Oneworld booking and pricing experiences
#3346



Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: used to be PER, now it's nowhere/eveywhere
Programs: QFF NB, AA GLD
Posts: 3,687
- Travel from Australia to Europe in December 2026
- Return to Australia
- Travel from Australia to South Africa in September 2027
- Return to Australia
And you are exploring whether a RTW will give you more/be better value for you.
At this stage you are not looking to travel more widely - say in North America or Asia.
But would be interested in South Pacific travel, while you are back in Australia.
Have I got it right?
To achieve what you want, you must start from somewhere in Tariff Conference 2 (TC2 - i.e. Europe/Middle East/Africa)
(see Note 1 below for why starting elsewhere will not work for you. And by the way, if you are new to RTW planning I recommend you read the wiki in The Oneworld Explorer User Guide)
With your proposed itinerary (mapped by Mwenenzi), you will use other means get yourself from MEL to OSL to start the RTW and then return from OSL to MEL at the end. This eastbound itinerary has 5 continents (by flying Europe/Middle East to South West Pacific you automatically include Asia).
If instead you fly westbound you can avoid Asia, reducing the itinerary to 4 continents (a saving of ~NOK8000 in the business class base fare). Here's a very simple westbound itinerary OSL-LHR-LAX-SYD-JNB-LHR-OSL
Another option is to start from elsewhere in TC2. How about South Africa? It is one of the lower cost starting countries too.
A minimalist itinerary for this is JNB-LHR-SCL-SYD-JNB. By starting in Africa, there will be no restriction on stopovers in Europe/Middle East (it is no longer your continent of origin)
If you start in Europe then you get to visit Europe twice.
If you start in Africa then you get to visit Africa twice.
Note 1
One of the Fare Rules states: 4(b) "Travel must be in a continuous forward direction between TC1 - TC2 - TC3..."
So you start one TC, then visit the other two and end back in your starting TC.
Therefore, if you want to visit a TC twice then it must be the starting TC.
You are wanting to visit TC2 twice (Europe to start, and later South Africa).
Therefore you must start somewhere in TC2.
#3347




Join Date: Oct 2023
Posts: 9
Thank you so much. Yes, we are heading to Europe in December and then South Africa the year after. Coming home to Australia in btw. Being based in Melbourne we would take advantage of the SWP extra sectors to go somewhere we havent been before (like Tonga). We have looked at return flights to each and seeing what is best value out there.
We are looking at Business Class and so DONE4 or DONE5. We've done a couple of these tickets starting in Sth Africa, or Tokyo on prior trips.
The challenge with the Westbound trip is time. (Which in December is unfortunately in short demand ).
Do you think we are best to start OSL-PER via DOH or via LHR (both transit only) based on first carrier and taxes?
thanks again
We are looking at Business Class and so DONE4 or DONE5. We've done a couple of these tickets starting in Sth Africa, or Tokyo on prior trips.
The challenge with the Westbound trip is time. (Which in December is unfortunately in short demand ).
Do you think we are best to start OSL-PER via DOH or via LHR (both transit only) based on first carrier and taxes?
thanks again
#3348
FlyerTalk Evangelist


Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 22,914
Thank you so much. Yes, we are heading to Europe in December and then South Africa the year after. Coming home to Australia in btw. Being based in Melbourne we would take advantage of the SWP extra sectors to go somewhere we haven't been before (like Tonga). We have looked at return flights to each and seeing what is best value out there.
We are looking at Business Class and so DONE4 or DONE5. We've done a couple of these tickets starting in Sth Africa, or Tokyo on prior trips.
The challenge with the Westbound trip is time. (Which in December is unfortunately in short demand ).
Do you think we are best to start OSL-PER via DOH or via LHR (both transit only) based on first carrier and taxes?
thanks again
We are looking at Business Class and so DONE4 or DONE5. We've done a couple of these tickets starting in Sth Africa, or Tokyo on prior trips.
The challenge with the Westbound trip is time. (Which in December is unfortunately in short demand ).
Do you think we are best to start OSL-PER via DOH or via LHR (both transit only) based on first carrier and taxes?
thanks again
On you previous *ONE* trips did you book on line or with a travel agent?
Note real taxes and carrier surcharges YQ YR are not the same thing. Is a post by serfty on minimizing surcharges. With so many QF flights will have a lot of Qantas carrier surcharges.
#3349




