Dulles to Moscow on UA – the ULTIMATE double EQM run – right now anyway!
Apr 14, 2009, 5:06 pm
#76
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Are you kidding? Your comparisons make no sense at all. The chance that (a) a given UA employee doesn't understand the rules, (b) won't relent even when presented with a printout of the rules, and (c) a SD can be found who does know the rules and is willing to apply them correctly before one's flight leaves is immeasurably greater than being hit by an asteriod, being mistakenly arrested as a terrorist, or any other fanciful scenario you can concoct. Whenever one relies on other human beings to behave in a certain way within the confines of a specific time window one is rolling the dice.
Clearly you are less risk-averse than some -- armed with your research, a computer printout, a very good knowledge of how UA works, you took a chance by flying a same-day turn to DME without a visa. Yes, the rules appeared to be clearly on your side. Yes, you did you homework. But in the absence of a TR from someone else actually reporting that it worked, you had no way to know with any significant degree of certainty (a) that you'd be allowed to board and (b) that things would pan out at DME. This isn't to say you weren't at all sure -- you did your homework, to the benefit of yourself and all of us on FT (^). But come on, your risk of being denied boarding and/or being hassled at DME was surely greater than being hit by an asteriod, and definitely more difficult to measure ahead of time. I mean, who knows what some bonehead here or there would have done at T-30 minutes to departure?
I salute your pioneering spirit, and again, I think you've done a great service for the FT community by going out on a limb and reporting back. But in light of what happened to our friend at BOS, I think it's simply inaccurate to say that "there is absolutely no cause to" worry about things going wrong.
Clearly you are less risk-averse than some -- armed with your research, a computer printout, a very good knowledge of how UA works, you took a chance by flying a same-day turn to DME without a visa. Yes, the rules appeared to be clearly on your side. Yes, you did you homework. But in the absence of a TR from someone else actually reporting that it worked, you had no way to know with any significant degree of certainty (a) that you'd be allowed to board and (b) that things would pan out at DME. This isn't to say you weren't at all sure -- you did your homework, to the benefit of yourself and all of us on FT (^). But come on, your risk of being denied boarding and/or being hassled at DME was surely greater than being hit by an asteriod, and definitely more difficult to measure ahead of time. I mean, who knows what some bonehead here or there would have done at T-30 minutes to departure?
I salute your pioneering spirit, and again, I think you've done a great service for the FT community by going out on a limb and reporting back. But in light of what happened to our friend at BOS, I think it's simply inaccurate to say that "there is absolutely no cause to" worry about things going wrong.
I had all the printouts that ozstamps referenced and never needed to show a single one.
Upon checking in at ORD, the first words out of my mouth were "no visa required" because I am coming back on the same plane. No issue. Then I explained that I needed the return boarding pass so that I could stay airside in DME, again no questions but significantly more typing.
The Russian gate agent at IAD clearly knows the rules. She did a thorough passport/visa check for those before me in the queue. I just showed her my return boarding pass stating again "no visa required" and she just waved me on after glancing at my (British) passport.
Apr 18, 2009, 2:19 am
#77
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Join Date: Jun 2000
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The Russian gate agent at IAD clearly knows the rules. She did a thorough passport/visa check for those before me in the queue. I just showed her my return boarding pass stating again "no visa required" and she just waved me on after glancing at my (British) passport.
Yes I noted that above .. she is rostered there JUST for the Moscow flight each day and seemed to know the rules backwards.
Apr 21, 2009, 9:44 am
#78
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC, JNB, LON, NYC
Programs: * A
Posts: 2,528
thanks oz! I just completed my DEQM run to Moscow and this was my best MR so far. Even if I had trouble getting checked-in at IAD w/o the VISA (thanks to the dinosaur who would not accept the transit rule and my fellow FTer), it worked out very well on the end. On the way to DME, and back to IAD, there were FAs that made my journey very notable. thanks for pushing me, oz and it indeed was fun. This IAD-DME run is my best flight experiences on UA as of now (I have flown paid C/F and award C/F on UA multiple times, this one took the cake for service and overall experience flying the friendly skies w/ UA). Hope the service remains positive in this route and it helps the service to improve on other UA routes.
