(Gone) RGN - SFO in F $450 one way AI; other N. America cities included
May 3, 2012, 5:39 pm
#1817
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 642
It is obvious that all the various airlines involved did not request Vayama, and only Vayama, cancel the tickets, all at the same time.
Once Vayama decided to cancel the reservations, there is no way for Vayama to backtrack and reinstate the original tickets, correct? They would have to issue new tickets at the current price, I would assume?
Once Vayama decided to cancel the reservations, there is no way for Vayama to backtrack and reinstate the original tickets, correct? They would have to issue new tickets at the current price, I would assume?
May 3, 2012, 5:40 pm
#1818
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Long Island, NY
Programs: United 1K, AA Plat Exec, DL Plat, Marriott Titanium Lifetime Elite, Hilton Gold, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 1,872
I believe it is also a violation to not be able to be reached when taking an action like this. I think it is California law, not 100% sure, but it specifically said they could NOT hide, and MUST make themselves available.
May 3, 2012, 5:41 pm
#1820
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: LAX
Programs: AA Gold (prev. Ex Plat for 10 years); DL Plat; UA Gold; Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,339
Expedia: THE INFORMATION, SOFTWARE, PRODUCTS, AND SERVICES PUBLISHED ON THIS WEBSITE MAY INCLUDE INACCURACIES OR ERRORS, INCLUDING PRICING ERRORS. IN PARTICULAR, THE EXPEDIA COMPANIES AND EXPEDIA AFFILIATES DO NOT GUARANTEE THE ACCURACY OF, AND DISCLAIM ALL LIABILITY FOR ANY ERRORS OR OTHER INACCURACIES RELATING TO THE INFORMATION AND DESCRIPTION OF THE HOTEL, AIR, CRUISE, CAR AND OTHER TRAVEL PRODUCTS AND SERVICES DISPLAYED ON THIS WEBSITE (INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, THE PRICING, PHOTOGRAPHS, LIST OF HOTEL AMENITIES, GENERAL PRODUCT DESCRIPTIONS, ETC.). IN ADDITION, EXPEDIA, INC. EXPRESSLY RESERVES THE RIGHT TO CORRECT ANY PRICING ERRORS ON OUR WEBSITE AND/OR ON PENDING RESERVATIONS MADE UNDER AN INCORRECT PRICE. IN SUCH EVENT, IF AVAILABLE, WE WILL OFFER YOU THE OPPORTUNITY TO KEEP YOUR PENDING RESERVATION AT THE CORRECT PRICE OR WE WILL CANCEL YOUR RESERVATION WITHOUT PENALTY.
Travelocity:
TRAVELOCITY EXPRESSLY RESERVES THE RIGHT TO CORRECT ANY PRICING ERRORS (INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, TYPOGRAPHICAL OR DISPLAY ERRORS, INCORRECT THIRD PARTY SUPPLIER INFORMATION, AND CURRENCY CONVERSION MISCALCULATIONS) AND/OR TO CHANGE OR CANCEL PENDING RESERVATIONS MADE UNDER AN INCORRECT PRICE. THIS RIGHT APPLIES WHETHER OR NOT THE ORDER HAS BEEN CONFIRMED AND/OR YOUR CREDIT CARD CHARGED. IN THE EVENT OF A CORRECTION TO A PENDING RESERVATION, AS YOUR SOLE AND EXCLUSIVE REMEDY WE WILL OFFER YOU THE OPPORTUNITY TO KEEP YOUR PENDING RESERVATION AT THE CORRECT PRICE OR, AT YOUR OPTION, WE WILL CANCEL YOUR RESERVATION WITHOUT PENALTY.
Interesting that Travelocity expressly includes language re: currency conversions in their terms of use but also uses the word "pending" reservation. They do not describe the remedy for a change to pricing error for tickets that are confirmed and credit cards charged.
May 3, 2012, 5:45 pm
#1821
Join Date: May 2010
Location: LAX
Programs: AA LT PLT, DL 1MM, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 206
Interesting that Travelocity expressly includes language re: currency conversions in their terms of use but also uses the word "pending" reservation.
May 3, 2012, 5:46 pm
#1822
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Trenton, NJ (PHL, EWR)
Programs: A3 Gold, BA Bronze
Posts: 1,633
Still on the phone and being told it's Korean Airlines. I then read off all four of my flights, their #s and corresponding codeshares, and asked aginst what Korean Airlines has to do with this. I'm on hold again.
My ace in the hole is the new DOT regs, which I have open in a nice little .pdf on my computer.
My ace in the hole is the new DOT regs, which I have open in a nice little .pdf on my computer.
