Tumi vs. Travelpro vs. Briggs & Riley Quality
Mar 18, 2012, 12:06 am
#107
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Well, from what little research I've done so far, product quality does seem to correlate to some degree with the strength of the warranty.
Are there any great quality lines with crappy warranties?
Now, I completely agree that a strong warranty doesn't mean the $300 bag is better than it's $170 competitor. But I'll take the $170 bag with the strong warranty over the $300 bag with the lousy warranty every day of the week.
Are there any great quality lines with crappy warranties?
Now, I completely agree that a strong warranty doesn't mean the $300 bag is better than it's $170 competitor. But I'll take the $170 bag with the strong warranty over the $300 bag with the lousy warranty every day of the week.
Worst warranty in the Tv business - 90 days.
Snap on warranty isn't as good as Craftsman yet its a much better tool.
Uncle Dave
Mar 18, 2012, 6:05 am
#108
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
Uncle Dave, widespread fraying and a zipper ripping off its seam.
With the previous repair, it was the same, along with a panel of the ballistic material that was so worn you could almost see through it, and it had to be replaced.
The bag is decomposing. I'll never buy Tumi again.
With the previous repair, it was the same, along with a panel of the ballistic material that was so worn you could almost see through it, and it had to be replaced.
The bag is decomposing. I'll never buy Tumi again.
Mar 18, 2012, 10:47 am
#109
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Fair enough. If that were my experience Id feel the same.
My experience is simply not that at all. The Tumi products I have have held up over the span of 15-18 years while undergoing massive beating by the airline and me.
Ive also experienced warranty coverage that could have been denied.
Ive had a few pieces promptly fixed many for simply the cost of shipping alone when Tumi could have charged me so there is the written warranty and there is the practice and very often those 2 arent the same.
My lexus warranty didn't cover the brake accumulator - a 1000 part and 1000 labor but they fixed it anyway.
Buying one product over another based on a warranty alone doesn't make sense. Lets not forget about the history of companies offering lifetime warranties filing for bankruptcy and leaving clients in the lurch during that time. (B&R Ive heard has done this to its client base).
The key to me is how often will it break to begin with (snap on vs craftsman) I dont care If I can go to sears in the morning and get a new wrench I want to finish the job tonight and be on the water tomorrow morning with my boat and 5 guests. The warranty in effect does me little good at the time of failure and a "free fix" plus shipping in weeks isn't a consolation.
When a rivet popped in my B&R frame because 5 years of Amsterdams cobblestone streets finally took their toll I needed to find a guy in a local shop that has the right length a width Rivet gun to fix it- when a screw comes out of a Tumi frame I can fix it myself or any luggage shop in the town can.
Im not a Br&R hater- hardley, I have had a few pieces of their luggage and I liked them, I also had one Travelpro piece that left with an Ex I liked a lot too, but when comparing price features and real world performance which the warranty is only a part of - I go back to Tumi every-time for my large pieces and go back and forth between Red Oxx and Tom Binh for my "soft" pieces.
Between all these companies it comes down to the features of the bag itself, and I find the TP and B&r just plain- very good, but just plain.
Love to see a picture of that defect just to have it on hand. Send me a link to your backpack review so I can see what you liked.
Id go medieval (Im talking old school pliers and blowtorches) on them or anyone that tried that crap with me.
Uncle Dave
My experience is simply not that at all. The Tumi products I have have held up over the span of 15-18 years while undergoing massive beating by the airline and me.
Ive also experienced warranty coverage that could have been denied.
Ive had a few pieces promptly fixed many for simply the cost of shipping alone when Tumi could have charged me so there is the written warranty and there is the practice and very often those 2 arent the same.
My lexus warranty didn't cover the brake accumulator - a 1000 part and 1000 labor but they fixed it anyway.
Buying one product over another based on a warranty alone doesn't make sense. Lets not forget about the history of companies offering lifetime warranties filing for bankruptcy and leaving clients in the lurch during that time. (B&R Ive heard has done this to its client base).
The key to me is how often will it break to begin with (snap on vs craftsman) I dont care If I can go to sears in the morning and get a new wrench I want to finish the job tonight and be on the water tomorrow morning with my boat and 5 guests. The warranty in effect does me little good at the time of failure and a "free fix" plus shipping in weeks isn't a consolation.
