View Poll Results: Should Westin use refillable toiletry containers?
YES: we need to reduce waste.
6
5.45%
YES: if done tastefully (ie: not gas station washrooms)
22
20.00%
NO: it cheapens the brand. Westin should keep individual containers.
26
23.64%
NO: it's unsanitary. Westin should keep individual containers.
2
1.82%
NO: it's BOTH cheap & unsanitary. Westin should keep individual containers.
50
45.45%
I don't care either way
4
3.64%
Voters: 110. You may not vote on this poll
Westin Phasing Out Shampoo Bottles?
Jun 9, 2010 | 8:42 pm
#46
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Westin very much wants the consumer to see its brand as an aspirational experience. From the vantage point of this consumer, pump dispensers in the shower detract from that goal, not further it.
Jun 9, 2010 | 9:08 pm
#47
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Regardless of one's particular experiences, you'd agree that Westin's brand positioning is clearly aimed at the highest end of full service hotel brands. True, they've never been categorized in the industry's "luxury hotel" bucket, but they've never aimed to be there.
Westin very much wants the consumer to see its brand as an aspirational experience. From the vantage point of this consumer, pump dispensers in the shower detract from that goal, not further it.
Westin very much wants the consumer to see its brand as an aspirational experience. From the vantage point of this consumer, pump dispensers in the shower detract from that goal, not further it.
The Starwood Haciendas in Mexico, which I believe are part of the Luxury Collection, don't have pump dispensers but do have shared crockery containers that hold the shampoo and conditioner. Interestingly, I've never heard anyone complain about those as detracting from the experience. My only complaint there would be that they are a bit slippery and appear to chip easily.
Jun 10, 2010 | 5:44 am
#48
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Thanks for doing the math. Compared to 30 billion bottles of water sold in just the U.S. annually, Westin's contribution is mousenuts.
I can see how they're being a bit eco-friendly. I can see how it's labor efficient, with less restocking by housekeeping. But it's tacky in an aloft, let alone a Westin.
I can see how they're being a bit eco-friendly. I can see how it's labor efficient, with less restocking by housekeeping. But it's tacky in an aloft, let alone a Westin.
The financial deficit in many coutries at the moment, the tax increases only make a small impact to each person thus lets not bother and let the deficits keep increasing, thats the argument you seem to be making!
Jun 10, 2010 | 5:47 am
#49
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FULL SERVICE brands include Sheraton, Hilton, Hyatt, Westin, etc.
I didn't invent these terms -- they're industry lingo. I was merely pointing out that Westin's brand positioning is pointed squarely at the high end of FULL SERVICE. A point I maintain.
Last edited by sbtinme; Jun 10, 2010 at 6:35 am
Jun 10, 2010 | 5:49 am
#50
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Everything is relative 
An estimated 50 billion bottles of water are consumed per annum in the US and around 200 billion bottles globally (A Fountain On Every Corner", New York Times. Find A Fountain, May 23, 2008.)
Ant that's just water, not counting coke and such...
But I can see how tempting it is for starwood properties to save $ by not offering 169M bottles and claim "greening" along the way
An estimated 50 billion bottles of water are consumed per annum in the US and around 200 billion bottles globally (A Fountain On Every Corner", New York Times. Find A Fountain, May 23, 2008.)
Ant that's just water, not counting coke and such...
But I can see how tempting it is for starwood properties to save $ by not offering 169M bottles and claim "greening" along the way
Interesting point that the US consumes a quarter of the bottles of water for the entire world dont you think! I would be curious to know how many people here against dispensers providing they are reasonable quality, not tacky and have a good quality product in them are from the US.
Another thought is quite often in the showers you run out of shower gel, especially if there are 2 of you in the room, providing dispensers are kept full this issue would also be eliminated.
Jun 10, 2010 | 6:02 am
#51
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Whats up with Westin brand manager these days?
I mean saving money of course is what every company is trying to do but this is what they have done so far in lieu of "green"
1. Supplying only one bar of soap instead of two (Failed attempt)
2. Cutting down Executive Lounges, Unwind hours..etc. They are even too cheap to offer breakfast to elites while most other brands are doing it for their elites.
3. Declining room services for points
4. Cutting down size of the shampoo, conditioners by 20% and now.....Using the pump/dispenser in room?
If I am staying at a limited service brand, yes I can understand and tolerate all these efforts. However, you are charging us premium to stay at so called "Luxury business hotel/resorts". I don't know if others are on the same line with me or not but I believe luxury hotel should supply me things that I needed so I can carry less when I am away from home.
Most importantly, I don't want to figure out what is in that moody dispenser when I am paying good amount of money for a clean comfortable room and shower. If you want to save money, this is definitely not the place to be.
I mean saving money of course is what every company is trying to do but this is what they have done so far in lieu of "green"
1. Supplying only one bar of soap instead of two (Failed attempt)
2. Cutting down Executive Lounges, Unwind hours..etc. They are even too cheap to offer breakfast to elites while most other brands are doing it for their elites.
