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Will UA use Purser, Lead or Service Mgr? - UA to standardize on "Purser" post-Oct2018

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Will UA use Purser, Lead or Service Mgr? - UA to standardize on "Purser" post-Oct2018

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Old May 30, 2011, 12:08 pm
  #61  
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Originally Posted by Say Vandelay
I thought they were supposed to be "the most professional men and women in the business"...
Those were clearly UA gals. Not yet up to CO standards.

Originally Posted by channa
Huh? Where was that said?




Which is fine, so then pitch it as a CO takeover. Quit pitching it a merger of equals and then disregarding most things UA.
I would be FINE with a CO takeover if we get to keep the CO name. Purser is an absurd title; ISM is an absurd title. One of them hand to when out; ISM got picked.

Last edited by FlyinHawaiian; May 30, 2011 at 12:30 pm Reason: multi-quote
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Old May 30, 2011, 12:36 pm
  #62  
 
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Originally Posted by joshwex90

I can hear where people who want "purser" to remain are coming from, but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter. ISM is much more explanatory of the job than purser. As for UA-NYC's point, if every one of the "soft" decisions went the UA way, I wouldn't care either. I'm a CO fan, and made elite with CO, and never really flew UA. I had been scared off of UA from years ago, just as many UA flyers may have been scared off of CO. Now that they've merged, the color of the carpet doesn't matter, nor does the name of the lounge, or the colors of the livery... Sure, it's nice to keep tradition, but what's more important are the hard facts, such as E+, boarding... (I'm not getting into that discussion again of which boarding scheme is better.) The point I'm trying to make is that there are certain things that aren't worth fighting as much. Something tells me if Tilton was remaining and Smisek was leaving, the carpet would stay red, "purser" would remain, etc. And I wouldn't have cared
So, you can see where people are coming from, but then discredit anyone who wants to talk about it?

And saying that you wouldn't care if the shoe were on the foot is pretty easy to say at this point.....
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Old May 30, 2011, 1:13 pm
  #63  
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Originally Posted by hobo13
So, you can see where people are coming from, but then discredit anyone who wants to talk about it?
I'm not quite sure where the confusion comes from, but I'll spell it out again: I understand where they come fro. It's nice to keep things the same or what you're used to. HOWEVER, it's not worth talking about. Perhaps you get the good feeling knowing the purser by first name, and now, he/she's the ISM, but it's not worth threads. I see where they're coming from in terms of a feeling; of course I understood where people were coming from regarding the tulip (on one side) or the name of the airline (on the other side). But I DON'T see the need to have massive threads arguing back and forth over the tiniest minutia.

And saying that you wouldn't care if the shoe were on the foot is pretty easy to say at this point.....
It might very well be easy, but it's also true. Just like when a bunch of friends said "I can't believe the Continental brand is gone, the United brand stinks," and I responded, "yeah, I'll miss Continental, but it doesn't matter. What matters is what's inside the plane, not what's written on the side." So I can say the same here....what matters is how the FAs are as FAs, not what the lead one is called.
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Old May 31, 2011, 7:24 pm
  #64  
 
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Originally Posted by JOSECONLSCREW28
I'm not sure but perhaps there going the CO way.
Perhaps? Why would this be any different?

Last edited by iluv2fly; May 31, 2011 at 8:10 pm Reason: off-topic
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Old Jun 2, 2011, 10:56 am
  #65  
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Isn't the term "purser" relatively new at UA? I want to say it was introduced in the early- to mid-1990's? Prior to "Pursers" UA had "First Flight Attendants."
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Old Jun 3, 2011, 4:47 am
  #66  
 
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It's actually a pretty meaningless term applied as it is as well, since the United Purser isn't sitting in the galley doing the plane's petty accounts or offering short term loans to the passengers. May as well call the FA who switches the IFE on the 'Stage Manager'.
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Old Jun 3, 2011, 8:10 am
  #67  
 
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Originally Posted by barberio
It's actually a pretty meaningless term applied as it is as well, since the United Purser isn't sitting in the galley doing the plane's petty accounts or offering short term loans to the passengers. May as well call the FA who switches the IFE on the 'Stage Manager'.
Indeed. From wikipedia:

A ship's purser (also purser or pusser)[1] is the person on a ship responsible for the handling of money on board. On modern merchant ships the purser is the officer responsible for all administration and supply; frequently the cooks and stewards answer to him/her as well.

The purser joined the warrant officer ranks of the Royal Navy in the early fourteenth century and existed as a Naval rank until 1852. The development of the warrant officer system began in 1040 when five English ports began furnishing warships to King Edward the Confessor in exchange for certain privileges, they also furnished crews whose officers were the Master, Boatswain, Carpenter and Cook. Later these officers were "warranted" by the British Admiralty. Pursers received no pay but were entitled to profits made through their business activities. In the 18th century a purser would buy his warrant for £65 and was required to post sureties totalling £2,100 with the Admiralty.[2] They maintained and sailed the ships and were the standing officers of the navy, staying with the ships in port between voyages as caretakers supervising repairs and refitting.[3]

In charge of supplies such as food and drink, clothing, bedding, candles, the purser was originally known as "the clerk of burser."[3] They would usually charge the supplier a 5% commission for making a purchase and it is recorded they charged a considerable markup when they on-sold the goods to the crew. The purser was not actually in charge of pay, but of necessity had to track it closely, since the crew had to pay for all their supplies, and it was the purser's job to deduct those expenses from their wages. The purser bought everything (except food and drink) on credit, acting almost as a private merchant. In addition to his official responsibilities, it was customary for the purser to act as a literal private merchant for luxuries such as tobacco, and to be the crew's banker.