Last edited by noirpepper; Apr 21, 2009 at 7:16 pm
Apr 21, 2009, 10:53 pm
#79
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 425
Would need to cancel this trip...
I am relaying my situation so that if someone is in the same boat they can relate to it or offer suggestions of what they did/would have done.
I got back today from the London-Sydney run/mini vacation with all segments cleared in C days in advance of the flights. My flight to Moscow is next Thursday, Apr 30 and returning Sun, May 1 so was planning a weekend in Moscow. Before departing for Sydney run I had looked at all arrangements for the chepest fee option for a tourist visa to Russia ($219 through www.russia-visa.com for the 3 business days option) and would have Fedexed them my passport tonight on the way back from the airport. But lo and behold when I was filling the online application in the SG airlines lounge in SFO their fees have increased to $319! I called the number for this company while in transit in SFO and the guy told me the Russian consulate just drastically increased the fees on April 13th (is it because al UA FTers are going to Moscow??). Even with a $300+ ticket, the close to 400 dollars for visa including overnight courier, etc. makes it not only cost prohibitive but a lot of hassle in other ways as well. I'd rather stick to runs to LHR then. If I call UA to cancel this trip tomorrow, would I still have the balance after $100 penalty fee to be used for future ticketing?
I got back today from the London-Sydney run/mini vacation with all segments cleared in C days in advance of the flights. My flight to Moscow is next Thursday, Apr 30 and returning Sun, May 1 so was planning a weekend in Moscow. Before departing for Sydney run I had looked at all arrangements for the chepest fee option for a tourist visa to Russia ($219 through www.russia-visa.com for the 3 business days option) and would have Fedexed them my passport tonight on the way back from the airport. But lo and behold when I was filling the online application in the SG airlines lounge in SFO their fees have increased to $319! I called the number for this company while in transit in SFO and the guy told me the Russian consulate just drastically increased the fees on April 13th (is it because al UA FTers are going to Moscow??). Even with a $300+ ticket, the close to 400 dollars for visa including overnight courier, etc. makes it not only cost prohibitive but a lot of hassle in other ways as well. I'd rather stick to runs to LHR then. If I call UA to cancel this trip tomorrow, would I still have the balance after $100 penalty fee to be used for future ticketing?
Apr 22, 2009, 12:39 am
#80
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I suspect US increased visa fees for the russians and they promptly reciprocated.
Apr 22, 2009, 9:04 am
#82
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 760
thanks oz! I just completed my DEQM run to Moscow and this was my best MR so far. Even if I had trouble getting checked-in at IAD w/o the VISA (thanks to the dinosaur who would not accept the transit rule and my fellow FTer), it worked out very well on the end. On the way to DME, and back to IAD, there were FAs that made my journey very notable. thanks for pushing me, oz and it indeed was fun. This IAD-DME run is my best flight experiences on UA as of now (I have flown paid C/F and award C/F on UA multiple times, this one took the cake for service and overall experience flying the friendly skies w/ UA). Hope the service remains positive in this route and it helps the service to improve on other UA routes.
I'll add a few points from my experience. (I did not have a visa.)
At the completion of OLCI, .bomb spat out an international departure card and, surprisingly, the return BP.
I had problems with the ticket agent from the start. They were convinced that I needed a visa. Even with all the documentation that ozstamps graciously prepared, the dinosaurs weren't going to print my BPs. The supervisor, however, diligently researched the visa issue, and with the plane boarding already, ok'd the check-in and printed both outbound and return BPs, leaving us to leg it to C6. The ticket agent that noirpepper encountered printed out his BPs but overheard my dinosaur making a big scene and held up his check-in.
At the gate, the GA did a second visa check and sent us down the jetway.
The flights were more full that I had expected but I still had an open seat next to me both ways.
Upon deplaning in Russia, there is a small foyer with a transfer counter. The transfer counter will direct you to the transfer signs. (The transfer counter agent shrugged, and didn't seem to care that we were doing a same day turn.) There is a security check before you can get back airside. The Russian lady only asked us where we came from and where we are going, Washington and Washington of course! Two red stamps on the BP (none in the passport) and we were on our way to the LH lounge.
LH lounge is a left turn up the escalators right after clearing the transit security check. At the lounge, the kind hostesses did not ask for *G card, but you do have to ask for a towel at the front desk if you want to shower (and there is only one shower).
