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Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.

Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.

Old Jul 2, 2014, 10:43 am
  #5326  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
OK, I think this is the one that remains, so let's give it a shot as one from the other side of the world, and without spending the evening up in the attic digging out those old timetables.

El Paso. I believe American put a DC-10 through here back in its earlier days.
Indeed! So too did Continental!
Long jetless spell to :

Albuquerque. Always a TWA town, and they had Tristars into here, again long ago.

Santa Fe. I doubt that they ever had larger than the current RJ jets there. This airport seems to have picked up over time. I think when I have been there in the past there was little or no scheduled service at all.
This airport has been served by a larger jet...

I think that takes us on to Pueblo, which was once upon a time a Frontier 737 stop. This airport has been served by a larger jet...

Colorado Springs next. Well, they had a whole airline and hub operation once, with 737s, but that fell away as well. United used to do a number of tag-on flights down from Denver, and I seem to recall that the odd one was scheduled as a DC-10.

Denver itself. Two airports, of course, over time, and I think both have had 747s. In the old one United, and in the current one both United and British Airways.
Lufthansa used to operate the longer A340-600 into Denver...

Then we get onto the trek north which Western used to hop up with their 737s, I think that included Cheyenne, Casper and Sheridan. Wonder if they ever did 727-200s into those points. I'll say not. And did Frontier do Cheyenne and Casper with 737s as well ?
I've flown into Casper on both the 727-100 (UA) and -200 (WA). Frontier did fly the 737-200 into Casper. However, did Delta ever operate the 757 into CPR? Anybody know?


That brings us to Billings, long a Northwest major point. I'll stick my neck out and say they, too, had DC-10s through there once upon a time.

As we say here "Howzat !". Hopefully I'm not a "knucklehead"
You?! Certainly not! No, a knucklehead would have said "Well, I can think of three from Colorado..." and left it at that.

And regarding I'm quite happy to drive myself - have done bits of this route in the past. I've even got to grips with this strange US habit of driving on the right-hand side of the road. Though before the first time I gave it a trial back here in the UK first. Have to say I found it most dangerous ......
Finally, we're missing one airport from this collection. It no longer enjoys jet service, much less any airline service so far as I know. However, it has service as recently as two years ago... I flew out of there on a plane that was once used to transport federal prisoners...
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 12:09 pm
  #5327  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
Well if it was such an aircraft, where was it being used ?
I think Aeroamerica may have been operating the BAC One-Eleven in Europe, perhaps from Germany. I also believe the aircraft, which may have been a 400 series, was being used for charter operations.
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 12:21 pm
  #5328  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
OK, I think this is the one that remains, so let's give it a shot as one from the other side of the world, and without spending the evening up in the attic digging out those old timetables.

Santa Fe. I doubt that they ever had larger than the current RJ jets there. This airport seems to have picked up over time. I think when I have been there in the past there was little or no scheduled service at all.

I think that takes us on to Pueblo, which was once upon a time a Frontier 737 stop.
Just to amplify a bit concerning the above comments from our good friend WHBM.....

Santa Fe (SAF): Douglas DC-9-10 service operated by Trans-Texas Airways (and perhaps later by Texas International). I flew into and out of SAF on board a TTa DC9 "Pamperjet" back in the late 60's....

Pueblo (PUB): Boeing 727-200 service operated by both Frontier and TWA. At one point, FL had an 72S overnight at PUB. It would then depart early the next morning to DEN via an intermediate stop at COS. TW operated the 72S to STL from PUB with an intermediate stop in COS as well.

