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Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.

Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.

Old Aug 5, 2022, 9:25 pm
  #26221  
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Originally Posted by moondog
1976 sounds a bit to early for my guess, but I'm going to throw it out there anyway: XNA.
I don't think XNA existed in 1976. FYV perhaps?

Originally Posted by jrl767
I’m hard pressed to think of eight nonstop destinations from SHV, never mind 12 … otoh, Birmingham/BHM (population ~0.5M) would be a bit easier to believe, with 72S/D9S/D8S services
If there's a conditional bonus bonus question I'm ready to take a crack at the 12 nonstop destinations out of SHV in 1976. I can think of 4 that don't even require leaving the state of Louisiana!

Last edited by Herb687; Aug 5, 2022 at 9:31 pm
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Old Aug 5, 2022, 10:39 pm
  #26222  
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four in Louisiana are easy — AEX (ESF), MLU, BTR, MSY

four more — DFW, MEM, ATL, JAN

four more? LIT, IAH, BHM … drawing a blank on the last …
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Last edited by jrl767; Aug 5, 2022 at 11:27 pm
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 3:14 am
  #26223  
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Originally Posted by Herb687
If there's a conditional bonus bonus question I'm ready to take a crack at the 12 nonstop destinations out of SHV in 1976. I can think of 4 that don't even require leaving the state of Louisiana!
DFW, HOU.
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 4:13 am
  #26224  
 
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Originally Posted by Herb687

If there's a conditional bonus bonus question I'm ready to take a crack at the 12 nonstop destinations out of SHV in 1976.
I think it was a bit of a chance that Shreveport became a node for Delta, arising from their 1953 merger with Chicago & Southern. Delta had the 'minor stops' east-west route from Atlanta to Dallas, while C&S had a comparable north-south long-line route from Chicago to Houston, and the two crossed at Shreveport. The various non-stop services would be aided by the ability, in regulation days, to have any stopping pattern along your authorised routes (which here dated from air mail days), so all those minor points along to Atlanta etc could be served in varying combinations through the day.
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 9:38 am
  #26225  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
I think it was a bit of a chance that Shreveport became a node for Delta, arising from their 1953 merger with Chicago & Southern. Delta had the 'minor stops' east-west route from Atlanta to Dallas, while C&S had a comparable north-south long-line route from Chicago to Houston, and the two crossed at Shreveport. The various non-stop services would be aided by the ability, in regulation days, to have any stopping pattern along your authorised routes (which here dated from air mail days), so all those minor points along to Atlanta etc could be served in varying combinations through the day.
I have a follow-up about Shreveport that pertains to US Air circa 1980, and presumably Allegheny before the name change. They served an inordinate number of destinations from a city in the northeast that was on par with Shreveport in terms of both population and importance. I don't think it was ever a "hub", though it could have been due to one of its acquisitions. I flew through this airport twice on US Air and didn't need to get off of the airplane during transit.

What city (airport) am I thinking of? What were the routes served (I don't know all of them myself, but I'm guessing some of you guys might).
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 11:02 am
  #26226  
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Originally Posted by Herb687
Sounds like Shreveport. I know that at one point in time SHV had a Crown Room lounge. And with DL's milk runs all around the Southeast it wouldn't be tough to find 12 other dots on the map.

SHV with 727, 72S, and DC9?
Bonus: Shreveport is correct!

And the aircraft types you've guessed are correct as well being the Boeing 727-100 and 727-200 and the McDonnell Douglas DC-9-30 (I'm sure you meant the D9S and thus not the DC-9-10).

Here are the daily nonstop flights operated by Delta into Shreveport in early 1976. Note that DL was actually operating nonstop service into SHV from thirteen (13) different airports at this time....

1. Alexandria (ESF) - Two nonstops: 2 x D9S
2. Atlanta (ATL) - One nonstop: 1 x 72S
3. Beaumont/Port Arthur (BPT) - One nonstop: 1 x 72S
4. Birmingham (BHM) - Two nonstops: 1 x 72S, 1 x D9S
5. Columbus, GA (CSG) - One nonstop: 1 x D9S
6. Dallas/Fort Worth (DFW) - Seven nonstops: 1 x 727, 3 x 72S, 3 x D9S
7. Houston Intercontinental (IAH) - Three nonstops: 1 x 72S, 2 x D9S
8. Jackson (JAN) - Four nonstops: 1 x 727, 1 x 72S, 2 x D9S
9. Little Rock (LIT) - Three nonstops: 3 x D9S
10. Memphis (MEM) - Three nonstops: 1 x 72S, 2 x D9S
11. Monroe (MLU) - Three nonstops: 1 x 72S, 2 x D9S
12. Montgomery (MGM) - One nonstop: 1 x D9S
13. New Orleans (MSY) Three nonstops: 3 x D9S

Total: Thirty-four (34) daily flights

And here are the daily flights operated by Delta into Shreveport on a direct, no change of plane basis in early 1976. Note that SHV actually had direct DL service from twenty-five (25) different airports at this time....

