Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.
Feb 3, 2014, 12:16 pm
#4186
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
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Posts: 8,476
Just to keep us rolling along, I’ve dug up my Air Bradshaw (UK worldwide timetable equivalent of OAG) for July 1949, 65 years ago, which is possibly beyond the experience of any of us. It’s all very much from a different world. Given the background of most here, from North America, I’ll emphasise that area.
1. Two US operators from New York to London. One is Pan Am of course. Who is the other, running Constellations ? Answered, American Overseas Airlines
2. A DC4 left Dallas at 0815 once a week, and ended up in La Paz, Bolivia, more than 24 hours later. Which airline ? Answered, Braniff
3. Chicago IL leaving at 0855 daily through Moline to Burlington IA on a DC3. Which airline ? Answered, Braniff again
4. Canadian Pacific served Montreal, Winnipeg, Edmonton and Vancouver. How often were their flights between these points ? Answered, there were none. CP was only allowed to do local bush flights at this time, from a number of unconnected bases.
5. Which US carrier did multiple daily flights from New York to Montreal and Ottawa ? Answered, Colonial Airlines
6. A DC4 left Chicago at 0815 daily for St Louis, Memphis, Little Rock and Houston. Which airline ? Answered, Chicago & Southern AL
7. Yet another DC3 leaves Spokane WA at 0630, with no less than 14 intermediate stops to Idaho Falls, where it arrives mid-afternoon. Which airline ? Looking at it, I think you could outrun this flight end-to-end nowadays with a good sports car. Answered. Empire Airlines
8. National Airlines left New Orleans at 0700 each morning, getting to New York at 2150. I don’t think it was really intended as a through flight because there were 16 intermediate stops ! What type of aircraft did they use for this marathon ? Answered, Lockheed Lodestar (L-18)
9 A DC4, unpressurised of course, came through Anchorage three times a week headed for Manila. Where did this flight start from and which airline ? Answered, Northwest, from MSP
10. You could leave Fresno CA at 0840 in the morning, and arrive at Newark NJ on the same aircraft at 0850 the next day. Who did such a lengthy milk run ? Answered, TWA (on a DC3)
11. Pan Am’s Round-the-World flight used a Lockheed Constellation from New York over the Atlantic to Calcutta in India, where this aircraft turned back. What aircraft type did Pan Am use for the continuation on across the Pacific to San Francisco ? Answered, a DC4
1. Two US operators from New York to London. One is Pan Am of course. Who is the other, running Constellations ? Answered, American Overseas Airlines
2. A DC4 left Dallas at 0815 once a week, and ended up in La Paz, Bolivia, more than 24 hours later. Which airline ? Answered, Braniff
3. Chicago IL leaving at 0855 daily through Moline to Burlington IA on a DC3. Which airline ? Answered, Braniff again
4. Canadian Pacific served Montreal, Winnipeg, Edmonton and Vancouver. How often were their flights between these points ? Answered, there were none. CP was only allowed to do local bush flights at this time, from a number of unconnected bases.
5. Which US carrier did multiple daily flights from New York to Montreal and Ottawa ? Answered, Colonial Airlines
6. A DC4 left Chicago at 0815 daily for St Louis, Memphis, Little Rock and Houston. Which airline ? Answered, Chicago & Southern AL
7. Yet another DC3 leaves Spokane WA at 0630, with no less than 14 intermediate stops to Idaho Falls, where it arrives mid-afternoon. Which airline ? Looking at it, I think you could outrun this flight end-to-end nowadays with a good sports car. Answered. Empire Airlines
8. National Airlines left New Orleans at 0700 each morning, getting to New York at 2150. I don’t think it was really intended as a through flight because there were 16 intermediate stops ! What type of aircraft did they use for this marathon ? Answered, Lockheed Lodestar (L-18)
9 A DC4, unpressurised of course, came through Anchorage three times a week headed for Manila. Where did this flight start from and which airline ? Answered, Northwest, from MSP
10. You could leave Fresno CA at 0840 in the morning, and arrive at Newark NJ on the same aircraft at 0850 the next day. Who did such a lengthy milk run ? Answered, TWA (on a DC3)
11. Pan Am’s Round-the-World flight used a Lockheed Constellation from New York over the Atlantic to Calcutta in India, where this aircraft turned back. What aircraft type did Pan Am use for the continuation on across the Pacific to San Francisco ? Answered, a DC4
Last edited by WHBM; Feb 9, 2014 at 5:02 pm
Feb 3, 2014, 1:03 pm
#4187
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that is a GREAT set of questions!