Last edited by jlemon; Jul 2, 2014 at 12:26 pm
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 12:40 pm
  #5329  
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Originally Posted by Seat 2A
Finally, we're missing one airport from this collection. It no longer enjoys jet service, much less any airline service so far as I know. However, it has service as recently as two years ago... I flew out of there on a plane that was once used to transport federal prisoners...
Ah, I'll bet this was Fort Collins (FNL). The air carrier was Allegiant Air flying MD-80 aircraft nonstop to LAS several times a week before they pulled out of the market.
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 12:58 pm
  #5330  
 
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Originally Posted by jlemon
I think Aeroamerica may have been operating the BAC One-Eleven in Europe, perhaps from Germany. I also believe the aircraft, which may have been a 400 series, was being used for charter operations.
Yes, Aeroamerica, notwithstanding being headquartered at Boeing Field in Seattle, had its main operating base at Berlin Tegel airport, where they based several of their 720s to operate holiday flights down to the Mediterranean etc. The major UK holiday airlines like Dan-Air and Laker also did this. For one year Aeroamerica took an ex-American One-Eleven 400, just partially repainted it, and ran it on this work; it retained it's old AA registration, and, in accordance with the requirements of the Berlin Corridor operations, had to have US pilots, although the cabin crew were locally recruited, the same arrangement as Pan Am. It later went back to the US and served in the Florida Express fleet.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Aeroa...48b9f2c8714b64

Aeroamerica also did spot charter work from Berlin, and were a bit of an "operator of last resort" for other carriers who desperately needed an aircraft at summer weekends. So if Dan-Air, or Britannia, or other UK holiday operators had a major breakdown on an August weekend when their fleet (and everyone else's) was fully committed, it might well be an Aeroamerica 720 which turned up at Malaga or Athens 12 hours late to get them home to Manchester.
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 3:20 pm
  #5331  
 
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Redding (RDD): Boeing 737-200 (Frontier and United)
Allegiant operated a MD-80 to LAS and United sometimes sub a 727-200 on the SFO-RDD-ACV-SFO route.
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 3:39 pm
  #5332  
 
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I can't say with 100% certainty that I absolutely know the largest aircraft at all of them. For example, did Lufthansa ever operate the A340-600 into Portland?
Yes it did at least on Jun 15, 2007.

Last edited by Icecat; Jul 2, 2014 at 8:35 pm
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Old Jul 2, 2014, 11:57 pm
  #5333  
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Re. El Paso to Billings

Congratulations to WHBM for loading the bases and to jlemon for a great job of batting cleanup. You guys tag team quite nicely!

Kudos also to Icecat for the additional color commentary on both Redding and the A340-600.

Originally Posted by WHBM
Yes, Aeroamerica, notwithstanding being headquartered at Boeing Field in Seattle, had its main operating base at Berlin Tegel airport, where they based several of their 720s to operate holiday flights down to the Mediterranean etc. The major UK holiday airlines like Dan-Air and Laker also did this. For one year Aeroamerica took an ex-American One-Eleven 400, just partially repainted it, and ran it on this work; it retained it's old AA registration, and, in accordance with the requirements of the Berlin Corridor operations, had to have US pilots, although the cabin crew were locally recruited, the same arrangement as Pan Am. It later went back to the US and served in the Florida Express fleet.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Aeroa...48b9f2c8714b64

Aeroamerica also did spot charter work from Berlin, and were a bit of an "operator of last resort" for other carriers who desperately needed an aircraft at summer weekends. So if Dan-Air, or Britannia, or other UK holiday operators had a major breakdown on an August weekend when their fleet (and everyone else's) was fully committed, it might well be an Aeroamerica 720 which turned up at Malaga or Athens 12 hours late to get them home to Manchester.
Where else are we going to get this kind of detail? A big ^^ and a Thank You! to WHBM for the First Class color commentary.

Well done, Gentlemen! ^^

Last edited by Seat 2A; Jul 3, 2014 at 12:04 am
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 12:13 am
  #5334  
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Alright then, here are a few to tide y'all over for a spell.

Before doing so however, I'd like to put out an open invitation to any and all to submit a few of your own questions sometime. If you're well versed enough to answer these quiz questions, you're definitely smart enough to come up with a few of your own. C'mon gang! Show a little gumption!! Surprise us with questions only you could think up!

