Feedback to Marriott about the cutbacks
Sep 25, 2009 | 8:08 am
#16
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That was incredibly vague. Would you like to be more specific?
I am not that cynical, but I do think some properties will be quicker at restoring cutbacks while others will take their time. Some properties have not cut back at all or are starting to restore some things and/or offer stuff that was not offered before.
I am not that cynical, but I do think some properties will be quicker at restoring cutbacks while others will take their time. Some properties have not cut back at all or are starting to restore some things and/or offer stuff that was not offered before.
Sep 25, 2009 | 10:25 am
#17
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Bolding is mine. Marriott owns virtually no hotels. While corporate can make suggestions about ways to save cash, it cannot mandate cutbacks. Nor does it have an incentive to do so, since it gets paid off of revenues. Yes, it does have incentive payments after the owners' priority, but it would rather see the top line grow.
Sep 25, 2009 | 10:46 am
#18
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I didn't like the way their response was worded....could have been handled very very differently but the overall message was correct....hotels are street corner businesses and are run that way - corporate doesn't tell them how to manage their business but does tell them what the standards are....cutbacks are never mandated
By the way, I was out of the country, so can you bring me up to date on how the Spartans did against Central Michigan?
Last edited by ohmark; Sep 25, 2009 at 11:14 am
Sep 25, 2009 | 12:20 pm
#19
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 567
@ DL-DON
Please dont take it personal: As you slept almost 2/3 of a year at Marriott properties, you missed out a lot of opportunities in the past! Its a clever move to shop around as you will spend less for you stays; but after a while you might agree that independent from your preference every chain has their strengths and weaknesses.
Although I was hit by MR decision to devaluate my preferred Travel Package by 20% (= +50K MR points) and to close lounges from Friday midday to Sunday midday, I will slightly increase my nights at Marriotts this year while my overall nights will decline by 10%. But you should know that my decision where I stay goes by location, cash spend (rate & reward) and service level (in this order). Especially Global Rate Break, use of EEOs and Bonus Bucks brought me to Marriott.
Please dont take it personal: As you slept almost 2/3 of a year at Marriott properties, you missed out a lot of opportunities in the past! Its a clever move to shop around as you will spend less for you stays; but after a while you might agree that independent from your preference every chain has their strengths and weaknesses.
Although I was hit by MR decision to devaluate my preferred Travel Package by 20% (= +50K MR points) and to close lounges from Friday midday to Sunday midday, I will slightly increase my nights at Marriotts this year while my overall nights will decline by 10%. But you should know that my decision where I stay goes by location, cash spend (rate & reward) and service level (in this order). Especially Global Rate Break, use of EEOs and Bonus Bucks brought me to Marriott.
Sep 25, 2009 | 1:40 pm
#20
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I received the identical letter that DL-Don got several weeks ago. I responded in a similar manner and also mentioned the "not to overachieve" mandate and devaluation of points. I did not receive a reply.
Edit: I found my original reply from July of this year:
Edit: I found my original reply from July of this year:
Dear Mr. H--------,
Thank you for your e-mail. I am glad that Marriott has taken the time to notice my travel patterns and show concern. Despite the current economic climate, I have been traveling at more-or-less the same frequency but, yes, I have not been spending as much time in Marriott properties. Sometimes it has been due to logistics (no Marriott brand nearby) but in recent times on the occasions where I had a choice, I have occasionally picked a competitor over the Marriott brand.
The Marriott brand was once the total class act of both properties and loyalty programs. The perks of elite status (and I have been Platinum for over a decade) were appreciated and made an unpleasant job (as business travel can frequently be) more tolerable. As of late, there have been noticeable cutbacks at the properties. Marriott issued a now-infamous memo to its properties instructing them “not to over-achieve.” This made it to several travel sites on the Internet and made Marriott the subject for much ridicule but it points out how Marriott is undermining that “edge” that once gave them a competitive advantage.
