I just did a dummy search and calculated taxes similar to yours so yes in this case I'd believe adding a stopover (>24hrs) in DOH reduces the YQ greatly.

FYI the figures may be slightly different depending on your ticketing carrier but pretty close. Good find!

Thanks for the data points.
This is sort of opposite of LHR!

I am unable to put a stopover before your QR15/02FEB/DOHLHR. Autoprice won't work. Autoprice has some glitches. Unable to price with DOH stopover may be one of them. Pricing this as a DONE6 instead of a DONE5 may be another one.

I ran the autoprice tax breakdown again, back date to 21APR. Not that different. Ticket was probably issued in the UK if your taxes are calculated in GBP.

Note the YQ charged by QR (or perhaps some other carriers may be different depending on whether the fare basis is DONE5 or DONE6. I have seen QR, in the past, charging more YQ on a DONE3 than a DONE4, rendering the total price of DONE4 cheaper than a DONE3 for a given itinerary. Both QR and QF charge YQ on a "complete itinerary" basis, in addition to the sector-by-sector YR (which is small).

As to your old itinerary priced on 15MAR, this is the tax breakdown I have, back date to 15MAR:

Due to exchange rate, the higher GBP fare you paid will probably not be refunded with your new itinerary. You will have to pay all the new taxes. While most airlines these days will allow you to subtract unused taxes from the new taxes you have to pay, sometimes they don't, and they will only charge you the new taxes. A quick glance (error possible) seems to be you have to pay:
GBP26.20SG
GBP6.50L7
GBP4.80OP
GBP426.10YR-GBP291.20YR=134.9
GBP856.70YQ-GBP593.70YQ=263
GBP2.60M6
GBP2.00O7
total new tax = 440GBP

Plus the 125USD change fee you have to pay, the total extra you need to pay is probably in the 5xxGBP range. I did not add DOH departure tax (since not supported by autoprice) but that should be small. The big difference seems to be the 335USD YQ from UL.

I am also a bit lost as to what old ticket you had in 09MAR?

Lastly, I'm saving the queries below so I don't have to type them again next time. If you can give me flight info in the below format, I can build the exact itinerary easily:

Take a look at the YQ and YR quotes separately. QR charges YR sector by sector but YQ on a "complete RTW itinerary" basis. Once you build the entire RTW (probably not possible using ITA matrix), the QR YQ will be adjusted to reflect that, thus there should be no difference in YQ/YR at the end whether DOH is stopover or transit.

I see - the YQ charges for the two separate sectors amount to $AUD520.9 whereas booked as one sector the YQ charges are a whopping $1,225. And no - I don't think I could build the entire itinerary (NRT-HNLo-SEAo-LASo-JFKo-GRUo-DOHx-CDGo-HELo-ATHo-DOHx-SYDo-NOUo-SYDo-BKK(overland)-SGNo-NRT) on ITA matrix - I tried but it wouldn't let me enter that many flights:D. I'm hoping I've squeezed in as much travel as I could get. I hope you're right - saving $AUD700 each woulld be nice! Given the charges overall for the two of us amount to a little over $5000 any saving is nice. Thank you so much for taking the time!

Thanks for looking at that for me - I've planned a very full Done5 itinerary and the total taxes and surcharges amount to 25% of the base price - I'm hoping it will work out a little less....

Not sure which airline's plate you want to put the ticket on. If AA, the total taxes look like 1072.21USD to me, based on today's exchange rate. See my post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/34947744-post1102.html for explanation.

There's only about 470USD of YR/YQ, very low. It seems the QR and QF YQ based on entire itinerary does not apply in this case, ex-NRT and issued by AA. Hope you can read the breakdown as I don't have time to explain it for now. If you need to run a different query and can just tweak my WQ... code, that would be great.

[QUOTE=ernestnywang;35215055]Not sure which airline's plate you want to put the ticket on. If AA, the total taxes look like 1072.21USD to me, based on today's exchange rate. See my post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/34947744-post1102.html for explanation.


Thanks so much for that! I did read your post for explanation but am none the wiser (the fault lies with me not your explanation) - I will take encouragement from your calculation and live in hope that the taxes will work out lower than I expect!