Snacks were great. Fizzy water is on the 2nd to bottom shelf, regular water is on the bottom.
Boarding calls were made: went from board now to board immediately, to you have 3 minutes left to board. At the 3 minute annoucement, we huffed it back to the gate (not far away). The agents at the gate asked a few security questions, scanned the BP and there was another security screening at the top of the jetway before we got on the plane.
I won secondary screening from ICE back at IAD.
So to sum it up, be patient at IAD. Ask for a supervisor: If you run into one who shares initials with the original car from Knight Rider, you're in luck. She's one of the best I've encountered. Transit in Russia was easy and FA's were extremely pleasant both ways. What's more, I had great FT company and a very productive flight.
Apr 22, 2009, 12:50 pm
#83
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC, JNB, LON, NYC
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Posts: 2,528
whistler814 I did not mention your handle for privacy concerns 
but I guess it's not an issue. thanks for the great company on this MR. This crazy trip probably would not even be half the fun if you were not around. This was my most riskiest MR so far, thankfully when I was taking pictures at the Airport the Russian Cops did not arrest us I would recommend my best FT friend to make this MR as ozstamps pushed me to this
but I guess it's not an issue. thanks for the great company on this MR. This crazy trip probably would not even be half the fun if you were not around. This was my most riskiest MR so far, thankfully when I was taking pictures at the Airport the Russian Cops did not arrest us I would recommend my best FT friend to make this MR as ozstamps pushed me to this
Apr 22, 2009, 5:56 pm
#84
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: SAN / BAH / TPA
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 1,022
Upon deplaning in Russia, there is a small foyer with a transfer counter. The transfer counter will direct you to the transfer signs. (The transfer counter agent shrugged, and didn't seem to care that we were doing a same day turn.) There is a security check before you can get back airside. The Russian lady only asked us where we came from and where we are going, Washington and Washington of course! Two red stamps on the BP (none in the passport) and we were on our way to the LH lounge.
LH lounge is a left turn up the escalators right after clearing the transit security check. At the lounge, the kind hostesses did not ask for *G card, but you do have to ask for a towel at the front desk if you want to shower (and there is only one shower).
Whistler814, thanks for the details about transit. While I've done numerous turns in the UK, Germany, Japan and others, this one had me nervous since I've got no wiggle room with my work schedule. Your simple instructions will be helpful.
Apr 22, 2009, 6:20 pm
#85
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago
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I'm glad that everybody enjoyed the experience and I also appreciate ozstamps for having the bravado to be first and then reporting back.
He was concerned but he did the leg work.
I posted numbers for the Russian visa bureau in DC and made sure the UA made a not of the rules in my PNR.
After having dealt with ICE in IAD I am convinced that Moscow is easier than Washington. At least they follow the rules in Moscow.
He was concerned but he did the leg work.
I posted numbers for the Russian visa bureau in DC and made sure the UA made a not of the rules in my PNR.
After having dealt with ICE in IAD I am convinced that Moscow is easier than Washington. At least they follow the rules in Moscow.
Apr 23, 2009, 12:42 am
#86
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 425
On the subject of "following rules in Moscow" I am not so sure - my experience in Hungary was pretty bad. On that note, at least in the US we have this peception of being the safest country in the world to invest, great investor protectionism, laws, rules & regulations, transparency and feduciary responsibility, etc. That's what Mr. Geithner told the whole world couple of weeks ago at the London summit, while the night before some 'victims' of Mr. Madoff appeared on Fox News and asked how should we sue the US govt? The commentator just laughed and said that is impossible....you will never win!
Apr 23, 2009, 7:30 am
#87
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Join Date: Sep 2000
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as the rep made it sound too easy at first by saying you just use the credit towards another ticket when I asked what my options were. Then she put me on hold for several minutes and came back and said I was carefully looking at the rules of this ticket and since this is International it would be $200...
^ Ask, there's no harm in it.FYI, UA is offering $400 R/T (return) trips EWR/HNL. Search by flexible dates. You can get the same 10,000 - 10,500 miles, depending on the routing.