An example of an annoying cutback is the reduction of newspaper delivery. A full service property where I recently stayed informed me that they now only get 15 USA Todays and 15 Wall Street Journals. This is for a 250 room property! If you weren’t at the front desk at 6AM to pick up a paper you were out of luck. (“But this is what Marriott told us to do” was the response when I raised my concern to the front desk management). You can’t even buy a newspaper at that property! By the way, _every_ other hotel I have stayed that is part of a major chain, limited or full service, has had a paper at my door every morning.
The Concierge Lounge is a very valuable elite benefit but many properties have cut back hours (no weekends whatsoever) and breakfast offerings, thereby diluting the benefit (“Marriott told us to…”).
I could go on about the new higher-point awards structure along with the “no blackout dates…unless the hotel just doesn’t want to offer award rooms” policy, but I’m sure you have already heard from many people on that one.
At the same time, other hotel chains have been very aggressive in courting business and has caught my, as well as some of my colleagues who were once very loyal to Marriott, attention. It is a competitive world out there.
Thank you for taking the time to read this. My comments were honest and my criticisms were meant to be constructive. I hope it helps Marriott to restore itself to its former standing in the hospitality industry.
keeton
Thank you for your e-mail. I am glad that Marriott has taken the time to notice my travel patterns and show concern. Despite the current economic climate, I have been traveling at more-or-less the same frequency but, yes, I have not been spending as much time in Marriott properties. Sometimes it has been due to logistics (no Marriott brand nearby) but in recent times on the occasions where I had a choice, I have occasionally picked a competitor over the Marriott brand.
The Marriott brand was once the total class act of both properties and loyalty programs. The perks of elite status (and I have been Platinum for over a decade) were appreciated and made an unpleasant job (as business travel can frequently be) more tolerable. As of late, there have been noticeable cutbacks at the properties. Marriott issued a now-infamous memo to its properties instructing them “not to over-achieve.” This made it to several travel sites on the Internet and made Marriott the subject for much ridicule but it points out how Marriott is undermining that “edge” that once gave them a competitive advantage.
An example of an annoying cutback is the reduction of newspaper delivery. A full service property where I recently stayed informed me that they now only get 15 USA Todays and 15 Wall Street Journals. This is for a 250 room property! If you weren’t at the front desk at 6AM to pick up a paper you were out of luck. (“But this is what Marriott told us to do” was the response when I raised my concern to the front desk management). You can’t even buy a newspaper at that property! By the way, _every_ other hotel I have stayed that is part of a major chain, limited or full service, has had a paper at my door every morning.
The Concierge Lounge is a very valuable elite benefit but many properties have cut back hours (no weekends whatsoever) and breakfast offerings, thereby diluting the benefit (“Marriott told us to…”).
I could go on about the new higher-point awards structure along with the “no blackout dates…unless the hotel just doesn’t want to offer award rooms” policy, but I’m sure you have already heard from many people on that one.
At the same time, other hotel chains have been very aggressive in courting business and has caught my, as well as some of my colleagues who were once very loyal to Marriott, attention. It is a competitive world out there.
Thank you for taking the time to read this. My comments were honest and my criticisms were meant to be constructive. I hope it helps Marriott to restore itself to its former standing in the hospitality industry.
keeton
Last edited by keeton; Sep 25, 2009 at 1:51 pm
Sep 25, 2009 | 2:06 pm
#21
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Originally Posted by From the Marriott response sent to Don
Unfortunately, we have no control over what the hotels decide to offer.
If the hotel has a big red "Marriott" sign out front, then Marriott (corporate) had better have control over what the hotels decide to offer.
This seems like a more and more common excuse used by companies everywhere to deflect criticism: "That's a franchise - it's not our problem." Or, in some industries "Those are our subcontractors; it's not our problem."
I've had United pull the same garbage with me about problems with UX. Their response "It's Podunk Air's problem." Hmmmm...sure looks like the United brand is painted on the fuselage, not Podunk Air's. Therefore, I expect United to resolve the issue.
Likewise, hearing Marriott blame an individual property for poor service and not take responsibility for it is appalling. Whether Marriott (corporate) ordered the cuts or not, it impacts the global brand more than anything.