I had intended to book through JAL as they are our first flight - would you have any idea (without going to the bother of working it out) if they would have similarly low taxes? They are one of the lowest for taxes I think.

Also, if I book through JAL can I credit the points earned to Qantas? I'm hoping to gain status with Qantas on that run in the hope that in 2025 we can book a 35K mile Qantas Oneworld Classic itinerary. ATM Qantas is appallingly bad to try to book anything through their call centres if you have no status.

Do not confuse real taxes and carrier surcharges. Real taxes are the same for all airlines flying the same route/class of travel.

You can earn Qantas ff points and status credits (SC) on all Oneworld airline, subject to rules.

• Some partner flights can earn nil or far less than you expect
• For example D business class on many MH flights will earn as flexible economy, and not business--> " Flights booked in C, D, I , J and Z class will earn at Flexible Economy Frequent Flyer Earn Category, however will receive Malaysia Airlines Business Class service, and flights booked in A and F class will earn at Flexible Economy Frequent Flyer Earn Category, however will receive Malaysia Airlines First Class service"
• A code share can earn more or less than the native flight.

QF link--> https://www.qantas.com/au/en/frequen...ry-tables.html
The QF partner earning is *very* poorly presented and hard to establish what you will get. No doubt that is deliberate.
QF has a poor FFP.

Sabre calculation shows an even lower figure for the fees, when plated on JL, with a total amounting to 904.85USD as of today. However, since JL uses Amadeus instead of Sabre, my confidence that the calculation made by a JL agent would match is somewhat lower.

The difference being JL does not collect QF and QR YR/YQ, so only JL and AY ones are collected.

Yes, just give JL your QF FF number and ask JL to enter it to all airlines (not just JL itself).

Do we have any generalised info on who charges QR YR/YQ? I’m increasingly preferring QR and if I could reduce fees that could make a difference. Do BA, AY, AA plates have same fees as QR plate for QR sectors?

I booked an AONE5 through JL, using their U.S. call center. Their agents are fine, but they have exceedingly long hold times when calling the U.S. call center. The way to get through quickly is to call the instant they open at 8am Pacific Time. My routing is HND-JFK-LAX-YVR-LAX-LHR-LIS-LHR-DOH-LHR-SYD-PER-ADL-SYD-SIN-KUL-NRT. The LAX-YVR-LAX flights are AS codes operated by AA (when crediting to AA, AA-coded RTW flights earn a pitifully small amount, as it's based on the pro-rated fare of the flight); the LAX-LHR is an AY code operated by BA (trying to avoid BA's notoriously high YQ/YR).

Converted to USD, my base fare is $8,026.81 and my calculations put the base fare plus YQ/YR (total price excluding actual taxes) at $9,250.00. Here's the JL calculations:

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...8a56660a9d.png
JL AONE5 fare calculation

I told JL my AA number when booking. After flying HND-JFK, I called JL and switched the FF number to my QR account, as the AA JFK-LAX in A will earn more Avios credited to QR than to BA, and wouldn't earn much in AA miles. Before flying LAX-YVR, I'll call JL and switch back to AA.

BA, AY, and AA plates all seem to charge the full amount of QR YQ/YR. JL YQ, however, is only sometimes charged by AA but not other times. Seems to be origin-dependent. Ex-Japan it is charged. Ex-Europe it is not. I can't figure out the exact pattern.

What was your ticket's original date of issue? Has it been re-issued before this re-issue? What are the marketing carrier codes for the rest of your itinerary? With this information, I may be able to compare Sabre's quote with JL's.

It was originally issued November 14 or 15, 2022, and reissued (after date changes) March 27, 2023. Interestingly, the reissue resulted in a credit of $56.53 per passenger.

