Oct 17, 2013, 2:44 pm
Last edit by: sdsearch
This Wiki links to recent significant devaluations of programs and the travel experience
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Points and Miles
Southwest Airlines, effective on or before April 19, 2016 with no notice, raised the minimum redemption price from 70 to 72 points per dollar, a 3% devaluation. Southwest has now devalued redemption rates every April for three years running with increased stealth each time.
Southwest Airlines effective April 17, 2015: "the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors." This extraordinarily vague announcement leaves members, at least for now, with no idea what their points will be worth. It also opens the door to unlimited changes in the value of points with no notice.
Delta Increase in number of miles needed for business class travel from US to Europe starting Summer 2014. Up 125k from 100k RT. Delta followed this devaluation on November 8 with a second announcement that higher award prices will start immediately for travel on after February 1, 2014. These changes confirm that among US airlines Delta is the king of zero-notice devaluations.
In February 2014, Delta announced a major overhaul to the SkyMiles program. Beginning in 2015, miles will be earned based on revenue, not distance flown, at rates highly unfavorable to all but top dollar elites. Delta did not switch to fare-based redemptions, but did announce the number of award redemption levels would be increased from the current three to five. Delta has ominously not published the prices for the new tiers and will not do so until late 2014. See: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...ay-awards.html
Sometime in 2016 (discovered in November), Delta again increased the number of miles needed for business class redemption USA to Europe, from 125k to 140k round trip. This was discovered through a new independently-generated Delta award chart: http://travelisfree.com/wp-content/u...ward-Chart.png
Delta Airlines has introduced variable award pricing effective for flights on or after June 1, 2016, coming full circle on its decision several months ago to eliminate its published award chart.
Delta also expanded the fare classes for which mileage upgrades can be redeemed, but simultaneously increased the price between 2-3x on average.
Delta has also begun enforcing married segment logic on awards, and now requires individuals and agents to search O&D instead of putting together itineraries point-to-point.
Delta provides complimentary Sky Club access for Diamond Medallion members. Previously, if one already had a Sky Club membership upon attaining Diamond status, the membership was extended. As of late 2015, Delta no longer extends existing Sky Club memberships upon attaining Diamond status; rather, the complimentary Diamond membership runs concurrently with any previously purchased memberships.
Delta has eliminated the ability to route between the US and the Southwest Pacific via Asia on award tickets. This effectively eliminates the primary method for traveling to the Southwest Pacific at saver mileage levels (partners such as KE, CI, CZ, MU).
British Airways effective April 28, 2015 makes many changes to Avios. Redemption levels increase for most premium cabin travel. Most coach awards stay about the same. One benefit is an ample number of off-peak dates for redemption at lower levels in each class. Upgrade using Avios pricing increases dramatically. Tier status will be harder to earn.
Southwest Airlines effective March 31, 2014: redeem 70 points per dollar, up from 60
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...31-2014-a.html
The first wholesale devaluation in a revenue-based redemption program.
Edited to add: On January 27, 2014, with no advance notice, Southwest removed the excise tax from its point computation. The effect was to revalue its points 7.5% for redemption and simultaneously devalue future flight earnings 7.5%. The net effect is 7.5% positive for existing balances and for credit card and other partner earnings, neutral for future flight earnings, and 7.5% negative for points-based elite qualification. This change reverses about half of the March 31 devaluation. See http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...stockpile.html
United adds revenue requirements to Premier Qualification, effective 2014
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...ification.html
Mileage runners on rock-bottom fares may be out of luck
Increases many award prices and splits chart: one for United-only (or United plus lower cabin on partners) awards and one for Star Alliance awards. Some awards 90%+ more expensive.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...eb-2014-a.html
Qantas in June 2013 removed online availability of Any Seat Awards (reward seats at Classic rates which earn points and status credits) and ramped up the points and cash requirements for Any Seat Awards: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qanta...site-asas.html. In November 2013, the points requirements for domestic upgrades were raised between 20 and 25%: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qanta...-upgrades.html
Hilton HHonors turns its entire award system topsy turvy June 13 2013 - some major devaluations; guide thread to the many changes:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hilto...ne-2013-a.html
Prepare in most instances to spend many more points
SPG increase cash&points requirements by 20-25% in March 2013.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/starw...05-2013-a.html
Changes:
Cat 1: +300 Starpoints, +$5
Cat 2: +400 Starpoints, +$5
Cat 3: +700 Starpoints, +$10
Cat 4: +1,000 Starpoints, +$15
Cat 5: +1,200 Starpoints, +$20
Cat 6: +2,000 Starpoints, +$30
Cat 7: No change
Hyatt increases award levels by appr 5-10%, 6 high-end properties go up significantly as new Cat 7 level is introduced: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hyatt...-7-2014-a.html
Wyndham devalued its points-to-miles transfers by 50% with no notice on January 31, 2014: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wyndh...onversion.html
Amtrak to move to revenue based redemption ?.