May 3, 2012, 5:47 pm
#1823
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 644
As far as other lawyers going after them, well, the apparently the DOT says that what the TA/airline did was wrong by not honoring it. That's not a big deal in other contexts, frankly,Just because the DOT says it's deceptive doesn't mean that your Attorney General will. And they've got enough on their hands with real victims: old folks who believed the Nigerian scammers and identity theft and Madoff-like schemes and fly-by-night operations.
But the DOT isn't going to reinstate your tickets. I would be surprised if the TAs get fined on this: morally, you guys simply don't have the high ground, and you know it. You didn't find this fare this when you were researching your trip to Bagan and booked it thinking that it was actually what business class tickets from Asia to the US cost. And yet you're furious, furious, that the tickets are being cancelled.
May 3, 2012, 5:55 pm
#1824
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: ICT
Programs: AA ExP
Posts: 1,860
you guys simply don't have the high ground, and you know it. You didn't find this fare this when you were researching your trip to Bagan and booked it thinking that it was actually what business class tickets from Asia to the US cost. And yet you're furious, furious, that the tickets are being cancelled.
May 3, 2012, 5:56 pm
#1825
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Trenton, NJ (PHL, EWR)
Programs: A3 Gold, BA Bronze
Posts: 1,633
I can find a fare for $1500ish in C BKK-CAI-JFK. Roughly same distance, and a 55% discount on items is not unheard of in a sale.
They F'd up. I was just told, "no no, sir, you may be ticketed on DL, with no Korean Airlines flights or codeshares, but the fare is still based off of Korea, so, we cancelled."
What's to stop them from cancelling any ticket that is initially billed as a great sale just because the airline tells them, "oh no, we now realize we can get more money for the fares. Please cancel these tickets, and the tickets of our competitors too so those people also have to search for new flights and potentially pick us." THAT is the issue here.
They F'd up. I was just told, "no no, sir, you may be ticketed on DL, with no Korean Airlines flights or codeshares, but the fare is still based off of Korea, so, we cancelled."
What's to stop them from cancelling any ticket that is initially billed as a great sale just because the airline tells them, "oh no, we now realize we can get more money for the fares. Please cancel these tickets, and the tickets of our competitors too so those people also have to search for new flights and potentially pick us." THAT is the issue here.
May 3, 2012, 5:58 pm
#1826
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: SIN
Programs: KL Life Platinum, QF Platinum, OZ Diamond, Marriott Ambassador
Posts: 213
Hi all,
I've been following this thread closely, all 122 pages so far.
I too have bought a RGN-YVR ticket, mostly on KE, and has since been cancelled by Vayama. I am holding on to another RGN-JFK, on SQ/AF/DL and this one is still breathing so far.
Hypothetical question ...
Vayama claims that this is an error fare, be it currency error or decimal error, I don't care. And Vayama has the right to cancel the ticket without any compensation to the passenger.
Say, my company secretary books me a ticket RGN-ICN for US$12,000 on Vayama. She (knows nothing of ticket pricing, and) shows me a week later and I told her that it should have been US$1,200 instead. I file a claim to Vayama claiming error fare. By that time, the airline, say it's KE in this case, has already correct their fare as they realised that no one will pay US$12,000 for a RGN-ICN ticket.
In this case, will Vayama cancel my ticket and fully refund my money?
It is clearly an error, right? Vayama should return my US$12,000 based on the principle of error fare as defined by their website. Or are the terms and condition on Vayama's website solely to protect their company only.
My point is that if I buy an error fare which benefits the TA/airlines, I'm screwed out of luck. But if I buy an error fare which benefits me, the TA/airlines have the right to cancel. Does not seem a level-playing field ...
Appreciate your constructive comments ...
I've been following this thread closely, all 122 pages so far.
I too have bought a RGN-YVR ticket, mostly on KE, and has since been cancelled by Vayama. I am holding on to another RGN-JFK, on SQ/AF/DL and this one is still breathing so far.
Hypothetical question ...
Vayama claims that this is an error fare, be it currency error or decimal error, I don't care. And Vayama has the right to cancel the ticket without any compensation to the passenger.
Say, my company secretary books me a ticket RGN-ICN for US$12,000 on Vayama. She (knows nothing of ticket pricing, and) shows me a week later and I told her that it should have been US$1,200 instead. I file a claim to Vayama claiming error fare. By that time, the airline, say it's KE in this case, has already correct their fare as they realised that no one will pay US$12,000 for a RGN-ICN ticket.
In this case, will Vayama cancel my ticket and fully refund my money?