My itinerary in Sabre code is, I believe:

WQTYO/JL426/CANYC/AAA/CALAX/AAS/CDYVR/AAS/CD/XLAX/AAY/CALHR/ABA/CDLIS/ABA/CD/XLHR/AQR/CADOH/AQR/CA/XLHR/AQF/CA/SYD/AQF/CDPER/AQF/CDADL/AQF/CDSYD/AQF/CASIN/AMH/CDKUL/AMH/CATYO-RW/MUSD/VJL

That's plating on JL and pricing in USD. In the e-ticket from JL, it was priced in JPY, so it might be better to use that to avoid having exchange rate changes confuse things. That would, I think, be:

WQTYO/JL426/CANYC/AAA/CALAX/AAS/CDYVR/AAS/CD/XLAX/AAY/CALHR/ABA/CDLIS/ABA/CD/XLHR/AQR/CADOH/AQR/CA/XLHR/AQF/CA/SYD/AQF/CDPER/AQF/CDADL/AQF/CDSYD/AQF/CASIN/AMH/CDKUL/AMH/CATYO-RW/MJPY/VJL

I recall that Sabre often chokes on autopricing RTWs with Australian domestic segments, so you might have to omit some of them for it to price. Perhaps:

WQTYO/JL426/CANYC/AAA/CALAX/AAS/CDYVR/AAS/CD/XLAX/AAY/CALHR/ABA/CDLIS/ABA/CD/XLHR/AQR/CADOH/AQR/CA/XLHR/AQF/CA/SYD/AQF/CASIN/AMH/CDKUL/AMH/CATYO-RW/MJPY/VJL

(As an aside, I found it helpful when creating the quote string to say to myself "slash airline" for "/a" and "slash cabin" for "/C", to make it easier to keep my place.)

What's the best way to calculate what I would earn in Loyalty Points out of AA-operated flights such as MEX-JFK, LAX-JFK or ANC-DFW?

Is it just a matter of dividing the fare amount (pre taxes) equally between the 16 (segments)?

All flights with AA flight numbers?
A question for the AA forum. A common question.

For all flights with AA flight numbers (either AA prime flights or AA codeshares operated by another airline), it's the pro-rated base fare plus the YQ/YR associated with the flight. To calculate the pro-rated fare, add up the flight distance of each flight, then for each AA-coded segment, divide the flight distance of that segment by the total flight distance, then multiply this number by the base fare. Determining which YQ/YR to allocate to which segments is harder; my spreadsheet allocates it exactly the same as it does the base fare (pro-rated by percent of total flight distance), and it works out fairly close to what AA awards, but perhaps [MENTION=77686]ernestnywang[/MENTION] can suggest a better way?

EDIT TO ADD: On occasion, AA credits RTW AA flights using flight distance, which results in far more miles and LPs than using fare, but when this happens it is a glitch and sometimes AA goes back and corrects it later. A few years ago it was possible to have an AAdvantage Customer Service agent manually adjust RTW segments to calculate using distance, but that ability has been removed from the agents' capabilities.

There's a thread for that: RTW / Round the World ticket - earning AAdvantage Miles

Hi all.
So I've priced up a DONE5 Oneworld Explorer ticket (details below), and I have a question about the taxes and charges. The total is running at about 41% of the base fare, which is a bit higher than I'd have expected. On looking at the breakdown on AA.com (also copied below - the block of text is the various taxes, which totals about $450, which is fine), I can see that $1,508.70 of the total of $1,961.19 is down as "Carrier-imposed fees". I don't have any more detail as to which carrier or which flight and the AA rep wouldn't send me any more details.
Would anyone have any idea or recommendations as to how I could potentially reduce these carrier fees (would anyone know which legs are driving the highest ones)? Sorry I'm not sure of the proper way of showing all the details on the below, so I've written it out underneath also for clarity. AA may have grouped them slightly differently as I was just booking them on dummy dates (e.g. grouped Chicago to Honolulu via Anchorage as one flight with a stopover) - not sure if that matters?
Thanks!