Travel Experience
Alaska Airlines adds a row of seats
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alask...r-outlets.html
Alaska Airlines discontinues Glenlivet
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alask...glenlivet.html
American Airlines' new 777-300ER marks change from 3x3x3 to 3x4x3 in coach / "Main Cabin" (will extend to 777-200ER during late 2014)
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...solidated.html
"Main Cabin Extra" with extra legroom for elites or for pay
Southwest Airlines adds a row of seats
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...knee-room.html
United Airlines changes free alcohol selection in the United Club - many see new options as cheaper and more limited: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...ct-2013-a.html
To be notified when someone posts an update to this thread, click on Thread Tools in the blue bar above. Select "Subscribe to this Thread" from the pull-down menu and click. Select "Instant notification by Email" and "Add Subscription".
If you need to establish or change your email address for Flyertalk, select "MyFlyerTalk" at the left of the blue bar, then "Edit Email & Password".
Points and Miles
Southwest Airlines, effective on or before April 19, 2016 with no notice, raised the minimum redemption price from 70 to 72 points per dollar, a 3% devaluation. Southwest has now devalued redemption rates every April for three years running with increased stealth each time.
Southwest Airlines effective April 17, 2015: "the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors." This extraordinarily vague announcement leaves members, at least for now, with no idea what their points will be worth. It also opens the door to unlimited changes in the value of points with no notice.
Delta Increase in number of miles needed for business class travel from US to Europe starting Summer 2014. Up 125k from 100k RT. Delta followed this devaluation on November 8 with a second announcement that higher award prices will start immediately for travel on after February 1, 2014. These changes confirm that among US airlines Delta is the king of zero-notice devaluations.
In February 2014, Delta announced a major overhaul to the SkyMiles program. Beginning in 2015, miles will be earned based on revenue, not distance flown, at rates highly unfavorable to all but top dollar elites. Delta did not switch to fare-based redemptions, but did announce the number of award redemption levels would be increased from the current three to five. Delta has ominously not published the prices for the new tiers and will not do so until late 2014. See: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...ay-awards.html
Sometime in 2016 (discovered in November), Delta again increased the number of miles needed for business class redemption USA to Europe, from 125k to 140k round trip. This was discovered through a new independently-generated Delta award chart: http://travelisfree.com/wp-content/u...ward-Chart.png
Delta Airlines has introduced variable award pricing effective for flights on or after June 1, 2016, coming full circle on its decision several months ago to eliminate its published award chart.
Delta also expanded the fare classes for which mileage upgrades can be redeemed, but simultaneously increased the price between 2-3x on average.
Delta has also begun enforcing married segment logic on awards, and now requires individuals and agents to search O&D instead of putting together itineraries point-to-point.
Delta provides complimentary Sky Club access for Diamond Medallion members. Previously, if one already had a Sky Club membership upon attaining Diamond status, the membership was extended. As of late 2015, Delta no longer extends existing Sky Club memberships upon attaining Diamond status; rather, the complimentary Diamond membership runs concurrently with any previously purchased memberships.
Delta has eliminated the ability to route between the US and the Southwest Pacific via Asia on award tickets. This effectively eliminates the primary method for traveling to the Southwest Pacific at saver mileage levels (partners such as KE, CI, CZ, MU).
British Airways effective April 28, 2015 makes many changes to Avios. Redemption levels increase for most premium cabin travel. Most coach awards stay about the same. One benefit is an ample number of off-peak dates for redemption at lower levels in each class. Upgrade using Avios pricing increases dramatically. Tier status will be harder to earn.
Southwest Airlines effective March 31, 2014: redeem 70 points per dollar, up from 60
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...31-2014-a.html
The first wholesale devaluation in a revenue-based redemption program.