#1 - the other TATL Constellation operator in 1949 was doubtless TWA
#1 - the other TATL Constellation operator in 1949 was doubtless TWA
Feb 3, 2014, 1:26 pm
#4188
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It’s a beautiful Saturday morning here in the troposphere. I’m sitting in seat 2D, cruising high over the Wind River Range of northwestern Wyoming as we wing our way down to Atlanta, Georgia. ...
And finally, a bonus question:
Who was the first FlyerTalker to post questions to the Old Timer’s Airliner Quiz from onboard an airplane?
And finally, a bonus question:
Who was the first FlyerTalker to post questions to the Old Timer’s Airliner Quiz from onboard an airplane?
2A was traveling aboard a two month old Alaska Airlines 737-990ER bearing a sticker dedicating it to recently retired Alaska President and CEO Bill Ayer. Mr. Ayer is so highly revered amongst most Alaska employees that I'm surprised they didn't paint his face on the tail of this aircraft instead of the Eskimo's!
... PS -- I have a pic of the FA's covering up a Bill Ayers plaque with a 12th Man flag from my flight to EWR a couple of weeks ago ...
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/22268320-post99.html
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/22268320-post99.html
Feb 3, 2014, 2:54 pm
#4190
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well I have learned something today since
is indeed beyond my experience and I wound up doing a bit of researchit was actually American Overseas Airlines
Feb 3, 2014, 3:59 pm
#4191
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 8,476
#1 correct. American Overseas Airlines was a joint venture between the American Export shipping line and American Airlines. Immediately after WW2 Pan Am got transatlantic rights to almost all of Europe, plus American Overseas to northern Europe, and TWA to southern Europe. These routes somewhat mirrored what these airlines had operated for the military in the latter stages of the war. The AOA fleet actually had the American Airlines livery of the time, and they also bought big Boeing Stratocruisers, which came into service one month after my timetable's date. The following year, 1950, American (who had majority control) accepted a bid from Pan Am for the airline, and sold out, but the CAB immediately licensed TWA for the best points to maintain dual designated cities, so a bit of a hollow victory for Juan Trippe. Among other things it accounts for TWA's No 1 European destination being London, but their European headquarters was always down in Paris.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=am...ml%3B534%3B341
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=am...ml%3B534%3B341
Last edited by WHBM; Feb 3, 2014 at 4:07 pm
Feb 4, 2014, 9:57 am
#4192
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 782
Just to keep us rolling along, I’ve dug up my Air Bradshaw (UK worldwide timetable equivalent of OAG) for July 1949, 65 years ago, which is possibly beyond the experience of any of us. It’s all very much from a different world. Given the background of most here, from North America, I’ll emphasise that area.
1. Two US operators from New York to London. One is Pan Am of course. Who is the other, running Constellations ? Answered
2. A DC4 left Dallas at 0815 once a week, and ended up in La Paz, Bolivia, more than 24 hours later. Which airline ?
3. Chicago IL leaving at 0855 daily through Moline to Burlington IA on a DC3. Which airline ?
4. Canadian Pacific served Montreal, Winnipeg, Edmonton and Vancouver. How often were their flights between these points ?
5. Which US carrier did multiple daily flights from New York to Montreal and Ottawa ?
6. A DC4 left Chicago at 0815 daily for St Louis, Memphis, Little Rock and Houston. Which airline ?
7. Yet another DC3 leaves Spokane WA at 0630, with no less than 14 intermediate stops to Idaho Falls, where it arrives mid-afternoon. Which airline ? Looking at it, I think you could outrun this flight end-to-end nowadays with a good sports car.
8. National Airlines left New Orleans at 0700 each morning, getting to New York at 2150. I don’t think it was really intended as a through flight because there were 16 intermediate stops ! What type of aircraft did they use for this marathon ?
9 A DC4, unpressurised of course, came through Anchorage three times a week headed for Manila. Where did this flight start from and which airline ?
10. You could leave Fresno CA at 0840 in the morning, and arrive at Newark NJ on the same aircraft at 0850 the next day. Who did such a lengthy milk run ?
