coast is out of control. Looking for Sep/Oct round trips to FRA UA is asking around $ 1,400.00 in Y. That's nearly as much as I am paying for Biz r/t FRA-NRT. On the other hand today I saw SFO-BCN at $ 400.00 r/t. Who can make sense out of this?
Mar 17, 2017, 9:17 pm
#1192
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SFO
Posts: 1,756
SFO-BCN at $400!is a response to the new OAK -BCN flghts announced today.
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...level-airline/
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...level-airline/
Mar 21, 2017, 11:32 pm
#1193
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: MSP
Programs: DL PM, UA Gold, WN, Global Entry; +others wherever miles/points are found
Posts: 14,438
If you can posit a rationale, would you guess it's temporary or permanent? I find myself once again in the position of having two e-certs to apply, and I was thrilled to discover that for travel in April, r/t fares appear to be based on 2x o/w, meaning I can apply both e-certs to a single trip. Just wondering if this new, sensible pricing strategy is likely to remain in place, since moving forward I'd often like to fly UA in one direction, B6 back.
Of course I'm aware no one has a crystal ball. But some on FT have an uncanny knack for explaining pricing strategy!
Of course I'm aware no one has a crystal ball. But some on FT have an uncanny knack for explaining pricing strategy!
I would guess UA finally capitulated to B6 market pressure and is matching its optics with a fully OW table. If I were a betting man, I would give good odds that it will stay that way at least for a few months. But anything can happen.
Mar 23, 2017, 5:23 am
#1194
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: LBB
Programs: UA 1K 1MM ★G | Marriott LTT | Hilton ♦ | Hertz PC | Global Entry TSA Pre ✓
Posts: 2,820
Booked travel 3 weeks out from DEN-GRR ... return on April 1 (Saturday) was $670 o.w. making for more than $1000 r.t. ..... Absolute gouging, and I have no clue why. Y9 B9 M9 ... everything else 0. Every other flight that day is even more expensive. Anyone know if there is something going on in Denver or GRR that would cause this?
Mar 23, 2017, 8:47 am
#1195
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Glenview, IL USA
Programs: UA 2MM 1K, HH Lifetime Diamond
Posts: 232
RIC-ORD is that way for 4/8 and ORD-RIC for 4/16. All buckets except Y and B are zeroed out. $700+ each way. Must be some event or politician eating all the seats.
Mar 23, 2017, 9:35 am
#1196
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Catania, Sicily/South Jersey (PHL)/Houston, Texas/Red Stick/airborne in-between
Programs: United Global Svs, AA PlatPro, WN RR, AZ/ITA Freccia, Hilton Diam, Bonvoy Gold, Hertz Prez, IHG
Posts: 3,548
I rarely rant on these threads but will say PHL-IAH is just high nearly all the time it seems lately unless you want a 3+ hour connection somewhere. I am buying these tickets weekly almost for family (and AA is high too). Frontier just restarted the route so we shall what happens.
Mar 23, 2017, 1:34 pm
#1197
Formerly known as caveruner17
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: ORD
Posts: 432
Booked travel 3 weeks out from DEN-GRR ... return on April 1 (Saturday) was $670 o.w. making for more than $1000 r.t. ..... Absolute gouging, and I have no clue why. Y9 B9 M9 ... everything else 0. Every other flight that day is even more expensive. Anyone know if there is something going on in Denver or GRR that would cause this?
Nothing that I'm aware of in DEN though. I tried a few routes out of GRR to ORD, MSP, NYC and BOS and everything is over $300 whereas other dates are under $100
Mar 23, 2017, 2:12 pm
#1198
Join Date: May 2010
Location: SFO
Programs: UA MM, Marriott LT Plat
Posts: 264
Yeah, SMF-IAH nonstop has been M and higher for a while. Fly with a stopover for half the price. Doesn't make sense to me, but the planes seem to fill up based on seating charts (yes, I know that's not reliable...).
Mar 23, 2017, 8:57 pm
#1199
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 15
Beginning of spring break for Grand Rapids schools. I'm sure it's even worse if you want to go to Florida.
Mar 23, 2017, 9:54 pm
#1200
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: IAH & PHL
Programs: United Premier Silver
Posts: 326
I rarely rant on these threads but will say PHL-IAH is just high nearly all the time it seems lately unless you want a 3+ hour connection somewhere. I am buying these tickets weekly almost for family (and AA is high too). Frontier just restarted the route so we shall what happens.