When a rivet popped in my B&R frame because 5 years of Amsterdams cobblestone streets finally took their toll I needed to find a guy in a local shop that has the right length a width Rivet gun to fix it- when a screw comes out of a Tumi frame I can fix it myself or any luggage shop in the town can.
Im not a Br&R hater- hardley, I have had a few pieces of their luggage and I liked them, I also had one Travelpro piece that left with an Ex I liked a lot too, but when comparing price features and real world performance which the warranty is only a part of - I go back to Tumi every-time for my large pieces and go back and forth between Red Oxx and Tom Binh for my "soft" pieces.
Between all these companies it comes down to the features of the bag itself, and I find the TP and B&r just plain- very good, but just plain.
Love to see a picture of that defect just to have it on hand. Send me a link to your backpack review so I can see what you liked.
Id go medieval (Im talking old school pliers and blowtorches) on them or anyone that tried that crap with me.
Uncle Dave
Mar 18, 2012, 11:07 am
#110
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
Uncle Dave, how old are your Tumi pieces?
This could be bad information, but my understanding is that Tumi off-shored their manufacturing about 10-15 years ago and the quality began to go downhill. I've got a Tumi garment bag we bought in the late 80s that I used the tar out of and still looks absolutely perfect. I've got a briefcase that I bought in the early 90s that I used daily for years and it never frayed, still looks great (haven't used it in 9 years though). But this case? Garbage.
Tumi changed their warranty, and for the worse. And there's only one viable reason they did so: because the more robust warranty was costing them too much money after their quality took a dump. They don't have enough faith in their products to offer a warranty on par with Tom Bihn or Briggs & Riley or even Brenthaven, so why should I have any faith in their stuff?
And what I had repaired before? It should've all been covered at no expense to me. A panel wears out, a zipper breaks and pulls off its seam, and seems are coming so undone that there are threads hanging off the bag and they call that normal wear and tear?
Screw that. If that's what Tumi now considers normal wear and tear, then I'm done with Tumi.
Here's my laptop backpack review thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ew-thread.html
Will be posting an update after another week with the Brain Bag. Wife's Tom Bihn Smart Alec arrives tomorrow and I want to check that out, too, before making a final decision.
This could be bad information, but my understanding is that Tumi off-shored their manufacturing about 10-15 years ago and the quality began to go downhill. I've got a Tumi garment bag we bought in the late 80s that I used the tar out of and still looks absolutely perfect. I've got a briefcase that I bought in the early 90s that I used daily for years and it never frayed, still looks great (haven't used it in 9 years though). But this case? Garbage.
Tumi changed their warranty, and for the worse. And there's only one viable reason they did so: because the more robust warranty was costing them too much money after their quality took a dump. They don't have enough faith in their products to offer a warranty on par with Tom Bihn or Briggs & Riley or even Brenthaven, so why should I have any faith in their stuff?
And what I had repaired before? It should've all been covered at no expense to me. A panel wears out, a zipper breaks and pulls off its seam, and seems are coming so undone that there are threads hanging off the bag and they call that normal wear and tear?
Screw that. If that's what Tumi now considers normal wear and tear, then I'm done with Tumi.
Here's my laptop backpack review thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ew-thread.html
Will be posting an update after another week with the Brain Bag. Wife's Tom Bihn Smart Alec arrives tomorrow and I want to check that out, too, before making a final decision.
Mar 18, 2012, 11:36 am
#111
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Uncle Dave, how old are your Tumi pieces?
This could be bad information, but my understanding is that Tumi off-shored their manufacturing about 10-15 years ago and the quality began to go downhill. I've got a Tumi garment bag we bought in the late 80s that I used the tar out of and still looks absolutely perfect. I've got a briefcase that I bought in the early 90s that I used daily for years and it never frayed, still looks great (haven't used it in 9 years though). But this case? Garbage.
Tumi changed their warranty, and for the worse. And there's only one viable reason they did so: because the more robust warranty was costing them too much money after their quality took a dump. They don't have enough faith in their products to offer a warranty on par with Tom Bihn or Briggs & Riley or even Brenthaven, so why should I have any faith in their stuff?