11. Pan Am’s Round-the-World flight used a Lockheed Constellation from New York over the Atlantic to Calcutta in India, where this aircraft turned back. What aircraft type did Pan Am use for the continuation on across the Pacific to San Francisco ?
1. Two US operators from New York to London. One is Pan Am of course. Who is the other, running Constellations ? Answered
2. A DC4 left Dallas at 0815 once a week, and ended up in La Paz, Bolivia, more than 24 hours later. Which airline ?
3. Chicago IL leaving at 0855 daily through Moline to Burlington IA on a DC3. Which airline ?
4. Canadian Pacific served Montreal, Winnipeg, Edmonton and Vancouver. How often were their flights between these points ?
5. Which US carrier did multiple daily flights from New York to Montreal and Ottawa ?
6. A DC4 left Chicago at 0815 daily for St Louis, Memphis, Little Rock and Houston. Which airline ?
7. Yet another DC3 leaves Spokane WA at 0630, with no less than 14 intermediate stops to Idaho Falls, where it arrives mid-afternoon. Which airline ? Looking at it, I think you could outrun this flight end-to-end nowadays with a good sports car.
8. National Airlines left New Orleans at 0700 each morning, getting to New York at 2150. I don’t think it was really intended as a through flight because there were 16 intermediate stops ! What type of aircraft did they use for this marathon ?
9 A DC4, unpressurised of course, came through Anchorage three times a week headed for Manila. Where did this flight start from and which airline ?
10. You could leave Fresno CA at 0840 in the morning, and arrive at Newark NJ on the same aircraft at 0850 the next day. Who did such a lengthy milk run ?
11. Pan Am’s Round-the-World flight used a Lockheed Constellation from New York over the Atlantic to Calcutta in India, where this aircraft turned back. What aircraft type did Pan Am use for the continuation on across the Pacific to San Francisco ?
4. 1x day
5. Canadian Colonial, which merged with Eastern in 1956.
6. Chicago and Southern, which merged with Delta in 1953.
8. Lockheed Lodestar - National was the only trunk airline that did not fly DC-3s.
10. TWA and United both served Fresno in the 1940s and 1950s. I'll guess this is a trick question, and choose TWA.
11. Boeing Stratocruiser.
Feb 4, 2014, 9:30 pm
#4194
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Just to keep us rolling along, I’ve dug up my Air Bradshaw (UK worldwide timetable equivalent of OAG) for July 1949, 65 years ago, which is possibly beyond the experience of any of us. It’s all very much from a different world. Given the background of most here, from North America, I’ll emphasise that area. ...
3. Chicago IL leaving at 0855 daily through Moline to Burlington IA on a DC3. Which airline ?...
3. Chicago IL leaving at 0855 daily through Moline to Burlington IA on a DC3. Which airline ?...
Feb 4, 2014, 11:33 pm
#4195
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 8,476
2. Braniff. Yes. Braniff's flights to South America, not too frequent, were already running.
4. 1x day No, sorry
5. Canadian Colonial, which merged with Eastern in 1956. Yes
6. Chicago and Southern, which merged with Delta in 1953. Yes
8. Lockheed Lodestar - National was the only trunk airline that did not fly DC-3s. Yes
10. TWA and United both served Fresno in the 1940s and 1950s. I'll guess this is a trick question, and choose TWA. Oh dear, what a reputation I have ! But Yes. Actually, I wonder which of the others might be a trick question ...
11. Boeing Stratocruiser. Sorry, but No.
4. 1x day No, sorry
5. Canadian Colonial, which merged with Eastern in 1956. Yes
6. Chicago and Southern, which merged with Delta in 1953. Yes
8. Lockheed Lodestar - National was the only trunk airline that did not fly DC-3s. Yes
10. TWA and United both served Fresno in the 1940s and 1950s. I'll guess this is a trick question, and choose TWA. Oh dear, what a reputation I have ! But Yes. Actually, I wonder which of the others might be a trick question ...
11. Boeing Stratocruiser. Sorry, but No.
Feb 4, 2014, 11:39 pm
#4196
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 8,476
Almost there, Gilbert, it was indeed Northwest, and there were flights from Seattle through Anchorage to Tokyo they did on different days of the week, but these Manila flights originated elsewhere.