************************************************** ************************************************** **********************

ALL of the following questions are based upon schedules posted in the latter half of 1984

1. These days, only Alaska Airlines offers jet flights between Fairbanks and Anchorage. Back in the fall of 1984 however, five airlines served this market with jets. Identify each airline and – for a cyber pat on the back – identify the largest aircraft serving this market.

2. Identify the three airlines and their respective equipment that offered nonstop flights between Anchorage and Honolulu.

3. Identify the only route in the U.S. (as of Autumn 1984) where each of the big three L-1011 operators (Delta, Eastern and TWA) offered nonstop L-1011 service. A N S W E R E D

4. Identify the only airline to offer DC-9-10 service between Seattle and Portland (As of fall, 1984)

5. Historically, the Denver to Sioux City, Iowa market was served with nonstop DC-9 flights from Ozark. By the fall of 1984, Ozark had dropped the service and a new airline was serving the route with nonstop turboprop flights. Identify the airline and aircraft serving the DEN-SUX market. A N S W E R E D

6. By the fall of 1984, the 727-100 had been relegated to mostly short and medium length routes of less than 1000 miles. One exception was the New York-LGA to Denver route. Continental offered 727-200 nonstops while United countered with 767-200s. Identify the other airline that served this route with two daily 727-100 flights. A N S W E R E D

7. This airline offered one-stop service between Los Angeles and Washington-DCA with a single cabin aircraft outfitted throughout with 2-2 seating and upgraded service. Identify the airline, the equipment and the intermediate stop. A N S W E R E D

8. Upon arrival at Washington National, you could transfer to this company’s flights to either Dulles or Baltimore…

9. In the fall of 1984, only one airline offers nonstop standard DC-8 service between a continental US gateway city and a Caribbean destination. Identify the airline and the route.

10. In the fall of 1984, only one airline offers nonstop 707 service between a continental US gateway city and a Caribbean destination. Identify the airline and the route.

11. If you want to fly aboard an Airbus A300 between Los Angeles and Chicago, you’ll need to call this airline… A N S W E R E D

12. Were you to desire air transport between Las Vegas and the Grand Canyon in late 1984, you’d have an opportunity to choose between three different iconic turboprops, each operated by a different airline offering daily service. Identify the three airlines and their respective turboprops.

13. This Christmas you’ve decided on a ski vacation in Crested Butte, Colorado. Departing from Atlanta, you’d expected to have to connect in Denver in order to reach the nearest airport at Gunnison, CO. but no! Lo and behold, there’s a Saturday only nonstop departing Atlanta at 9:45am with breakfast served enroute. Identify the airline and aircraft providing this service, as well as the one-stop routing back to Atlanta.

14. When it comes to flights between Roanoke, Virginia and New York City in 1984, most people would call Piedmont. However, a new airline is now offering a once daily nonstop jet flight between Roanoke and Newark. Identify this airline and the equipment used.

15. It used to be you could fly between New York-JFK and Las Vegas aboard a TWA 747 or a United DC-8-61. Now neither airline offers nonstop service on this route. Identify the only airline and respective aircraft offering nonstop service on the JFK-LAS route.

16. Over the years, many airlines have provided nonstop jet service between Las Vegas and Reno. In the fall of 1984 however, service is limited to just one airline offering three almost daily flights on this route. Which airline is it? A N S W E R E D

17. If you live in Topeka, Kansas and want to fly out of town on a jet, there’s only one airline you can call and one city you can fly nonstop to. Identify the airline, the city served and the equipment used. A N S W E R E D

18. The jlemon Special: By 1984, the hub and spoke system is all the rage. However, this old airline still offers a scheduled six-stop flight between Minneapolis and Phoenix. You’ll depart Minneapolis as 8:50am, arriving Phoenix eleven hours and twenty minutes later at 6:10pm local time. Identify the airline, the routing and – if you feel up to it – the aircraft used.