3. Declining room services for points
4. Cutting down size of the shampoo, conditioners by 20% and now.....Using the pump/dispenser in room?
If I am staying at a limited service brand, yes I can understand and tolerate all these efforts. However, you are charging us premium to stay at so called "Luxury business hotel/resorts". I don't know if others are on the same line with me or not but I believe luxury hotel should supply me things that I needed so I can carry less when I am away from home.
Most importantly, I don't want to figure out what is in that moody dispenser when I am paying good amount of money for a clean comfortable room and shower. If you want to save money, this is definitely not the place to be.
- Agreed
- Disagree. The lounges aren't cut anymore than other brands (starwood or not) in addtion, the breakfast issue is a SPG program issue not a Westin brand issue.
- What? I dont think that is brand issue. Perhaps an issue at an individual property with a unique situation?
- Where is this a brandwide issue?? The first post says this is a trial at one hotel on two floors. Are there other Westin properties doing this?
Is it possible this trial at one property could be blown out of proportion?
Last edited by KENNECTED; Jun 10, 2010 at 9:36 am Reason: spelling
Jun 10, 2010 | 6:19 am
#52
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Jun 10, 2010 | 7:34 am
#53
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Jun 10, 2010 | 10:10 am
#54
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I can't think of an upscale spa or gym that I've been to that doesn't employ this system. (With the number of guests using a shower per day it obviously would be difficult on housekeeping and wasteful to have individual toiletries.) The Westin products are no great shakes, sharing a dispenser has proven hygenic at spas and gyms. I find this a good idea and am surprised that more places don't do it. If I had to chose something to cut, this would be up at the top of the list over things like eliminating turndown and swapping pencils for pens and so on.
In some cases, where the product is fabulous, would I prefer that it was in individual bottles so I can take a few home? Definitely.
But if I'm running a mid-range hotel and need to look at cost savings to mitigate a substantial downturn in business, this approach would be very high on my list. At the end of the day, it has far less impact on guests than many of the other options available to management.
To me, as long as the product is good and the dispenser system is secure and functions well, I have no problem with this. No doubt it's a cost savings to the property, but it is also 'green,' and I would give the hotel credit for that.
Jun 10, 2010 | 10:30 am
#55
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And don't forget about the non more existing turndown service in some Westins, so no more old chokolade, sweets etc...
Last edited by Forstbetrieb; Jun 10, 2010 at 10:36 am
Jun 10, 2010 | 10:58 am
#56
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For me, this is the core of the issue, however. The Westin brand managers absolutely do NOT wish to be seen as a mid-range hotel brand. They've always been about aspirational positioning, etc, etc.
I completely agree that dispenser pumps in bathrooms does, however, feel very mid-range hotelish.
So, therein lies the issue, for me at least.
I completely agree that dispenser pumps in bathrooms does, however, feel very mid-range hotelish.
So, therein lies the issue, for me at least.
Jun 10, 2010 | 11:16 am
#57
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For me, this is the core of the issue, however. The Westin brand managers absolutely do NOT wish to be seen as a mid-range hotel brand. They've always been about aspirational positioning, etc, etc.
I completely agree that dispenser pumps in bathrooms does, however, feel very mid-range hotelish.
So, therein lies the issue, for me at least.
I completely agree that dispenser pumps in bathrooms does, however, feel very mid-range hotelish.
So, therein lies the issue, for me at least.
But more importantly, I think the majority of customers (outside of us FT maniacs) who will really care or not care about this issue (and that is what is key here), see Westin as mid-range. These customers know that if they want a higher end experience, they will stay at a W, a St. Regis, or a Lux Collection.
At those higher end brands, at least now, I would not be tempted to try this. But Westin may well prove that the majority of people either don't care, or appreciate the lack of waste. Or not.
I think this is very much worth a pilot program and I get why they're doing it at Westin -- it's probably the brand that is right on the edge of whether customers will accept it or not. If it works, it should also work down the line of brands, and I would look for it to happen.
Jun 10, 2010 | 11:41 am
#58
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Shampoo from a dispenser ? I may be able to accept it at a 4P, but definitely not from a Westin. Just like I didnt like the Molten Brown shampoo that came out from a large earthen ware at the Conrad Maldives (formerly Hilton Maldives), it just didnt feel right and not very assuring on the hygiene aspect.
Whats next, using recycled bottles for drinking water ?
Jun 10, 2010 | 12:59 pm
#59
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Jun 10, 2010 | 1:25 pm
#60
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Originally Posted by mario33
Whats next, using recycled bottles for drinking water ?
(Actually, some plastic bottles that drinks are sold in are indeed recycled and some wineries in the US and Europe reuse wine bottles!)
Last edited by l etoile; Jun 10, 2010 at 1:36 pm