Edited to add: On January 27, 2014, with no advance notice, Southwest removed the excise tax from its point computation. The effect was to revalue its points 7.5% for redemption and simultaneously devalue future flight earnings 7.5%. The net effect is 7.5% positive for existing balances and for credit card and other partner earnings, neutral for future flight earnings, and 7.5% negative for points-based elite qualification. This change reverses about half of the March 31 devaluation. See http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...stockpile.html
United adds revenue requirements to Premier Qualification, effective 2014
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...ification.html
Mileage runners on rock-bottom fares may be out of luck
Increases many award prices and splits chart: one for United-only (or United plus lower cabin on partners) awards and one for Star Alliance awards. Some awards 90%+ more expensive.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...eb-2014-a.html
Qantas in June 2013 removed online availability of Any Seat Awards (reward seats at Classic rates which earn points and status credits) and ramped up the points and cash requirements for Any Seat Awards: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qanta...site-asas.html. In November 2013, the points requirements for domestic upgrades were raised between 20 and 25%: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qanta...-upgrades.html
Hilton HHonors turns its entire award system topsy turvy June 13 2013 - some major devaluations; guide thread to the many changes:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hilto...ne-2013-a.html
Prepare in most instances to spend many more points
SPG increase cash&points requirements by 20-25% in March 2013.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/starw...05-2013-a.html
Changes:
Cat 1: +300 Starpoints, +$5
Cat 2: +400 Starpoints, +$5
Cat 3: +700 Starpoints, +$10
Cat 4: +1,000 Starpoints, +$15
Cat 5: +1,200 Starpoints, +$20
Cat 6: +2,000 Starpoints, +$30
Cat 7: No change
Hyatt increases award levels by appr 5-10%, 6 high-end properties go up significantly as new Cat 7 level is introduced: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hyatt...-7-2014-a.html
Wyndham devalued its points-to-miles transfers by 50% with no notice on January 31, 2014: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wyndh...onversion.html
Amtrak to move to revenue based redemption ?.
Travel Experience
Alaska Airlines adds a row of seats
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alask...r-outlets.html
Alaska Airlines discontinues Glenlivet
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alask...glenlivet.html
American Airlines' new 777-300ER marks change from 3x3x3 to 3x4x3 in coach / "Main Cabin" (will extend to 777-200ER during late 2014)
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...solidated.html
"Main Cabin Extra" with extra legroom for elites or for pay
Southwest Airlines adds a row of seats
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...knee-room.html
United Airlines changes free alcohol selection in the United Club - many see new options as cheaper and more limited: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...ct-2013-a.html
[Wiki] Recent Devaluations
Oct 17, 2013 | 2:43 pm
#1
Original Poster
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN A-list preferred, United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 22,846
[Wiki] Recent Devaluations
Requests to all members:
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6. When you edit this or any other Wiki, please make a post to the thread briefly describing what you changed. Your post will push this thread to the top of the forum, drawing readers' attention back to it.
If everyone pitches in, this structure can work superbly to provide concise information quickly on all kinds of topics.
1. Please take it on yourself to keep this thread's Wiki up to date. If you have 90 posts and 90 days of membership, you can edit this Wiki. If not, you can post an edit request on this thread and some other member will do the edit for you.
2. This thread's Wiki should summarize the facts at an introductory level, allowing new arrivals to get up to speed quickly and painlessly.
3. When you follow a link from this Wiki, please check that the target thread has a Wiki summarizing it. If not, please create a Wiki for that thread.
4. How to create a Wiki is not obvious. Open the thread. In the blue bar above the first post, near the right, look for Thread Tools. Click the down arrow to pull down the Thread Tools menu. Halfway down that menu select Create a Wikipost.
5. If you are new to FlyerTalk or just new to the subject, read the target thread's Wiki first. Diving into the detailed discussion in the target thread is completely optional.
6. When you edit this or any other Wiki, please make a post to the thread briefly describing what you changed. Your post will push this thread to the top of the forum, drawing readers' attention back to it.
If everyone pitches in, this structure can work superbly to provide concise information quickly on all kinds of topics.
Last edited by nsx; Oct 17, 2013 at 2:49 pm
Feb 3, 2014 | 6:57 pm
#3
Original Poster
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN A-list preferred, United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 22,846
Southwest has revalued its points 7.5% and simultaneously devalued flight earnings 7.5%. The net effect is 7.5% positive for existing balances and for credit card and other partner earnings, neutral for future flight earnings, and 7.5% negative for points-based elite qualification.
See http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...stockpile.html
See http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/south...stockpile.html
Feb 28, 2014 | 10:29 pm
#6
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Added Delta's major devaluation of the SkyMiles program, switching from distance-based to revenue-based mileage accrual.
Feb 13, 2015 | 2:06 pm
#7
Original Poster
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN A-list preferred, United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 22,846
I added these three 2015 Razzies to the top of the Wiki:
Southwest Airlines effective April 17, 2015: "the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors." This extraordinarily vague announcement leaves members, at least for now, with no idea what their points will be worth. It also opens the door to unlimited changes in the value of points with no notice.
Delta Airlines has eliminated its published award chart without warning, presumably in order to allow award pricing to be better fine tuned. This also opens the door to unlimited changes in the value of miles with no notice.
British Airways effective April 28, 2015 makes many changes to Avios. Redemption levels increase for most premium cabin travel. Most coach awards stay about the same. One benefit is an ample number of off-peak dates for redemption at lower levels in each class. Upgrade using Avios pricing increases dramatically. Tier status will be harder to earn.
'Tis the season to be grumpy about devaluations. If I have overlooked any important adverse changes to any programs from March 2014 through January 2015, please add them to the Wiki and post them here.