I still think of the mainline Marriott and Renaissance business hotels as being a quality brand. I think of them as being, in general, a half-step above the typical Hilton, Sheraton, Westin, or Doubletree. But I have to admit: the deteriorating treatment of elites and reduced services mean that I'm moving a bigger mix of my stays to HHonors. IMHO, the brands need to be able to deliver through normal business cycles both up and down. As we move towards the next up cycle, I'm probably going to be doing fewer Marriott stays than I was leading into the recent down cycle. I'll drop to MR Gold and pick up HH Diamond - we'll see how aggressively HH wants to increase my volume there.
Sep 25, 2009 | 2:14 pm
#22
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Bolding is mine. Marriott owns virtually no hotels. While corporate can make suggestions about ways to save cash, it cannot mandate cutbacks. Nor does it have an incentive to do so, since it gets paid off of revenues. Yes, it does have incentive payments after the owners' priority, but it would rather see the top line grow.
Mike
Mike
--Marriott QA reduces or eliminates a standard, no longer enforcing a previous higher standard.
--Franchisees see that and the race to the bottom is on, as there is absolutely no incentive to do anything other than the Marriott standard.
So it's true, Marriott doesn't "mandate" cutbacks. Perhaps a better way to say it is that Marriott standards have fallen severely due to the current economic situation, and that is a de facto "control" over what the properties decide to offer.
It's like saying "we used to require you to throttle your car's accelerator 3/4 of the way at a minimum, so you'd go 70 mph. But we now only require you to throttle your car's accelerator 1/2 of the way at a minimum, to go 50 mph. Of course, we have no control over whether you push it more than 1/2 the way...but you'll be getting absolutely no bonuses, pats on the back, awards, kudos, or incentives from us if you do. Have a nice day."
What do you think most drivers would do in such a situation?
And of course, the "control" here is if next year the requirement to push the accelerator to 3/4 of the way returns.
Sep 25, 2009 | 2:28 pm
#23
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The only thing that might stop properties from cutting back offerings is if competing properties are not doing the same. That might explain the higher service offerings on the West Coast. The downtown Hilton is better run than most Hiltons, and I am sure that influences the two Marriott properties in downtown Portland to offer more. The Hyatt Bellevue also provides good competition for the Marriott in Redmond.
Sep 25, 2009 | 3:23 pm
#24
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its inaccurate canned responses like this that make me want to keep going and never look back
Sep 25, 2009 | 8:20 pm
#25
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And sometimes it comes down to the individual hotel. I stay (a lot) at the Ren LAX - the staff knows me and does a great job. Yeah, I miss some of the things in the cutbacks (would love a vegetable plate in the lounge, and something savory like nuts after the hors d'ourves are taken away). If my choice were the Marriott or the Westin, I'd probably choose the Westin - the Marriott is not that great and the rooms were noisy last time I was there. But the Ren is smaller and the folks are great.
Sep 26, 2009 | 12:17 am
#26
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I'm in a similar situation except its not the Westin its the Gateway Sheraton LAX. Like you, I swore up and down by the Renaissance. It was my #1 choice for a hotel in the south bay/LAX area.
the lounge cutbacks though were enough for me to abandon them completely. It is where they had a competitve adv over every other property. When I combined that with the usual jr. suite upgrade, the availability of free parking on the street nearby, the great staff. it was a no brainer.
Now I get the suites at the Sheraton as well, a good staff thats a hair below the Renaissance but not enough to really make a difference, and parking is not quite as available.. but it can be had if I'm on a personal trip with a bit of a walk. However the CL is what I really enjoy and they still have it open 7 days a week at the Sheraton and stock it pretty well. the rates I get at the sheraton have always beat the rates at the marriott by a ball park number of $10 to 15 per night as well. Hence now its just no brainer to stay at the Gateway LAX these days and just dump the Ren and all MR props
the lounge cutbacks though were enough for me to abandon them completely. It is where they had a competitve adv over every other property. When I combined that with the usual jr. suite upgrade, the availability of free parking on the street nearby, the great staff. it was a no brainer.