Last edited by WHBM; Feb 5, 2014 at 3:08 am
Feb 4, 2014, 11:40 pm
#4197
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 8,476
Feb 5, 2014, 4:06 am
#4198
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this trip came into ANC from MSP
**************************************************
I was browsing the Nov 1947 NW timetable and found some material that I thought was worth sharing ...especially in comparison to today's travel paradigms
FLIGHT TIMES
In Nov 1947 a NW DC4 left MSP at 0130, arriving ANC at 1155; the return flight departed at 1830 and was scheduled to block in at 1110
In Nov 2014 a DL 757 is scheduled to depart MSP at 1730 and arrive ANC at 2015; the return trip leaves at 0600 and gets in at 1430
FARES
In Nov 1947, MSP-MNL was $806.40 one way and $1467.60 round trip; no minimum or maximum stay restrictions
In Nov 2014, MSP-MNL costs $787.10 one way and $1584.70 round trip (booked in Feb; Thurs departure, return the following Wednesday) ($6616.10 one way and $7880.70 round trip in Business Elite)
PENALTIES
Apr 1947: Passengers who fail to cancel reserved space prior to departure of aircraft, except when failure is for certain reasons specified in official tariff, will be assessed a service charge of 25% of one-way fare to destination, or to the first stopover of more than six hours duration shown on ticket, or the sum of $50 U.S. currency, whichever is less.
Feb 2014:
RES REQ 50 DAYS BEFORE DEPART
TKTG WITHIN 3 DAYS AFTER RESERVATIONS OR AT LEAST 50 DAYS BEFORE DEPART WHICHEVER IS EARLIER
ALL SEGMENTS MUST BE CONFIRMED
MINIMUM STAY NO RESTRICTION
MAXIMUM STAY NO RESTRICTION
CANCEL-350.00 USD
CHANGE-300.00 USD
plus lots of others ...
OTHER INTERESTING FACTS FROM 1947:
(International and domestic flights): You are the guest of Northwest Airlines in flight during meal time.
(International flights): Baggage includes all luggage sch as brief cases, portfolios and bags, packages, parcels, typewriters, camera equipment and similar articles, either carried in the cabin or checked in the cargo department sic. Other articles carried by the passenger in the cabin such as overcoats, umbrellas, and pocket cameras will be regarded as personal weight and not weighed as baggage. Free baggage weight allowance is limited to 30 kilos or 66 pounds on each full or half fare ticket.
(Domestic flights): Forty pounds of baggage including brief cases and hand luggage will be carried free of charge on any ticket. ... Baggage in excess of 50 pounds ... will be carried only upon previous special arrangement. Excess baggage will be charged at the rate of 1/2 of one per cent of the one way fare per pound, with a minimum charge of 25 cents.
(Domestic flights): Electric razors available on all flights.
Last edited by jrl767; Feb 5, 2014 at 6:39 pm Reason: additional interesting information
Feb 6, 2014, 6:31 pm
#4199
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: IWA
Programs: DL, AA
Posts: 3,924
11. Pan Am’s Round-the-World flight used a Lockheed Constellation from New York over the Atlantic to Calcutta in India, where this aircraft turned back. What aircraft type did Pan Am use for the continuation on across the Pacific to San Francisco ?
__________________
My grandfather flew for Pan American from 1928-1963 was transferred from Miami to San Francisco after WWII. As I remember from his stories (trust me he had some very interesting stories), It was a DC-4.
I found this the PanAm schedule for this flight 7-1-49
http://www.everythingpanam.com/image...20Schedule.jpg
__________________
My grandfather flew for Pan American from 1928-1963 was transferred from Miami to San Francisco after WWII. As I remember from his stories (trust me he had some very interesting stories), It was a DC-4.
I found this the PanAm schedule for this flight 7-1-49
http://www.everythingpanam.com/image...20Schedule.jpg
Last edited by Icecat; Feb 7, 2014 at 4:34 pm Reason: adding schedule
Feb 6, 2014, 10:36 pm
#4200
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Just checking in from Buenos Aires. Thanks to WHBM for a great set of questions as well as all the participants for all the great answers. Alas, all the questions I might have known have been answered but I've sure enjoyed reading the responses nonetheless. Adios amigos! Vuele con dios!