Southwest Airlines effective April 17, 2015: "the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors." This extraordinarily vague announcement leaves members, at least for now, with no idea what their points will be worth. It also opens the door to unlimited changes in the value of points with no notice.
Delta Airlines has eliminated its published award chart without warning, presumably in order to allow award pricing to be better fine tuned. This also opens the door to unlimited changes in the value of miles with no notice.
British Airways effective April 28, 2015 makes many changes to Avios. Redemption levels increase for most premium cabin travel. Most coach awards stay about the same. One benefit is an ample number of off-peak dates for redemption at lower levels in each class. Upgrade using Avios pricing increases dramatically. Tier status will be harder to earn.
'Tis the season to be grumpy about devaluations. If I have overlooked any important adverse changes to any programs from March 2014 through January 2015, please add them to the Wiki and post them here.
Jun 16, 2015 | 9:46 am
#8
Original Poster
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
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Posts: 22,846
Chase credit card churner crackdown commences
This isn't a devaluation of points, but a new barrier to earning points. Chase, by far the largest issuer of points and miles credit cards, has started cracking down on people who apply for new cards too frequently. From the Wiki of this thread:
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own branded cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom; but not United, Hyatt, IHG, etc) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened more than 5 credit cards in the past 24 months. The count includes cards opened at other banks and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user, not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <6 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user.
Jun 16, 2015 | 10:18 am
#9
Flyertalk Posting Legend Moderator: Credit Card Programs, American Express, Capital One, Chase, Citi, Diners Club, Eco Travel, Signatures
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Not even close. Chase issues ~15 cards which generate airline miles, hotel points or transferable proprietary points, and they only issue such cards in the USA and Canada.
American Express (USA) issues ~23 miles/points cards, and they issue such cards worldwide.
What is important for USA members to realize is that the three large rewards card factories: American Express, Chase, and Citi have each recently implemented rules which preclude earning a new account bonus for 12, 18 or 24 months after opening, holding or closing the identical card. Each bank's rules are different, American Express has even adopted a "one bonus per product per lifetime" policy for personal cards (but not for business cards). This all means that an individual needs to do some research before applying for a card, in particular if not following this topic closely since mid-2014.
American Express (USA) issues ~23 miles/points cards, and they issue such cards worldwide.
What is important for USA members to realize is that the three large rewards card factories: American Express, Chase, and Citi have each recently implemented rules which preclude earning a new account bonus for 12, 18 or 24 months after opening, holding or closing the identical card. Each bank's rules are different, American Express has even adopted a "one bonus per product per lifetime" policy for personal cards (but not for business cards). This all means that an individual needs to do some research before applying for a card, in particular if not following this topic closely since mid-2014.
Jun 21, 2015 | 6:02 pm
#10
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Jun 27, 2015 | 7:35 pm
#11
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Added a note that Delta now enforces married segment logic on awards, and requires individuals and agents to search O&D instead of piecing together itineraries point-to-point. Delta's systems actively attempt to prohibit point-to-point ticketing, and even if you are successful, it will result in additive pricing even if the routing would normally be allowed between the origin and destination. This is dramatically reducing the number of available results, especially on international itineraries involving partners.
Jul 14, 2015 | 4:52 pm
#12
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Delta announced today that for flights on or after 6/1/16, "the number of miles needed will change based on destination, demand and other dynamics." The dynamic award pricing that was foreshadowed by the removal of published award charts has finally arrived.
Delta also expanded the fare classes for which mileage upgrades can be redeemed, but simultaneously increased the price between 2-3x on average. For example, US-Europe upgrades could previously be obtained for 25k SkyMiles. Now they are 60k, or 80k if redeeming from the newly eligible lower fares.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...uncements.html
Delta also expanded the fare classes for which mileage upgrades can be redeemed, but simultaneously increased the price between 2-3x on average. For example, US-Europe upgrades could previously be obtained for 25k SkyMiles. Now they are 60k, or 80k if redeeming from the newly eligible lower fares.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...uncements.html
Last edited by javabytes; Jul 14, 2015 at 4:57 pm
Aug 17, 2015 | 2:32 pm
#13
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Aug 17, 2015 | 5:42 pm
#14
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Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
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Aug 17, 2015 | 7:02 pm
#15
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Join Date: Jan 2005
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Posts: 26,111
Amtrak Guest Rewards will continue to grow in importance
Amtrak Guest Rewards members will soon have more flexibility in earnings
and redemptions, and
Be able to book, modify, and cancel reward tickets themselves on
Amtrak.com or mobile.
Amtrak Guest Rewards members will soon have more flexibility in earnings
and redemptions, and
Be able to book, modify, and cancel reward tickets themselves on
Amtrak.com or mobile.
Last edited by sdsearch; Aug 17, 2015 at 7:09 pm