Now I get the suites at the Sheraton as well, a good staff thats a hair below the Renaissance but not enough to really make a difference, and parking is not quite as available.. but it can be had if I'm on a personal trip with a bit of a walk. However the CL is what I really enjoy and they still have it open 7 days a week at the Sheraton and stock it pretty well. the rates I get at the sheraton have always beat the rates at the marriott by a ball park number of $10 to 15 per night as well. Hence now its just no brainer to stay at the Gateway LAX these days and just dump the Ren and all MR props
And sometimes it comes down to the individual hotel. I stay (a lot) at the Ren LAX - the staff knows me and does a great job. Yeah, I miss some of the things in the cutbacks (would love a vegetable plate in the lounge, and something savory like nuts after the hors d'ourves are taken away). If my choice were the Marriott or the Westin, I'd probably choose the Westin - the Marriott is not that great and the rooms were noisy last time I was there. But the Ren is smaller and the folks are great.
Sep 26, 2009 | 10:01 am
#27
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If you read post #89 the the "no-reward-black-out-dates-what-joke" thread, you will find the following paragrah:
Hotels do not have the ability to define a standard room on their own; it is defined by corporate and enforced by corporate. And, the new definition of a standard room is more generous than the definition had been under the old program.
in post #1 of this thread, you will find the paragraph:
"...Sorry to hear about your dissatisfaction with the amenities at some of our hotel properties. Unfortunately, we have no control over what the hotels decide to offer."
(bolding is mine)
Marriott defines the room but has no control over the amenities in the room????
If one is not at a resort (where views, etc can come into play) isn't it the amenities that pretty much define the room?
Hotels do not have the ability to define a standard room on their own; it is defined by corporate and enforced by corporate. And, the new definition of a standard room is more generous than the definition had been under the old program.
in post #1 of this thread, you will find the paragraph:
"...Sorry to hear about your dissatisfaction with the amenities at some of our hotel properties. Unfortunately, we have no control over what the hotels decide to offer."
(bolding is mine)
Marriott defines the room but has no control over the amenities in the room????
If one is not at a resort (where views, etc can come into play) isn't it the amenities that pretty much define the room?
Sep 26, 2009 | 11:11 am
#28
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I'm in a similar situation except its not the Westin its the Gateway Sheraton LAX. Like you, I swore up and down by the Renaissance. It was my #1 choice for a hotel in the south bay/LAX area.
the lounge cutbacks though were enough for me to abandon them completely. It is where they had a competitve adv over every other property. When I combined that with the usual jr. suite upgrade, the availability of free parking on the street nearby, the great staff. it was a no brainer.
Now I get the suites at the Sheraton as well, a good staff thats a hair below the Renaissance but not enough to really make a difference, and parking is not quite as available.. but it can be had if I'm on a personal trip with a bit of a walk. However the CL is what I really enjoy and they still have it open 7 days a week at the Sheraton and stock it pretty well. the rates I get at the sheraton have always beat the rates at the marriott by a ball park number of $10 to 15 per night as well. Hence now its just no brainer to stay at the Gateway LAX these days and just dump the Ren and all MR props
the lounge cutbacks though were enough for me to abandon them completely. It is where they had a competitve adv over every other property. When I combined that with the usual jr. suite upgrade, the availability of free parking on the street nearby, the great staff. it was a no brainer.
Now I get the suites at the Sheraton as well, a good staff thats a hair below the Renaissance but not enough to really make a difference, and parking is not quite as available.. but it can be had if I'm on a personal trip with a bit of a walk. However the CL is what I really enjoy and they still have it open 7 days a week at the Sheraton and stock it pretty well. the rates I get at the sheraton have always beat the rates at the marriott by a ball park number of $10 to 15 per night as well. Hence now its just no brainer to stay at the Gateway LAX these days and just dump the Ren and all MR props
The Sheraton doesn't beat our corporate rate at the Ren, though, which includes parking, breakfast, and internet access....
That said, I may try them again.
Sep 26, 2009 | 2:35 pm
#29
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This is my first full year as a Platinum, and I have gotten tired of the cutbacks in service and billing hassles I've encountered. I sent in a note over my last billing hassle and included the general frustration, and received a reply akin to the one posted on the previous page of this thread.
I also got the 20 night offer to renew as Platinum. I'll probably stay about five more nights this year at Marriott properties this year and that's about it.