And what I had repaired before? It should've all been covered at no expense to me. A panel wears out, a zipper breaks and pulls off its seam, and seems are coming so undone that there are threads hanging off the bag and they call that normal wear and tear?
Screw that. If that's what Tumi now considers normal wear and tear, then I'm done with Tumi.
Here's my laptop backpack review thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ew-thread.html
Will be posting an update after another week with the Brain Bag. Wife's Tom Bihn Smart Alec arrives tomorrow and I want to check that out, too, before making a final decision.
This could be bad information, but my understanding is that Tumi off-shored their manufacturing about 10-15 years ago and the quality began to go downhill. I've got a Tumi garment bag we bought in the late 80s that I used the tar out of and still looks absolutely perfect. I've got a briefcase that I bought in the early 90s that I used daily for years and it never frayed, still looks great (haven't used it in 9 years though). But this case? Garbage.
Tumi changed their warranty, and for the worse. And there's only one viable reason they did so: because the more robust warranty was costing them too much money after their quality took a dump. They don't have enough faith in their products to offer a warranty on par with Tom Bihn or Briggs & Riley or even Brenthaven, so why should I have any faith in their stuff?
And what I had repaired before? It should've all been covered at no expense to me. A panel wears out, a zipper breaks and pulls off its seam, and seems are coming so undone that there are threads hanging off the bag and they call that normal wear and tear?
Screw that. If that's what Tumi now considers normal wear and tear, then I'm done with Tumi.
Here's my laptop backpack review thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ew-thread.html
Will be posting an update after another week with the Brain Bag. Wife's Tom Bihn Smart Alec arrives tomorrow and I want to check that out, too, before making a final decision.
- including a Tegra light Medium bag I picked up yesterday.
I have about 8 older pieces.
My issue with the newer stuff isn't the build- its the little features the older stuff had.
Every manufacturer has its lemons. All the pool guys LOVE pentair products, but Ive had nothing but trouble with several new pieces I added a few years ago. It happens.
No offense to you, but your issue with a single bag you used for 9 years and started having problems at year 7 isn't going to discourage me or the majority of buyers away from a whole brand but is is an indicator or what one could expect if they have an issue with that 7-9 year old bag.
As a counterpoint I just had a handle repaired on 10 year old Tumi bag (it was functional but the bracket was cracking) and they didn't even charge me shipping (they took a deposit of 25 dollar, but never charged my card) - so from my point of view the newer more restrictive warranty is meaningless. They take care of me.
If one of the "lifetime warranty: companies files BK (like they did in the past) then all the print in the world becomes meaningless.
Ill dig into your thread and am curious to see how you analyze and review these products.
Thanks for the link I saw just before you sent it.
Flyertalk limitation on pictures is a big downside to this site.
Good luck in you quest for the perfect computer bag- I now use the Redd Oxx Metro briefcase that fits inside my airboss.
Uncle Dave
Mar 18, 2012, 11:50 am
#112
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
Uncle Dave.....if my experience was just an outlier, I'd still consider Tumi. But the number of people who have had my experience are significant. Such comments are very, very easy to find online. There are a lot of people who have older Tumi stuff that has worn beautifully, and then their newer stuff fell apart.
I'm not telling anyone else what to buy or not buy. Doesn't matter one bit to me what you or anyone else uses. If you like it and it works for you, great. I know what you have to say about lifetime warranties and that's fine. I simply disagree. I want to use products from a manufacturer who believes enough in what they make and sell to truly stand behind it.
Tumi doesn't.
I'm not telling anyone else what to buy or not buy. Doesn't matter one bit to me what you or anyone else uses. If you like it and it works for you, great. I know what you have to say about lifetime warranties and that's fine. I simply disagree. I want to use products from a manufacturer who believes enough in what they make and sell to truly stand behind it.
Tumi doesn't.
Mar 18, 2012, 12:00 pm
#113
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Uncle Dave.....if my experience was just an outlier, I'd still consider Tumi. But the number of people who have had my experience are significant. Such comments are very, very easy to find online. There are a lot of people who have older Tumi stuff that has worn beautifully, and then their newer stuff fell apart.
I'm not telling anyone else what to buy or not buy. Doesn't matter one bit to me what you or anyone else uses. If you like it and it works for you, great. I know what you have to say about lifetime warranties and that's fine. I simply disagree. I want to use products from a manufacturer who believes enough in what they make and sell to truly stand behind it.