Apr 23, 2009, 8:00 am
#88
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,102
Recently completed a weekend turn IAD - DME. Managed to upgrade the T-fare on the outbound with an SWU (whoooooo!) Not too impressed with the food offerings at the DME Senator lounge on the return. Return flight was typical UA international Y - just grit your teeth until it ends. The contracted DME agents were too well versed in the rules to upgrade a T-fare with an SWU, unfortunately.
Apr 24, 2009, 5:30 am
#89
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Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Sunny SYDNEY!
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The cabin was near empty and had a full roster of FA’s. They thought it was a hoot a 1K was flying 10 hours to DME just to turn around and go back, after just arriving from SYD, and pampered me in many ways I better not go into here, but suffice to say it was a very fun trip.
Same on the way back. A really superb crew on that 10 hour flight, and folks like that are what makes flying UA so enjoyable when you encounter them - which is all too rare of course these days. They seemed to really appreciate folks like 1Ks etc who do these wacky things just for miles, and help keep them employed. Best flight I have had for years. In ANY cabin.
I am flying over 35,000 real miles in 4 days on UA, and they all seemed to think that was insane, and I had them all from Purser down come and chat to me about it.
One of the FA's heard what I was doing, and gave me a personally signed copy of his great new book on tips on flying etc, which is a superb read, brilliantly written, and I urged him to join FT.
http://www.impactpublications.com/in...OD&ProdID=8654
A highly recommended read. 300+pages and VERY perceptive and very funny at times.
My 1K drink chits did not seem at all necessary at any time, and what I drank - and there was a lot of it, was top shelf, and served in real fluted glassware, and not plastic.
===============
Dear ozstamps:
I am responding to your correspondence addressed to Mr. Tilton. I wanted to get back to you via the quickest method, so I’ve taken the liberty to respond using the e-mail address you provided us in your Mileage Plus account.
Thank you for complimenting the three senior crew members on our flight UA 965 from Moscow to Washington Dulles on April 5th.
We certainly appreciated the opportunity to serve you and are delighted by your comments.
The individuals you recognized and their supervisors will receive copies of your great praise.
You are a 1K member, one of our most valued customers. Thank you for your continued support and loyalty to United Airlines.
Sincerely,
xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
Customer Relations Manager
Chicago
Apr 25, 2009, 2:53 pm
#90
Used to be 'g_leyser'
Join Date: Jul 2002
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Well, I tried to do the DME turn today, originating in ORD.
I was armed with the printed rules, (thanks to Glen), but the agent was not interested. She was polite, but firm. It was obvious there was no way she was going to allow me to go to DME.
Funny thing was, she told me that I was second person to try this today - OK which one of you was it?!?!?!
Anyways, there was no sense in arguing, so she offloaded me and I went home. I asked her to please put a note in the record explaining what had happened and she agreed.
I have now just sent a note to the 1K Voice e-mail address, explaining the situation, including a copy of the rules from timaticweb and a web link in case they want to check it themselves.
I politely requested that I be credited for the flights, including DEQM, and the 3K miles for the Moscow bonus promotion. I think this is fair, considering it was a United agent that made the error. I also made it clear that I was not asking for any kind of additional compensation - just want the miles.
I'm actually kinda bummed, as I was really looking forward to this fun little adventure and getting some much-needed reading done without any distractions. It looks like I would've easily had a full row of 3 seats to myself. Oh well, we'll see what happens.
Will keep y'all posted.
I was armed with the printed rules, (thanks to Glen), but the agent was not interested. She was polite, but firm. It was obvious there was no way she was going to allow me to go to DME.
Funny thing was, she told me that I was second person to try this today - OK which one of you was it?!?!?!
Anyways, there was no sense in arguing, so she offloaded me and I went home. I asked her to please put a note in the record explaining what had happened and she agreed.
I have now just sent a note to the 1K Voice e-mail address, explaining the situation, including a copy of the rules from timaticweb and a web link in case they want to check it themselves.
I politely requested that I be credited for the flights, including DEQM, and the 3K miles for the Moscow bonus promotion. I think this is fair, considering it was a United agent that made the error. I also made it clear that I was not asking for any kind of additional compensation - just want the miles.
I'm actually kinda bummed, as I was really looking forward to this fun little adventure and getting some much-needed reading done without any distractions. It looks like I would've easily had a full row of 3 seats to myself. Oh well, we'll see what happens.
Will keep y'all posted.