CAI(QR)-xDOH(QR)-xDFW(AA)-SCL, BAQ(AA)-xMIA(AA)-ORD(AS)-ANC(AS)-HNL(JL)-xHND(JL)-SYD(QF)-NAN, AKL(MH)-KUL(MH)-DEL(BA)-xLHR(BA)-AMM

Cairo to Santiago, transiting Doha and Dallas Fort Worth (Qatar flights on CAI-DOH and DOH-DFW; I asked to be put on American Airlines codeshare but they said they couldn't) (AA on DFW-SCL)
Surface segment to Barranquilla
Barranquilla to Chicago via Miami on American Airlines
Chicago to Anchorage on Alaskan
Anchorage to Honolulu on Alaskan
Honolulu to Sydney via Haneda on Japan Airlines
Sydney to Nadi on Qantas
Surface segment to Auckland
Auckland to Kuala Lumpur on Malaysian
Kuala Lumpur to Delhi on Malaysian
Delhi to Amman via Heathrow on British Airways

Adult (per passenger)
$4,700.00 USD
CARRIER-IMPOSED FEES$1,508.70 USD
PASSENGER FACILITY CHARGE (UNITED STATES)$9.00 USDSEGMENT TAX (UNITED STATES)$14.40 USDTRANSPORTATION TAX (UNITED STATES)$52.80 USDUS APHIS USER FEE (UNITED STATES)$7.66 USDUS CUSTOMS USER FEE (UNITED STATES)$13.04 USDUS FEDERAL INSPECTION FEE (UNITED STATES)$14.00 USDUS SECURITY FEE (UNITED STATES)$22.40 USDPASSENGER MOVEMENT CHARGE (AUSTRALIA)$40.50 USDPASSENGER SERVICE CHARGE (AUSTRALIA)$46.90 USDAIRPORT TAX (COLOMBIA)$49.00 USDDEPARTURE FEE (EGYPT)$1.60 USDDEVELOPMENT FEE (EGYPT)$9.70 USDEMBARKATION TAX (EGYPT)$25.00 USDSERVICE CHARGE AT CAIRO AIRPORT (EGYPT)$2.00 USDSOLIDARITY TAX (EGYPT)$13.00 USDPASSENGER SERVICE FACILITIES CHARGE (JAPAN)$10.90 USDBORDER CLEARANCE LEVY (NEW ZEALAND)$3.30 USDPASSENGER SECURITY CHARGE (NEW ZEALAND)$10.70 USDPASSENGER SERVICE CHARGE (NEW ZEALAND)$11.20 USDAIRPORT FEE (QATAR)$16.50 USDPASSENGER FACILITY CHARGE (QATAR)$16.50 USDPASSENGER SAFETY AND SECURITY FEE (QATAR)$2.70 USDPASSENGER SERVICE CHARGE (QATAR)$0.50 USDPASSENGER SERVICE CHARGE (UNITED KINGDOM)$53.20 USDOTHER TAXES & CARRIER-IMPOSED FEES$5.99 USD
Total$6,661.19 USD per person

For clarity, AA have grouped the flights as follows due to the dummy dates I provided:

Cairo to Chicago (QR and AA)
Chicago to Honolulu (AS)
Honolulu to Sydney (JL)
Sydney to Nadi (QF)
Auckland to Amman (MH and BA)

If I subsequently change dates such that transits in the original fare become stopovers (SCL, ANC, KUL, DEL), might I be subject to additional taxes?

Yes this is absolutely possible, there can be additional taxes based on stopovers vs transit (UK APD would be an example), as well as possible YQ changes I think.

Update on this - I worked with AA to get the flights amended so the stopovers and transits match what I am actually planning. The taxes and charges changed very little, so I'm still ultimately trying to figure out what airline/segment is driving such high carrier fees. Any ideas how I can figure this out so I can look into alternatives? Thanks!

Also, the AA agent said they couldn't put me on the AA codeshare of the QR operated flights from CAI-DOH-DFW because there was no business availability, but I'm seeing loads of availability in Expert Flyer, which I don't really understand.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...5202cea790.jpg

I assumed they booked you on QR for the DOH-DFW segment as a QR flight. Not a big deal unless you need AA flight for more Avios. If you're earning AAdvantage miles then having a QR flight is a plus as you'll earn more RDM based on miles flown.