Tumi doesn't.
I'm not telling anyone else what to buy or not buy. Doesn't matter one bit to me what you or anyone else uses. If you like it and it works for you, great. I know what you have to say about lifetime warranties and that's fine. I simply disagree. I want to use products from a manufacturer who believes enough in what they make and sell to truly stand behind it.
Tumi doesn't.
In my experience the following is true-
They didnt take care of you.
They did and do take care of me.
I totally understand how you feel, ( I really do) but your experience does not an all encompassing user experience make.
I can find guys that have issues with anything online.
UD
Mar 18, 2012, 12:16 pm
#114
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
UD......i'm not implying anything. It's simple fact that a lot of people who have been long time Tumi fans are seeing a degradation in that brand's quality. You haven't. Great. I have. Others have. A LOT of others have. Combine that with another fact, that Tumi enacted a significant downgrade to their warranty, and you can infer from that what you wish. I certainly have and am making my choices accordingly. You do what seems right to you.
One thing I love though, that is I think is quite telling, is how Tumi now markets their warranty. "Five Years with First Year Worry-Free". I can only be "worry-free" for the first year? What a joke. I'll take a Tom Bihn and be worry free for the life of the bag, thank you very much.
Here's a picture of my current case with the zipper separated from the body of the bag, we'll see if it comes through. Wish I had pics of the bag before the last repair, it was unbelievable how much it had deteriorated.
One thing I love though, that is I think is quite telling, is how Tumi now markets their warranty. "Five Years with First Year Worry-Free". I can only be "worry-free" for the first year? What a joke. I'll take a Tom Bihn and be worry free for the life of the bag, thank you very much.
Here's a picture of my current case with the zipper separated from the body of the bag, we'll see if it comes through. Wish I had pics of the bag before the last repair, it was unbelievable how much it had deteriorated.
Last edited by conejo23; Mar 18, 2012 at 12:41 pm
Mar 18, 2012, 12:49 pm
#115
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
UD......i'm not implying anything. It's simple fact that a lot of people who have been long time Tumi fans are seeing a degradation in that brand's quality. You haven't. Great. I have. Others have. A LOT of others have. Combine that with another fact, that Tumi enacted a significant downgrade to their warranty, and you can infer from that what you wish. I certainly have and am making my choices accordingly. You do what seems right to you.
Here's a picture of my current case with the zipper separated from the body of the bag, we'll see if it comes through. Wish I had pics of the bag before the last repair, it was unbelievable how much it had deteriorated.
Here's a picture of my current case with the zipper separated from the body of the bag, we'll see if it comes through. Wish I had pics of the bag before the last repair, it was unbelievable how much it had deteriorated.
When you say "well see if it comes through" - what do you mean?
I also get the fact that Tumi has downgraded their printed warranty.
I feel compelled to add that I have had no reduction in actual service.
I think some people abuse their products (like when I carried air tools in my bag once in a time of emergency) and that some limitation on warranty and policy makes sense in this day and age as much as I personally wish to be "taken care of" I understand the pullback.
UD
Mar 18, 2012, 12:53 pm
#116
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
I meant we'll see if the pic actually displays.
Let me ask you a question. Why do you think Tumi so significantly downgraded their warranty?
There is one and only one reason why a company makes that move: because it is costing them too much money and they want to reduce warranty-related expenses.
And why do you think their warranty expenses rose to the point they felt compelled to slash their warranty?
This isn't rocket science.
Let me ask you a question. Why do you think Tumi so significantly downgraded their warranty?
There is one and only one reason why a company makes that move: because it is costing them too much money and they want to reduce warranty-related expenses.
And why do you think their warranty expenses rose to the point they felt compelled to slash their warranty?
This isn't rocket science.
Mar 18, 2012, 1:06 pm
#117
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
I meant we'll see if the pic actually displays.
Let me ask you a question. Why do you think Tumi so significantly downgraded their warranty?
There is one and only one reason why a company makes that move: because it is costing them too much money and they want to reduce warranty-related expenses.
And why do you think their warranty expenses rose to the point they felt compelled to slash their warranty?
This isn't rocket science.
Let me ask you a question. Why do you think Tumi so significantly downgraded their warranty?