Atlanta (ATL) - Eleven direct flights: 1 x 727 (two stops en route), 3 X 72S (one flight made one stop en route and the other two flights made two stops en route), 7 x D9S (four flights made one stop en route and the other three flights made two stops en route)
Baltimore (BAL) - Two direct flights: 1 X 72S, 1 x D9S (both flights made three stops en route)
Bangor (BGR) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (four stops en route)
Baton Rouge (BTR) - Two direct flights: 2 x D9S (both flights made one stop at ESF)
Birmingham (BHM) - Three direct flights: 1 x 727,1 x 72S, 1 x D9S (all three flights made one stop at JAN)
Boston (BOS) - Four direct flights: 3 x 72S (one flight made three stops en route and the other two flights made four stops en route), 1 x D9S (three stops en route)
Chicago (ORD) - Four direct flights: 1 x 72S (three stops en route), 3 x D9S (one flight made one stop en route and the other two flights made two stops en route)
Detroit (DTW) - One direct flight: 1 x 72S (two stops en route)
Evansville (EVV) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (two stops en route)
Fort Wayne (FWA) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (two stops en route)
Indianapolis (IND) - Three direct flights: 1 x 72S (one stop en route), 2 x D9S (one flight made one stop en route and the other flight made three stops en route)
Jackson (JAN) - Two direct flights: 1 x 72S, 1 x D9S (both flights made one stop at MLU)
Knoxville (TYS) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (two stops en route)
Los Angeles (LAX) - One direct flight: 1 x 727 (one stop en route at DFW)
Macon, GA (MCN) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (two stops en route)
Memphis (MEM) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (one stop en route at LIT)
Meridian, MS (MEI) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (one stop en route at JAN)
New Orleans (MSY) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (two stops en route at BTR and ESF)
New York Kennedy (JFK) - One direct flight: 1 x 72S (two stops en route)
New York LaGuardia (LGA) - Two direct flights: 1 x 72S (one stop en route), 1 x D9S (two stops en route)
Philadelphia (PHL) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (three stops en route)
St. Louis (STL) - Two direct flights: 2 x D9S (both flights made one stop en route at either LIT or MEM)
Toledo (TOL) - One direct flight: 1 x D9S (three stops en route)
Washington Dulles (IAD) - Two direct flights: 1 x 72S, 1 x D9S (both flights made three stops en route)
Washington National (DCA) - One direct flight: 1 x 72S (three stops en route)

Interesting to see Delta operating the 727-100 into Shreveport as this was a fairly rare bird on their routes serving the deep south. Here's a link to a photo of one their 727 aircraft in Miami in 1976. Note the special 1776-1976 bicentennial decal on the fuselage just behind the flight deck....

https://www.airliners.net/photo/Delt...7-95/2288031/L

It appears this particular 727 was later operated by Air Nauru.

Shreveport does not have much in the way of DL service at the present time with only three nonstops a day to Atlanta operated by Delta Connection, all flown with Canadair RJ equipment. However, SHV currently does have scheduled wide body cargo flights operated by FedEx with the A300-600R.
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Last edited by jlemon; Aug 7, 2022 at 10:04 am Reason: clarification & corrected and additional info
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 11:57 am
  #26227  
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Originally Posted by moondog
I have a follow-up about Shreveport that pertains to US Air circa 1980, and presumably Allegheny before the name change. They served an inordinate number of destinations from a city in the northeast that was on par with Shreveport in terms of both population and importance. I don't think it was ever a "hub", though it could have been due to one of its acquisitions. I flew through this airport twice on US Air and didn't need to get off of the airplane during transit.

What city (airport) am I thinking of? What were the routes served (I don't know all of them myself, but I'm guessing some of you guys might).
other than the PIT and PHL hubs, I recall US (and AL before them, and Mohawk before AL) having a large concentration of service at Buffalo/BUF

in the 1980 timeframe, USAir destinations probably included YYZ, ROC, SYR, ALB, BOS, PVD, BDL, LGA, JFK, EWR, DCA, PHL, PIT, CLE, CMH, IND, DTW, and others; flights would have featured the BAC 1-11, DC-9-30, and 727-200
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 12:04 pm
  #26228  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
I think it was a bit of a chance that Shreveport became a node for Delta, arising from their 1953 merger with Chicago & Southern. Delta had the 'minor stops' east-west route from Atlanta to Dallas, while C&S had a comparable north-south long-line route from Chicago to Houston, and the two crossed at Shreveport. The various non-stop services would be aided by the ability, in regulation days, to have any stopping pattern along your authorised routes (which here dated from air mail days), so all those minor points along to Atlanta etc could be served in varying combinations through the day.
I concur completely. And I have no doubt that the routes into Shreveport from Houston, Beaumont/Port Arthur, Little Rock, Memphis, St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit and Indianapolis were all inherited from Chicago & Southern when Delta acquired and merged with C&S in 1953 (with the combined airlines then using the name "Delta C&S" for a few years).
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 12:18 pm
  #26229  
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Originally Posted by jlemon
Shreveport does not have much in the way of DL service at the present time with only three nonstops a day to Atlanta operated by Delta Connection, all flown with Canadair RJ equipment. However, SHV currently does have scheduled wide body cargo flights operated by FedEx with the A300-600R.
And even wider body unscheduled flights with 747 freighters. Western Global Airlines has a maintenance facility at SHV.
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 4:10 pm
  #26230  
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Originally Posted by Herb687
I don't think XNA existed in 1976. FYV perhaps?
Yep, I believe Northwest Arkansas Regional Airport (XNA) opened in 1998. It replaced Fayetteville Municipal (FYV) which in 1976 was served by the original Frontier Airlines with Convair 580 equipment. By 1977, Frontier had introduced 737-200 service from FYV to DFW via a stop in Fort Smith (FSM).
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Old Aug 6, 2022, 4:19 pm
  #26231  
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Originally Posted by jrl767
other than the PIT and PHL hubs, I recall US (and AL before them, and Mohawk before AL) having a large concentration of service at Buffalo/BUF