Venturing a guess, it appears they're checking CAI-DFW via DOH on AA (Instead of CAI to SCL via DFW and DOH on AA) as that shows up as D0 for AA DOH-DFW segment. Now if you do want to pursue changing to AA codeshare flight, HUACA and hopefully you'll get a better RTW agent:

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...02968e1990.jpg

Thanks for the advice. I am BAEC so would be a lot better for Avios earning to be on AA, so that's why I'm trying to push it.

I was speaking to a different agent today and they said they couldn't see any availability on the codeshare either, no matter what way they looked for it. So I'm not really sure... I'll try once again whenever I'm calling the agent to make the payment and book the ticket, but it's a bit strange that I'm seeing availability on Expert Flyer and they are not.

In relation to the high fees, the agent couldn't tell me what segment it was being driven by, so I took a gamble and asked them to change the DEL-LHR-AMM on BA to DEL-DOH-AMM on QR, just to see if that brings it down. If it brings the surcharges down more than the value of lost Avios, then I'll stick with that. If not, I'll go back to BA flight.

I don't really have many other options on the other legs if that's what is driving the high surcharges, so may just have to suck it up. The overall price is still excellent despite the high surcharges.

If I'm understanding this correctly, I need to add up the distance of each individual segment, in my case that would be around 52k miles. Then if MEX-JFK is around 2,090 miles...that would be around 4% of the total distance.

So the revenue "assigned" to MEX-JFK would be 4% of the base fare I paid?

Yes, that is my understanding as well. I recall I checked details on an earlier DONEx (pre-pandemic), and this theory checked out!
Not sure if anything has changed since the pandemic.

Sorry for my late reply. Can't keep us with work or anything these days. So overwhelmed.

Back date to ticketing date 14NOV22 and specifying airport codes (since HND and NRT taxes are different), removing SYD-PER but keeping PER-ADL-SYD (indeed I couldn't include all), I got
Did you re-route when you re-issued on 27MAR23, or what was the difference before and after? Anyway, back-dating to that, I got a ~20USD total tax reduction indeed.

Comparing the Sabre calculation your screenshot, it would appear that JL is only collecting their own YQ on your ticket. The MH, AY, and BA YQ are not collected. Seems booking through JL is a good idea (but you have to wait a long long time on the phone right?).

I cannot think of a better way and frankly don't know how AA handles it from mileage-earning purposes. Sorry.

I had to tweak the itinerary a bit for autoprice to work. Intra-Asia sectors need to be used before going to Oceania. This is a known glitch for Sabre autoprice.

Considering this itinerary,

In this case, QF charges around 590USD, followed by QR around 550USD, BA around 360USD, JL around 195USD, and a small amount from MH. QF code seems not avoidable for you, but try your best to get on the AA-coded, QR-operated flight. QR charges a lumpsum YQ amount for xONEx, as long as 1 QR sector appears. The QR per-sector YR is small, but this lumpsum YQ is huge. Changing these QR-operated flights to AA code should drop the 520USD YQ from QR.

See this example below.
If you are interested in trying out other routing, I would really appreciate if you can give me the Sabre WQ- entry (which you can see in the beginning of my codes) to enter. Please bear in mind I cannot overcome the glitch. Sabre will not autoprice if Asia-Oceania-Asia is between TPAC and intra-Asia segments. Sabre will only autoprice if Asia-Oceania-Asia is between Asia-Europe and intra-Asia segments.

Not sure if it is a POS (Point of Sale) issue. If you are calling AA RTW desk, I suppose the POS should be US? From my POS (Taiwan), I see D2 right now.

I'm researching taxes on a DONE5 for a return flight from EZE to HNL via DFW and using ITA I come up with the following which translates to taxes and fees of about $3490 USD. I'd appreciate a sanity check or any other insights. If this is actually the case, then I guess I'll take a flight from EZE to SCL on a non-OW carrier and the fly SCL to HNL via DFW for taxes and fees of about $70 USD:

Thanks for the information.
I ended up changing the BA flights to QR and knocked about 300 euro off the total. No one I spoke to in AA was able to book the AA codeshare Cairo to Dallas so had to stick with QR.
Total price ended up being €5,812 per person including taxes and fees so it is still exceptional value so have pulled the trigger.
Thanks to everyone who answered questions and gave advice over the past few months. Can't wait for the trip now!