Join Date: Aug 2004
Programs: AA (EP), Hilton (Diamond), Marriott Bonvoy (Titanium)
Posts: 9,133
My assumption is that the bulk of the charge is YQ / YR, but ultimately I'm curious to understand what would be determining factors for the entire amount. When I asked the TA (and it was to a certain extent moot because i was going to book the ticket anyway) I was told they couldn't know without some trial and error on different routes etc. I'm trying to find out more, so that when I book next time, I can go into the process with a more informed view as to what works and what doesn't. For example, I could just as easily do an ex-TYO DONE4 (which appears to have a good base ticket price, based on the latest table I've seen), and would do so if that made a material difference to the taxes and surcharges.
- YQ/YR "fuel surcharges" are assigned by airlines to sectors. E.g., booking AA vs BA vs AY transatlantic may have different YQ/YR for that sector. The amount each airline charges for each flight is in the GDS, which the ticketing airline or TA uses to calculate the total price, but I'm not aware of any tool that makes it easy to extract the data. The closest might be to use matrix.itasoftware.com to price a simple one-flight one-way and see what it shows for the YQ/YR.
- Some airlines are careful to charge every YQ/YR applicable (hello, AA) while others (hi, JAL) sometimes omit a YQ/YR here and there.
- Some airports or countries have higher taxes (actual taxes, not pretend taxes that are really carrier-imposed charges). For example, a flight or series of connecting flights that originates in the U.K. incurs the U.K. APD (Air Passenger Duty), a tax based on the distance from London to the capital of the terminating country and if the class of service is coach or a higher cabin. If transiting London, it's best to make sure London is a connection rather than a stop, or if it must be a stop, that the flight(s) from London to the next stop are to a nearby country,
#3350




Join Date: Oct 2023
Posts: 9
So already have separate tickets to EU?
On you previous *ONE* trips did you book on line or with a travel agent?
Note real taxes and carrier surcharges YQ YR are not the same thing. Is a post by serfty on minimizing surcharges. With so many QF flights will have a lot of Qantas carrier surcharges.
On you previous *ONE* trips did you book on line or with a travel agent?
Note real taxes and carrier surcharges YQ YR are not the same thing. Is a post by serfty on minimizing surcharges. With so many QF flights will have a lot of Qantas carrier surcharges.
thanks again for your help
#3351