There is one and only one reason why a company makes that move: because it is costing them too much money and they want to reduce warranty-related expenses.
And why do you think their warranty expenses rose to the point they felt compelled to slash their warranty?
This isn't rocket science.
I think they did it because offering lifetime warranties on items that are regularly abused by definition is suicide to a company thats in business for 20+ years regardless of quality of build. I can break an Anvil over an unlimited span of time.
An analogy to snap on tools comes to mind. They used to offer a lifetime warranty they dont anymore is it because they are bad quality?
All in all in the world of consumer products its still a pretty strong warranty.
Same question to you...
Why does Sony only have a 90 day warranty on their TV's?
Is it because they make crappy stuff?
Why did B&R go bankrupt years ago?
The decision to downgrade a printed warranty isn't as simple as you make it out to be. If I owned and had a problem with one bag Id feel like you do, but I have multitudes of old an new Tumi product and they keep taking care of me beyond the written warranty.
Uncle Dave
Mar 18, 2012, 1:14 pm
#118
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
Lifetime warranties are dual edged swords. Yes, they increase costs, but they also attract new sales. If a company makes quality stuff, their historical repair costs will be low. A lot of companies can do it. Tumi can't? I'll tell you why: it was costing them a fortune. And why was that? Because their product quality has clearly gone downhill. If you think that's just my opinion, you would be mistaken.
Yes, Sony quality has gone downhill dramatically, as well. Samsung makes a much better TV these days and their warranty is 12 months.
You keep saying Briggs and Riley went bankrupt. Source? I googled it, all I could see was a large retailer who sold their stuff went bankrupt, and B&R was one of their largest creditors.
I have never heard of a reputable manufacturer of quality goods going bankrupt do to warranty costs.
Yes, Sony quality has gone downhill dramatically, as well. Samsung makes a much better TV these days and their warranty is 12 months.
You keep saying Briggs and Riley went bankrupt. Source? I googled it, all I could see was a large retailer who sold their stuff went bankrupt, and B&R was one of their largest creditors.
I have never heard of a reputable manufacturer of quality goods going bankrupt do to warranty costs.
Mar 18, 2012, 1:28 pm
#119
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Lifetime warranties are dual edged swords. Yes, they increase costs, but they also attract new sales. If a company makes quality stuff, their historical repair costs will be low. A lot of companies can do it. Tumi can't? I'll tell you why: it was costing them a fortune. And why was that? Because their product quality has clearly gone downhill. If you think that's just my opinion, you would be mistaken.
Yes, Sony quality has gone downhill dramatically, as well. Samsung makes a much better TV these days and their warranty is 12 months.
You keep saying Briggs and Riley went bankrupt. Source? I googled it, all I could see was a large retailer who sold their stuff went bankrupt, and B&R was one of their largest creditors.
I have never heard of a reputable manufacturer of quality goods going bankrupt do to warranty costs.
Yes, Sony quality has gone downhill dramatically, as well. Samsung makes a much better TV these days and their warranty is 12 months.
You keep saying Briggs and Riley went bankrupt. Source? I googled it, all I could see was a large retailer who sold their stuff went bankrupt, and B&R was one of their largest creditors.
I have never heard of a reputable manufacturer of quality goods going bankrupt do to warranty costs.
Im in the broadcast film and post business and no one uses Samsung products ro monitor quality, but you see sonys everywhere.
UD
Mar 18, 2012, 1:38 pm
#120
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 77
Well now you're talking pro-grade vs commercial grade. Big difference.
Re Briggs and Riley, cmon, that's a cop out. Because it purportedly happened before Al Gore invented the Internet there's nothing online about it? There is plenty online about things that happened prior to the 90s. What is your source for this information? You repeat it as if it's fact, and perhaps it is, but if you don't have a source for it that is reputable, then it's not cool to be saying a company filed bankruptcy when you don't know that to be in fact true.
Re Briggs and Riley, cmon, that's a cop out. Because it purportedly happened before Al Gore invented the Internet there's nothing online about it? There is plenty online about things that happened prior to the 90s. What is your source for this information? You repeat it as if it's fact, and perhaps it is, but if you don't have a source for it that is reputable, then it's not cool to be saying a company filed bankruptcy when you don't know that to be in fact true.