I'm going to re-evaluate my hotel needs at the end of the calendar year and make sure I'm not making a hasty decision.
I also got the 20 night offer to renew as Platinum. I'll probably stay about five more nights this year at Marriott properties this year and that's about it.
I'm going to re-evaluate my hotel needs at the end of the calendar year and make sure I'm not making a hasty decision.
Sep 26, 2009 | 6:19 pm
#30
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DL-great letter...
as for the reply from Marriott-it is nauseating!
At an SPG hotel this week, on a HW stay, I scored an upgrade to the Exec floor...with free beer and wine in the lounge, mediocre evening hors d'ouvres and a nice breakfast display...(this hotel used to be the marriott in which I worked..spooky!)
Here at one of my usual hotels, I got "upgraded" to a corner king (nice view of a mall and parking lot
--and the room is NOISY!) I moved up to a CL room...(with watered down toiletries!) No breakfast. Golds get a somewhat better choice of freebie..internet, a movie, a free drink from the honor bar (or 250 points whoppee)....I was given the gold member amenity card..so I chose the free internet....and told the AFOM that it stinks that golds can get better stuff....they said, well you can get a nicer amenity...I said the internet is worth more than a half bottle of cheap wine...she laughed!
They still have a hot item for breakfast, plus oatmeal, and they did have a nice cheese tray, crudite and some sort of hot item the other night (looked like baby scallops with rice..) Dessert was apparently left over from an event: some fancy pastries and mini chocolate dipped cheesecakes (yum!) A few weeks back it was obviously-purchased-at-Costco cupcakes...not bad, but please----I've seen the exact same ones in Sams, BJs, Costco and every local grocery in town.....
I have attempted to move nights away from MR-too bad for me that most places we go, Marriott brands are the ones with the most hotels and best rates (I am on my dime 99.9% of the time...)
I too have written-several times-about the erosion of benefits, and constant taking for granted of the so called best customers...and I too got a similar form letter with fluff in response....
Tomorrow I will redeem a free night cert at another *wood--will report any Platinum success....
Maybe the Marriott Concierge team needs to get the boss to hang here with us!?
PLEASE...stop being so obviously CHEAP! Get better TP and stop watering down the shampoo (although this COULD be the supplier cutting back!)
I've already renewed, but this is the first year that I really didn't try....
as for the reply from Marriott-it is nauseating!
At an SPG hotel this week, on a HW stay, I scored an upgrade to the Exec floor...with free beer and wine in the lounge, mediocre evening hors d'ouvres and a nice breakfast display...(this hotel used to be the marriott in which I worked..spooky!)
Here at one of my usual hotels, I got "upgraded" to a corner king (nice view of a mall and parking lot
--and the room is NOISY!) I moved up to a CL room...(with watered down toiletries!) No breakfast. Golds get a somewhat better choice of freebie..internet, a movie, a free drink from the honor bar (or 250 points whoppee)....I was given the gold member amenity card..so I chose the free internet....and told the AFOM that it stinks that golds can get better stuff....they said, well you can get a nicer amenity...I said the internet is worth more than a half bottle of cheap wine...she laughed!They still have a hot item for breakfast, plus oatmeal, and they did have a nice cheese tray, crudite and some sort of hot item the other night (looked like baby scallops with rice..) Dessert was apparently left over from an event: some fancy pastries and mini chocolate dipped cheesecakes (yum!) A few weeks back it was obviously-purchased-at-Costco cupcakes...not bad, but please----I've seen the exact same ones in Sams, BJs, Costco and every local grocery in town.....
I have attempted to move nights away from MR-too bad for me that most places we go, Marriott brands are the ones with the most hotels and best rates (I am on my dime 99.9% of the time...)
I too have written-several times-about the erosion of benefits, and constant taking for granted of the so called best customers...and I too got a similar form letter with fluff in response....
Tomorrow I will redeem a free night cert at another *wood--will report any Platinum success....
Maybe the Marriott Concierge team needs to get the boss to hang here with us!?
PLEASE...stop being so obviously CHEAP! Get better TP and stop watering down the shampoo (although this COULD be the supplier cutting back!)
I've already renewed, but this is the first year that I really didn't try....