It is clearly an error, right? Vayama should return my US$12,000 based on the principle of error fare as defined by their website. Or are the terms and condition on Vayama's website solely to protect their company only.
My point is that if I buy an error fare which benefits the TA/airlines, I'm screwed out of luck. But if I buy an error fare which benefits me, the TA/airlines have the right to cancel. Does not seem a level-playing field ...
Appreciate your constructive comments ...
May 3, 2012, 6:00 pm
#1827
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: HKG/YVR/NYC
Programs: AC 75K, A3*G, AS MVPG, AA LT Gold 1MM, JL/JGC (OWS) , Marriott Titanium, Hertz 5*, Avis PC
Posts: 3,697
What's everyone's thoughts on using the DOT complaint process for a ticket that doesn't originate or terminate in the US, but was issued by a US TA?
Vayama cancelled my RGN-BKK-ICN-YVR ticket, however I do have a copy of the e-ticket receipt from Airtrade International (Vayama) in California, as well as a copy of the credit card charge from Airtrade. Would the DOT ruling apply as the TA was US based?
Adrian
Vayama cancelled my RGN-BKK-ICN-YVR ticket, however I do have a copy of the e-ticket receipt from Airtrade International (Vayama) in California, as well as a copy of the credit card charge from Airtrade. Would the DOT ruling apply as the TA was US based?
Adrian
do an online complaint and mail all communications, and printing to them right away.
They did a follow-up for me over the OK problem, but that ticket didn't touch Canada so they had no jurisdiction but your does.
One rule of thumb, unlike the US DOT, the CTA looks back at Korean's condition of carriage as the rule
May 3, 2012, 6:01 pm
#1828
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 519
Don't be so sure about that; like any prosecutor, the DOT enforcement has enforcement discretion: cops don't have to arrest every pot-smoker they see, and the DOT doesn't have to fine for every violation that comes across it's path. Especially ones like this.
As far as other lawyers going after them, well, the apparently the DOT says that what the TA/airline did was wrong by not honoring it. That's not a big deal in other contexts, frankly,Just because the DOT says it's deceptive doesn't mean that your Attorney General will. And they've got enough on their hands with real victims: old folks who believed the Nigerian scammers and identity theft and Madoff-like schemes and fly-by-night operations.
But the DOT isn't going to reinstate your tickets. I would be surprised if the TAs get fined on this: morally, you guys simply don't have the high ground, and you know it. You didn't find this fare this when you were researching your trip to Bagan and booked it thinking that it was actually what business class tickets from Asia to the US cost. And yet you're furious, furious, that the tickets are being cancelled.
As far as other lawyers going after them, well, the apparently the DOT says that what the TA/airline did was wrong by not honoring it. That's not a big deal in other contexts, frankly,Just because the DOT says it's deceptive doesn't mean that your Attorney General will. And they've got enough on their hands with real victims: old folks who believed the Nigerian scammers and identity theft and Madoff-like schemes and fly-by-night operations.
But the DOT isn't going to reinstate your tickets. I would be surprised if the TAs get fined on this: morally, you guys simply don't have the high ground, and you know it. You didn't find this fare this when you were researching your trip to Bagan and booked it thinking that it was actually what business class tickets from Asia to the US cost. And yet you're furious, furious, that the tickets are being cancelled.
May 3, 2012, 6:01 pm
#1829
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: LAX
Programs: AA Gold (prev. Ex Plat for 10 years); DL Plat; UA Gold; Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,339
Moral ground is not really relevant in this situation. DOT doesn't discriminate one planeful of people stranded on a tarmac for hours on end from another simply because they are on a low-fare carrier and paid less or because they smell bad. Laws are written for the uniform benefit of everyone impacted by them.
May 3, 2012, 6:04 pm
#1830
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: HKG/YVR/NYC
Programs: AC 75K, A3*G, AS MVPG, AA LT Gold 1MM, JL/JGC (OWS) , Marriott Titanium, Hertz 5*, Avis PC
Posts: 3,697
What's everyone's thoughts on using the DOT complaint process for a ticket that doesn't originate or terminate in the US, but was issued by a US TA?
Vayama cancelled my RGN-BKK-ICN-YVR ticket, however I do have a copy of the e-ticket receipt from Airtrade International (Vayama) in California, as well as a copy of the credit card charge from Airtrade. Would the DOT ruling apply as the TA was US based?
Adrian
Vayama cancelled my RGN-BKK-ICN-YVR ticket, however I do have a copy of the e-ticket receipt from Airtrade International (Vayama) in California, as well as a copy of the credit card charge from Airtrade. Would the DOT ruling apply as the TA was US based?
Adrian
http://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/air-travel-complaints-1