I wonder if the lower cost of DONE3 ex-CAI + more YQ's is similar to the total cost of DONE3 ex-TYO + fewer YQ's?
Why not call the JAL call center in Japan to book a DONEx ticket? I assume they have an English language line?

Was exploring potential starting points for RTW, thought the data might be useful for others.

Prices are base fares only for DONE4 in GBP (as per today's exchange rates).

CAI 3675
OSL 4275 (also DONE5 4885, AONE4 7825)
TYO 4550
MRU 4750
ARN 4910
KEF 5100
BUD 5140
HEL 5665
TNG 5707
DUB 6100 (also FRA, LIS, AMS, ATH, CDG, FCO, SOF, CPH)
ICN 6175
IST 6175
LON 6200
DOH 6530
YOW 6430
AKL 7050
MLE 7270

After being grounded for three years, I've got the flying bug again. Having previously enjoyed a RTW trip, I'm currently finalising the dates of an another one. It's an AONE4 sarting in TYO, with the likely routing of

HND(A)-xBKK-HKG-xSIN(A)-SYD-xBNE-APW//NAN-SYD(A)-SIN(A)-LHR(A)-DOH(A)-LHR(A)-SEA-SFO(A)-JFK(A)-HND

My best attempt of this in SABRE speak (using JL):
WQHND/AJL14SEP/CA/XBKK/ACX/CDHKG/ACX/CD/XSIN/AQF/CASYD/AQF/CD/XBNE/AQF/CDAPW/-NAN/AQF/CDSYD/AQF/CASIN/AQF/CALHR/AQR/CADOH/AQR/CALHR/ABA/CASEA/AAS/CDSFO/AAA/CAJFK/AJL/CAHND-B01JUN23/RW/MGBP/VJL


I am pretty certain of the dates have confirmed availability using ExpertFlyer. Now I have to book the thing. I've tried the OneWorld RTW tool and (unsurprisingly) it was unable to price up the exact route. What would be the best option for a UK based person to book this?

As there's a lot of QF and QR flights in the itinerary, avoiding excessive YR/YQ is a priority. Will the booking airline affect this?

Cheers.

Total taxes and fees look like 330.45USD to me.

Thanks for getting back to me, I appreciate it. Yes, that makes more sense and is much more reasonable. Also, as of this past Saturday we are now going in and out of SCL so it's a moot point. But again, thanks.

The code works perfectly. Thank you for making it easy for me!

Looks like 333.9USD of YQ from JL, 262USD of YQ from BA, and 46.6USD of YR from CX. QF and QR YQ/YR are not charged in this itinerary. Reports from above may mean there is a chance JL would not charge you the YQ from BA and YR from CX, either, although that is to be seen.

I tried changing JFK-HND from JL prime to AA*/JL, but there was only a 2.9USD deduction, as JL will charge AA YR based on Sabre. Nevertheless, you might still want to try to convince the JL agent. Maybe JL doesn't charge AA YR in its system for xONEx, either. Even if JL still charges it, you will save 2.9USD. I don't know about how it affects your mileage earning, though.

OW email & news release -- oneworld and Elemental Cognition’s breakthrough AI Travel Agent transforms the online booking experience
Lets see if it works. IT projects never seem to go to plan.

I used the above link and gave the Breakthrough AI Travel Agent a spin. Put in a simply 7 segments ex-HND DONE3. Trying to choose first flight.

The result is simply brilliant!


https://photos.smugmug.com/Assets/Fo...0143412-X2.png

And many thanks for the quote. It was a fun little game working out the code. So that's about £1100 in taxes, could be worse! When I was doing some test ex-OSL routings in the OneWorld RTW tool, QF YQ/YR sometimes came to about £1500 alone!

Looks as if I should try using JL to book, however if I decide to use the AA RTW desk instead, are the taxes likely to be the same? Also, will I have to use an AA codeshare on one of the trans-ocean flights for AA to except it? Not an issue as it's more Avios as a BA EC member.

Thanks again.