19. Sticking with milkruns for a moment, if you wanted to fly direct between Las Vegas and Orlando, your only option would be a four stop flight departing Las Vegas at 12:30am and arriving Orlando at 1:33pm. Along the way you’d be served a full breakfast, a light snack and a luncheon appropriate to the two hour final leg. Identify the airline, the routing and the aircraft used.

20. If you want to fly between New York-JFK and Denver aboard a four engine jet, only two airlines can satisfy your requirement. Identify the airlines and their respective aircraft flown on this route.

21. Traditionally passengers flying between Omaha and Houston would call Braniff. In the fall of 1984 however, only one airline provides direct service with a pair of 2-stop flights into Houston’s William P. Hobby Airport. Identify the airline, the aircraft and the two intermediate stops enroute. A N S W E R E D

22. Identify the two airlines operating widebodied equipment on the New Orleans to Los Angeles route.

23. The WHBM Special: Identify this airline which in late 1984 offered scheduled DC-8 service on the 139 mile route between Port Au Prince, Haiti and Puerto Plata, Dominican Republic.

24. Identify the three U.S. domestic airlines that provided jet flights into St. Petersburg–Clearwater International Airport. You’re welcome to have a go at the aircraft types as well if you’d like.

25. You want to fly aboard a four engine turboprop between Denver and Colorado Springs. What airline do you call and what kind of plane will you be flying upon? A N S W E R E D

Last edited by Seat 2A; Jul 5, 2014 at 10:33 am
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 3:30 am
  #5335  
 
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Originally Posted by Seat 2A
Re. El Paso to Billings
I realise that, over time, I've just glanced by this route once in a while.

1971 and first time running round the US as a student with a Greyhound bus ticket, I came through downtown El Paso one midday. The old PCC trolley that ran over into Juarez was still running as I shot a photo of one out of the bus window. I believe it gave up shortly afterwards.

1994 was a holiday with good friend from LA, flew out there first and then my only trips ever on Southwest, LAX to ABQ and back in a 732, and drove up to Santa Fe where we had a pleasant few days. Drove up Sandia Crest and wondered how ABQ, thousands of feet below, can manage with an east-west runway pointing straight at the mountains. I later found that there was a Lockheed Connie stored at the Santa Fe airport, which we passed by but did not visit. Oh if only I had known in time.

Not my first time in Santa Fe, because in 1974 I repeated the Greyhound bus trip in a much more comprehensive manner, came through Albuquerque, stopped a couple of days in Santa Fe just at the time of the Festival (presumably September), then on overnight up to Denver (huge steak lunch in a bar & grill over the street from the bus depot - I must have been starving), then on to Cheyenne, on the way there on I-25 the bus ran out of fuel ...... yes, could even happen to Greyhound !

Further up Wyoming, just before you get to Buffalo WY and the end of I-25, off to the east in the absolute middle of nowhere on the Range, there is an aviation VOR-DME transmitter named Crazy Woman. It's a common en-route point for BA flights from London to LAX, and I reckon over the years it must have been pointed out, just for its distinctive name, at least four times by the crew as we passed overhead. Unfortunately the tradition of occasional commentary from up front is dying out (although BA still do it mid-flight on every domestic trip from London to Scotland and back), seemingly those infatuated with their AVOD cannot bear the film being interrupted for a moment to be told of fascinating things visible out of the window as the continents slip by underneath. Too bad. So here it is, with miles and miles of dirt road leading to it. I wonder if the cowhands there ever look up at the jet trails streaking westwards and wonder where they are going.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=43....52692&t=h&z=19

Last edited by WHBM; Jul 3, 2014 at 3:45 am
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 6:03 am
  #5336  
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Originally Posted by Seat 2A
3. Identify the only route in the U.S. (as of Autumn 1984) where each of the big three L-1011 operators (Delta, Eastern and TWA) offered nonstop L-1011 service.
this appears to be yet another variant of a question that has been posed and answered several times in the last year ... Seattle <--> Portland

Originally Posted by Seat 2A
11. If you want to fly aboard an Airbus A300 between Los Angeles and Chicago, you’ll need to call this airline.
I rode on an Eastern A300 redeye LAX-ORD in Jan 1986 ... don't recall when American introduced the Airbus into their fleet, but I'm thinking it was later ... let's stick with EA
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 9:45 am
  #5337  
 
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Originally Posted by Seat 2A
Alright then, here are a few to tide y'all over for a spell.