in the 1980 timeframe, USAir destinations probably included YYZ, ROC, SYR, ALB, BOS, PVD, BDL, LGA, JFK, EWR, DCA, PHL, PIT, CLE, CMH, IND, DTW, and others; flights would have featured the BAC 1-11, DC-9-30, and 727-200
Yes! BUF is indeed the airport I was thinking of. Your destination list is far more extensive than mine (I don't have an OAG on hand myself), but all destinations were in the northeast and midwest because US was still a regional airline at the time.
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Old Aug 7, 2022, 7:25 am
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May surprise some that there was once considerable UK experience of Shreveport LA, as the Barksdale USAF base, opposite side of the city to the commercial airport, was used very regularly in the 1960s-80s for joint USAF-RAF training and experience operations for bombers, and on some occasions a significant RAF presence of mainstream aircraft, tankers, and a whole support crew were there, being periodically changed over.

I wonder if any of the bars in town remember the Brits. Possibly subsequent B Cal and then British Airways captains on the Houston to London flight looked down on passing overhead, and recalled youthful days there. . Articles in UK aviation magazines over the years described the operations (though not the bars ...).
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Old Aug 7, 2022, 10:18 am
  #26233  
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Originally Posted by WHBM
May surprise some that there was once considerable UK experience of Shreveport LA, as the Barksdale USAF base, opposite side of the city to the commercial airport, was used very regularly in the 1960s-80s for joint USAF-RAF training and experience operations for bombers, and on some occasions a significant RAF presence of mainstream aircraft, tankers, and a whole support crew were there, being periodically changed over.

I wonder if any of the bars in town remember the Brits. Possibly subsequent B Cal and then British Airways captains on the Houston to London flight looked down on passing overhead, and recalled youthful days there. . Articles in UK aviation magazines over the years described the operations (though not the bars ...).
When we embark upon a road trip heading to the western U.S., we usually take Interstate 49 from Lafayette to Shreveport where we then pick up Interstate 20 to the Dallas/Fort Worth area. There's a freeway loop on the west side of Shreveport that passes quite close to the airport. On a number of occasions while passing by, I've noticed USAF KC-10 and KC-135R aerial refueling tankers practicing takeoffs and landings at SHV and one time I even saw a B-52 doing a touch and go there (the bomber was most likely based at nearby Barksdale AFB).

So here's a follow up bonus quiz question concerning Shreveport in 1976.....

What was the only other airline operating jet service into SHV in 1976 and what was the most distant destination served by this air carrier with the flight in question departing from the airport on a direct, no change of plane basis plus where did this flight stop en route and what was the aircraft type? Please be sure to provide all four components of this question with your answer. ANSWERED

Last edited by jlemon; Aug 7, 2022 at 1:15 pm Reason: clarification concerning the bonus quiz question
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Old Aug 7, 2022, 10:46 am
  #26234  
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Originally Posted by jlemon
So here's a follow up bonus quiz question concerning Shreveport in 1976.....

What was the only other airline operating jet service into SHV in 1976 and what was the most distant destination served by this air carrier from the airport on a direct, no change of plane basis plus where did this flight stop en route and what was the aircraft type?
whew, I’m almost out of breath reading this four-questions-in-one-long-question
  • Texas International
  • Mexico City
  • McAllen/MFE, Houston/IAH, Beaumont-Port Arthur/BPT
  • DC-9-10
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Old Aug 7, 2022, 11:01 am
  #26235  
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Originally Posted by jrl767
whew, Iím almost out of breath reading this four-questions-in-one-long-question
  • Texas International
  • Mexico City
  • McAllen/MFE, Houston/IAH, Beaumont-Port Arthur/BPT
  • DC-9-10
That's because you're getting old. And that's also a great guess as Texas International was indeed serving Shreveport at this time.

However, TI wasn't operating DC9 or D9S jet service into SHV in early 1976 as their service into the airport was exclusively flown with Convair 600 equipment with just two flights a day. Plus, the flight in question did not originate in Mexico City nor did it stop in McAllen, Houston or Beaumont/Port Arthur.

And please note we are looking for a flight departing from Shreveport and thus not an arriving flight.
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