As a result, the purser could be at risk of losing money and being thrown into debtor's prison; conversely, the crew and officers habitually suspected the purser of making an illicit profit out of his complex dealings. It was the common practice of pursers forging pay tickets to claim wages for "phantom" crew members that led to the Navy's implementation of muster inspection to confirm who actually worked on a vessel.[2] The position, though unpaid, was very sought after due to the expectation of making a reasonable profit; although there were wealthy pursers, it was due to side businesses facilitated by their ships' travels.

On modern-day passenger ships, the purser has evolved into a multi-person office that handles general administration, fees and charges, currency exchange, and any other money-related needs of the passengers and crew. The Chief Purser often holds a rank equivalent to that of the Chief Officer (and wears the same three rank rings).
It's an archaic term that doesn't describe their actual function and for pax not steeped in airline lingo it is confusing as to what they are supposed to be.

If you didn't know what a purser is, when a FA announces that they are the chief purser on the flight, what are supposed to make of that? How about when a FA announces that they are the inflight service manager?
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Old Jun 3, 2011, 9:16 am
  #68  
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Originally Posted by andrewwm
Indeed. From wikipedia:



It's an archaic term that doesn't describe their actual function and for pax not steeped in airline lingo it is confusing as to what they are supposed to be.

If you didn't know what a purser is, when a FA announces that they are the chief purser on the flight, what are supposed to make of that? How about when a FA announces that they are the inflight service manager?
Flying yesterday, I had the International Service Manager, with a pin on her saying that, introduce herself personally to each of us in BF. I imagine anyone who saw her would know what her job is. If that pin had said purser instead, something tells me most non-FTers wouldn't even think of going to her as the "lead FA."

But again, the spin will be that it's not an airline's job to cater to its pax...only to the GS and 1K pax on the flight
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Old Jun 3, 2011, 10:39 am
  #69  
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FWIW, on the nine flight I've taken since Tuesday, there have been no references to Lead FA. Each one introduced themselves as the purser, including on both international flights..
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Old Jun 5, 2011, 9:45 pm
  #70  
 
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United has not yet announced what they will call us. In our latest training video the "flight attendant in charge" was referred to throughout the video as Lead/Purser. They still use both terminology. We may all have to have a "talent interview" like those in management, but no announcement has been made.
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Old Jul 8, 2014, 3:20 pm
  #71  
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Originally Posted by UA-NYC
Hope they keep "purser". There's a lot of pride in that, have talked to a few of them and they talked about the additional training they go through. Many of the leading global airlines seem to use the phrase.

FSC or ISM just seems like mumbo jumbo.
At sCO Lead FA's on international flights are known as International Service Managers or (ISMs) and on domestic flights they are known as Flight Service Coordinators or (FSCs).

What about sUA? Is the lead FA still called "purser"?
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Old Jul 8, 2014, 3:25 pm
  #72  
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Originally Posted by andrewwm
Indeed. From wikipedia:



It's an archaic term that doesn't describe their actual function and for pax not steeped in airline lingo it is confusing as to what they are supposed to be.

If you didn't know what a purser is, when a FA announces that they are the chief purser on the flight, what are supposed to make of that? How about when a FA announces that they are the inflight service manager?
Of course, but then again (even though we all know what it means) so is the term Captain. If we were to stick with a more modern function-driven terminology the Captain would be the Lead Aircraft Operator...
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Old Jul 8, 2014, 3:49 pm
  #73  
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Originally Posted by kb1992
At sCO Lead FA's on international flights are known as International Service Managers or (ISMs) and on domestic flights they are known as Flight Service Coordinators or (FSCs).

What about sUA? Is the lead FA still called "purser"?
sUA uses the purser term for both domestic and international flights for the position.

For sUA domestic flights, it's the FA working the first class cabin. Since position is assigned onboard based on seniority, you may end up with the most junior FA working the purser position.

However, to be a purser on an international flight, you need to go through additional training for certification. Those are the folks with the purser title on their name pin. Pre-merger, they used to have a fancier wing with the word PURSER on it.
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Old Jun 12, 2015, 1:24 pm
  #74  
 
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I just noticed the FA announcement with the title
"Flight Service Coordinator" being used for the first time this week. This
makes sense to me. For years, when FA's announced,
"I will be your purser on today's flight", I often wondered what
that really meant. I figured it was rooted in some irrelevant
history, and indeed, according to
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=purser
it is a 15th century designation and has nothing to do with
what flight attendants do.
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Old Jun 12, 2015, 9:02 pm
  #75  
 
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Call me old (UA) school but I still prefer Purser......Anything with the word "manager" in it makes me think of someone sitting behind a desk, i.e, Station Manager.
Somehow a lot of confusing CO lingo took hold at the merger. Took us weeks to figure out what "redisplay the bags" meant. This was used in conjunction with bags being returned to the baggage claim (ie., a cancelled flights and all bags offloaded and returned to the baggage claim area for passengers to retrieve). Redisplay ?? the bags ??.....sounds like a new window display at Macys.

At United we would be told the bags were being "dumped" back to baggage claim.....simple. All ramp and customer service agents knew what it meant by that one word. Yes, kind of a "crude" term but it was an internal term and passengers were simply told to retrieve their bags at baggage claim.

Back to the subject at hand.....I find CO's terminology confusing and why are there two different terms for this person (on international flights they are ...managers and on domestic flights they are ....coordinators)? I know passengers probably don't give it a second thought (or even remember the terms) but purser sounds familiar to most people and can be incorporated as "Your purser or lead FA on our flight today is ....." if they even need a definition in this 21st century.

Last edited by FlyingNone; Jun 12, 2015 at 9:20 pm
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