Before doing so however, I'd like to put out an open invitation to any and all to submit a few of your own questions sometime. If you're well versed enough to answer these quiz questions, you're definitely smart enough to come up with a few of your own. C'mon gang! Show a little gumption!! Surprise us with questions only you could think up!

************************************************** ************************************************** **********************

ALL of the following questions are based upon schedules posted in the latter half of 1984

6. By the fall of 1984, the 727-100 had been relegated to mostly short and medium length routes of less than 1000 miles. One exception was the New York-LGA to Denver route. Continental offered 727-200 nonstops while United countered with 767-200s. Identify the other airline that served this route with two daily 727-100 flights.

7. This airline offered one-stop service between Los Angeles and Washington-DCA with a single cabin aircraft outfitted throughout with 2-2 seating and upgraded service. Identify the airline, the equipment and the intermediate stop.

11. If you want to fly aboard an Airbus A300 between Los Angeles and Chicago, you’ll need to call this airline…
6. Frontier Horizon, using ex-AA 727-23s, still in AA's bare metal scheme.

7. Air One, via STL

11. Capitol
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 10:01 am
  #5338  
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Originally Posted by Seat 2A
25. You want to fly aboard a four engine turboprop between Denver and Colorado Springs. What airline do you call and what kind of plane will you be flying upon?
Rocky Mountain Airways, deHaviland Canada DHC-7
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 10:19 am
  #5339  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
Not my first time in Santa Fe, because in 1974 I repeated the Greyhound bus trip in a much more comprehensive manner...
Riding the grey dog around America is indeed roughing it; so different and occasionally downright gritty in contrast to the comparatively bland world of modern day airports and airplanes.

Back in 1984, I purchased a bus pass and blended planes, trains and busses on a wide-ranging itinerary around the country. The people I sat next to on busses were far and away the most spicy (for better or worse!)

WHBM, did you ever take advantage of the Visit USA Air Passes available to overseas residents back in the 70s?
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Old Jul 3, 2014, 10:32 am
  #5340  
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Originally Posted by jrl767
3. Identify the only route in the U.S. (as of Autumn 1984) where each of the big three L-1011 operators (Delta, Eastern and TWA) offered nonstop L-1011 service.

this appears to be yet another variant of a question that has been posed and answered several times in the last year ... Seattle <--> Portland

Yep, and once again you've swung and missed! Strike one!

Truth be known, all three airlines have operated their L-1011s on the SEA-PDX route, so this is an excellent guess. However, per the 1984 schedules I have referenced, one or two of these airlines were using 767s on the SEA-PDX run at the time.


11. If you want to fly aboard an Airbus A300 between Los Angeles and Chicago, you’ll need to call this airline.

I rode on an Eastern A300 redeye LAX-ORD in Jan 1986 ... don't recall when American introduced the Airbus into their fleet, but I'm thinking it was later ... let's stick with EA

Alas, it was not Eastern. Please see JoeDTW's answer below. BTW, I may be wrong here, but I think American only operated its A300s along the eastern seaboard and the Caribbean. I'm not sure I've heard of one scheduled out to the west coast. Anyone have further insight on this?


25. You want to fly aboard a four engine turboprop between Denver and Colorado Springs. What airline do you call and what kind of plane will you be flying upon?

Rocky Mountain Airways, deHaviland Canada DHC-7

Correct! (Dang! I was hoping this would be a tough one!)
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