Join Date: Oct 2023
Posts: 9
First can I check that I'm understanding you properly. What you're wanting to do is:
And you are exploring whether a RTW will give you more/be better value for you.
At this stage you are not looking to travel more widely - say in North America or Asia.
But would be interested in South Pacific travel, while you are back in Australia.
Have I got it right?
To achieve what you want, you must start from somewhere in Tariff Conference 2 (TC2 - i.e. Europe/Middle East/Africa)
(see Note 1 below for why starting elsewhere will not work for you. And by the way, if you are new to RTW planning I recommend you read the wiki in The Oneworld Explorer User Guide)
With your proposed itinerary (mapped by Mwenenzi), you will use other means get yourself from MEL to OSL to start the RTW and then return from OSL to MEL at the end. This eastbound itinerary has 5 continents (by flying Europe/Middle East to South West Pacific you automatically include Asia).
If instead you fly westbound you can avoid Asia, reducing the itinerary to 4 continents (a saving of ~NOK8000 in the business class base fare). Here's a very simple westbound itinerary OSL-LHR-LAX-SYD-JNB-LHR-OSL
Another option is to start from elsewhere in TC2. How about South Africa? It is one of the lower cost starting countries too.
A minimalist itinerary for this is JNB-LHR-SCL-SYD-JNB. By starting in Africa, there will be no restriction on stopovers in Europe/Middle East (it is no longer your continent of origin)
If you start in Europe then you get to visit Europe twice.
If you start in Africa then you get to visit Africa twice.
Note 1
One of the Fare Rules states: 4(b) "Travel must be in a continuous forward direction between TC1 - TC2 - TC3..."
So you start one TC, then visit the other two and end back in your starting TC.
Therefore, if you want to visit a TC twice then it must be the starting TC.
You are wanting to visit TC2 twice (Europe to start, and later South Africa).
Therefore you must start somewhere in TC2.
- Travel from Australia to Europe in December 2026
- Return to Australia
- Travel from Australia to South Africa in September 2027
- Return to Australia
And you are exploring whether a RTW will give you more/be better value for you.
At this stage you are not looking to travel more widely - say in North America or Asia.
But would be interested in South Pacific travel, while you are back in Australia.
Have I got it right?
To achieve what you want, you must start from somewhere in Tariff Conference 2 (TC2 - i.e. Europe/Middle East/Africa)
(see Note 1 below for why starting elsewhere will not work for you. And by the way, if you are new to RTW planning I recommend you read the wiki in The Oneworld Explorer User Guide)
With your proposed itinerary (mapped by Mwenenzi), you will use other means get yourself from MEL to OSL to start the RTW and then return from OSL to MEL at the end. This eastbound itinerary has 5 continents (by flying Europe/Middle East to South West Pacific you automatically include Asia).
If instead you fly westbound you can avoid Asia, reducing the itinerary to 4 continents (a saving of ~NOK8000 in the business class base fare). Here's a very simple westbound itinerary OSL-LHR-LAX-SYD-JNB-LHR-OSL
Another option is to start from elsewhere in TC2. How about South Africa? It is one of the lower cost starting countries too.
A minimalist itinerary for this is JNB-LHR-SCL-SYD-JNB. By starting in Africa, there will be no restriction on stopovers in Europe/Middle East (it is no longer your continent of origin)
If you start in Europe then you get to visit Europe twice.
If you start in Africa then you get to visit Africa twice.
Note 1
One of the Fare Rules states: 4(b) "Travel must be in a continuous forward direction between TC1 - TC2 - TC3..."
So you start one TC, then visit the other two and end back in your starting TC.
Therefore, if you want to visit a TC twice then it must be the starting TC.
You are wanting to visit TC2 twice (Europe to start, and later South Africa).
Therefore you must start somewhere in TC2.
#3352




Join Date: Aug 2004
Programs: AA (EP), Hilton (Diamond), Marriott Bonvoy (Titanium)
Posts: 9,133
Just on this one small point, I recommend transiting DOH rather than LHR to get between Europe and Australia. QR operates their Qsuite-equipped 777 and A350 between DOH and Australia. QR's A380s do not have Qsuite. Qsuite is the nicest business class in oneworld. It's even nicer if you're flyig with someone because you can get an EF seat pair, which open into essentially your own two-person suite.
#3353




