Fraser

LOL! Fancy going into business Scott? Uni sucks

Boraxo

Actually, size of the person who decides to "recline" is less a factor than the seat pitch in determining when my knees pound the seatback. Usually the offender keep trying to push back, but they generally give up after a few minutes when they find it won't budge. Quite surprisingly, no one has ever complained - I think most people know that it is extremely rude to recline in E- coach.

Alas, I wish I could afford to upgrade to F on a regular basis, but not all of us are so fortunate.

I wish the FAA would require airlines to eliminate seat recline in coach seating, with the exception of E+. MRTC, jetblue or the equivalent. Until that happens, knee defender will be activated.

dhammer53

Let's turn this conversation around (just for fun).

I had a long day. I'm sitting in coach and just want to close my eyes and sleep. Since I can't sleep sitting up straight, I recline my seat. Sorry fella, I have every right to recline as I sleep my way from LAX to JFK. If you want the 'air space' of the seat back in front of you, you should have bought a 1st class ticket.

notsosmart

I can't believe the vapid comments posted above. Seats are made to recline, and everyone has a right to recline to sleep, rest, or whatever the heck they want to do.

The only time you shouldn't recline is during takeoff, landing, and as someone noted, during meal service.

...???

[This message has been edited by notsosmart (edited 10-02-2003).]

empedocles

People here are confusing right and privilege.

right: That which is just, morally good, legal, proper, or fitting.

privilege: A special advantage, immunity, permission, right, or benefit granted to or enjoyed by an individual, class, or caste.

You are given the privilege of reclining your seat, that does not mean you have the right to do so.

Your average car can reach speeds of 90+ MPH. So when you get pulled over are you going to argue that the capability of doing so gave you the right to do it?

I possess a handgun, so that I have the means to shoot people I disagree with.
Does this capability give me the right to do so?

In other words, if you think you have the right to recline your seat for your comfort, why do you think I do not have the right to prevent said reclining for my comfort?

goldmedallionflyer

Of course any advantage this gadget could have potentially provided you is negated when I discover you using one on my return trip from the head (bathroom), politely use my right to depress/ring the flight attendant call button, utilize my right to free speech and inform the FA that a passenger has installed a non-FAA approved device (that is potentially a safety hazard and/or destructive to airline property) onto the back of my seat, and then request that the FA have said device removed and confiscated immediately.

Looks like I may need to begin carrying FAA regulatory code referencing the installation of unapproved devices on commercial aircraft. Hmmm ... I wonder how large of a penalty is imposed for this illegal behavior. Depending on the level of courtesy displayed by the installing party, I could be persuaded to not follow-up with a formal complaint. This will be kinda difficult to duck out of since the device can only be installed with the tray in its lowered position - removes all chances for a claim of 'it was there before I got here ... somebody else must have done it'

But then this would all be less juvinile if you simply communicated politely and shared with me your need of space for your laptop and/or knees. Kindness goes miles towards keeping this from getting ugly.

GMF

OttoGraham

I can see how using this product would lead to somebody getting arrested.

------------------
-Otto

stillontheroad

Empedocies,
when I fly I do not have the privilege (A special advantage, immunity, permission, right, or benefit granted to or enjoyed by an individual, class, or caste.YOUR DEFINITION) of reclining my seat. I have not been given a special advantage , permission or right that was granted to an individual. All seats on the plane (except emergency and last rows) will recline so there is not special advantage to these seats.

If I recline my seat I and justdoing what is legal, proper or fitting (Again you definition)

As for your arguments of speeding 90+ or shooting someone you need to read your own definitions that say a "right" is something that is "legal" (amoung other definitions you print). These have nothing to do with the subject.

If anyone has bought one of these (as several have said they did) just don't use the d@mn thing behind my seat.

fimo

As the saying goes -- your rights end where mine begin.

Or some such.

pinniped

I don't know whether it's a right or a privilege or neither. I don't really care.

All I know is that it's an inconsiderate thing to do.

Sadly, human decency and politeness are pretty rare in the air these days.

pitflyer

Everytime someone has wanted to recline and can not, I've seen them ring the flight attendant call button -- and usually the answer is 'oh, that seat doesn't recline because of the exit row behind you'.

I'm sure if it's a normal seat blocked by the knee defender, the FA will investigate and go to the person behind the first person 'What is that thing? You are going to have to remove it'

And then let the fireworks fly. I guess we need air marshalls after all

Mary2e

OK Dan , You are entitle to get some sleep, as am I. I recline very slightly when I want to sleep knowing I might be crushing the person behind me. Plus, I have been known to grab the seatback of the sleeper in front of me HARD when I have to use the rest room .

I wish I could fly first or business, but most of my travel these days is leisure coach. Are you willing to donate miles for an upgrade?

Mary

cattle

empedocles

Yeah, I agree those were poor examples.

However, I notice no one has addressed my final point (with the exception of fimo) to indicate why they seem to think the so called rights of the recliner trump the rights of the reclinee.

As for the device, it is an interesting concept, but not practical in real life, due to the tray issue, IMHO.




[This message has been edited by empedocles (edited 10-02-2003).]

hfly

at 6'6" it is NOT possible for someone to recline into me in most coach seats. They can only cause me damage/hurt. On the rare occasion that the person in front of me insists (and the rare occasion when I'm flying Y) and calls the F/A, I explain its impossible. The FA usually takes my side. If she does not, I threaten a lawsuit. This usually shuts everyone up.