Join Date: Aug 2004
Programs: AA (EP), Hilton (Diamond), Marriott Bonvoy (Titanium)
Posts: 9,133
A well-informed BA agent said as much about a change I was trying to make. I thought the issue was purely about married segments, so was scratching my head when EF showed D2 on those flights. She said Point of Commencement is factored in too. Those combination of factors isn't available from any public sources, AFAIK, though ExpertFlyer are aware this is a weakness of its current service.
#3354
Join Date: Jun 2024
Location: London
Programs: BAEC GGL; FB PLAT
Posts: 34
There are several factors I'm aware of:
Your TA should be able to give you a breakdown of the taxes, fees, and surcharges, but the ease of obtaining this varies by airline/TA. For example, I recently purchased a BA-issued ticket, and asked BA agents for the info. They insist that it's impossible to know until after I fly, at which point I can use a form on BA's website that discloses all fees and taxes. BA's eticket receipt that is emailed upon purchase does show the base fare, actual taxes, and airline-imposed fees, but as a whole, not broken down by outbound versus inbound, much less segment by segment. When purchasing a ticket from AA, the emailed eticket confirmation lumps carrier overcharges in with taxes, but one can call AA and the agent can provide the total YQ/YR. I called JAL to get the breakdown for a recent DONE5 that I purchased from them, and to my surprise, the agent started rattling off each charge by its code and its segment number! For example, "Segment six, YQ $125." When calculating what AA earnings should be, knowing the specific segments is tremendously helpful.
- YQ/YR "fuel surcharges" are assigned by airlines to sectors. E.g., booking AA vs BA vs AY transatlantic may have different YQ/YR for that sector. The amount each airline charges for each flight is in the GDS, which the ticketing airline or TA uses to calculate the total price, but I'm not aware of any tool that makes it easy to extract the data. The closest might be to use matrix.itasoftware.com to price a simple one-flight one-way and see what it shows for the YQ/YR.
- Some airlines are careful to charge every YQ/YR applicable (hello, AA) while others (hi, JAL) sometimes omit a YQ/YR here and there.
- Some airports or countries have higher taxes (actual taxes, not pretend taxes that are really carrier-imposed charges). For example, a flight or series of connecting flights that originates in the U.K. incurs the U.K. APD (Air Passenger Duty), a tax based on the distance from London to the capital of the terminating country and if the class of service is coach or a higher cabin. If transiting London, it's best to make sure London is a connection rather than a stop, or if it must be a stop, that the flight(s) from London to the next stop are to a nearby country,
Your TA should be able to give you a breakdown of the taxes, fees, and surcharges, but the ease of obtaining this varies by airline/TA. For example, I recently purchased a BA-issued ticket, and asked BA agents for the info. They insist that it's impossible to know until after I fly, at which point I can use a form on BA's website that discloses all fees and taxes. BA's eticket receipt that is emailed upon purchase does show the base fare, actual taxes, and airline-imposed fees, but as a whole, not broken down by outbound versus inbound, much less segment by segment. When purchasing a ticket from AA, the emailed eticket confirmation lumps carrier overcharges in with taxes, but one can call AA and the agent can provide the total YQ/YR. I called JAL to get the breakdown for a recent DONE5 that I purchased from them, and to my surprise, the agent started rattling off each charge by its code and its segment number! For example, "Segment six, YQ $125." When calculating what AA earnings should be, knowing the specific segments is tremendously helpful.
#3355
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Melbourne
Programs: ►QFWP/LTG►VA WP►HyattDisc.►HiltonGold►ALL Plat.
Posts: 22,330
Just on this one small point, I recommend transiting DOH rather than LHR to get between Europe and Australia. QR operates their Qsuite-equipped 777 and A350 between DOH and Australia. QR's A380s do not have Qsuite. Qsuite is the nicest business class in oneworld. It's even nicer if you're flyig with someone because you can get an EF seat pair, which open into essentially your own two-person suite.
Having posted that, I'll happily fly either ...

#3356




Join Date: Aug 2004
Programs: AA (EP), Hilton (Diamond), Marriott Bonvoy (Titanium)
Posts: 9,133
#3357



Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: TPE / HSZ
Programs: CX GO (=SPH), IHG Diamond Amb, Hertz 5*, Accor, Hilton, National
Posts: 7,220
- YQ/YR "fuel surcharges" are assigned by airlines to sectors. E.g., booking AA vs BA vs AY transatlantic may have different YQ/YR for that sector. The amount each airline charges for each flight is in the GDS, which the ticketing airline or TA uses to calculate the total price, but I'm not aware of any tool that makes it easy to extract the data. The closest might be to use matrix.itasoftware.com to price a simple one-flight one-way and see what it shows for the YQ/YR.
#3358
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: BOS/UTH
Programs: AA LT PLT; QRPC PLT/OW EMD; Bonvoy LT Titanium
Posts: 14,572
Don't forget to try codeshares. UL has greatly limited availability in the D fare bucket, but I was able to get the flights I wanted from the AA RTW desk last night using one QF codeshare and one JL codeshare on flights operated by UL that had zero UL D availability. Got the codeshare info from EF.
#3359




Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: SORT OF HOMELESS
Programs: 14 years AA exp, but no more; & 1MM+, QR-PLT (ow EMD) MR-LTT, HH Gold
Posts: 8,104
I share your sentiment based on my recent HND-JFK on JL (D fare) as my first segment of a DONE3. Window seat has so much storage areas!
#3360




Join Date: Aug 2004
Programs: AA (EP), Hilton (Diamond), Marriott Bonvoy (Titanium)
Posts: 9,133
Don't forget to try codeshares. UL has greatly limited availability in the D fare bucket, but I was able to get the flights I wanted from the AA RTW desk last night using one QF codeshare and one JL codeshare on flights operated by UL that had zero UL D availability. Got the codeshare info from EF.
I had an RTW booked via JL a few years ago where I used an SWU to upgrade an AA prime flight. When AA reissued it, they changed all codeshares to prime. Really pissed me off because it slashed the earnings.



