Mar 28, 2014, 10:58 am
Last edit by: MasterCharge
Welcome to Manufactured Spending. If you are new here, please spend some time reading before posting. Most likely your questions have already been answered multiple times. Consider deals that you share. These threads are searchable by Google. A volatile deal may be worth holding close to the vest.
Hints
1) On FT, topics are heavily consolidated. Sometimes the title of the thread and first few posts may not properly reflect the broad range of discussion inside the thread. Be sure to visit any thread relating to the product or service you want to learn more about because you might be surprised by how in depth the discussion really is. Example: This thread... I know, the first few posts are confusing.
2) Use Google to search FT. It works a lot better than the built-in search.
Important Rules
1) MSing is very YMMV. It varies by store, manager, and right down to the cashier working at the moment. That being said, always be nice and courteous in the face of rejection. The biggest secret for success is to lay low so you can try again.
2) DO NOT spend more than you can afford. START WITH SMALL AMOUNTS TO TEST THE WATER! As an example.. don't start with a $5000 purchase of VGCs if you can't afford to float that much! Instead, buy one and try it, and scale up once you are comfortable with a new method. It's easy to lose track, or get robbed, when you are handling so much money. Getting a refund is NOT always possible.
3) DO NOT ask employees, cashiers, customer service representatives, etc... about how to MS, or about things you read on this forum. The information you read here are very specific, unknown, legal uses of products or services. Most employees, cashiers, and even managers do not know about them. At best you'll get bad information. At worst you'll create a lot of unnecessary misunderstanding.
4) It bears repeating that there are no guarantees. you could easily buy $10,000 in gift cards or some other instrument, only to discover that your method for liquidating them vanishes the very next day. MS is not "normal" financial activity ("normal" being defined by the banks), and thus is often perceived as "suspicious" even if it is "legal."
5) never underestimate the risk of criminal activity. gift cards can easily be stolen, loaded onto a compromised account, loaded in a debit card skimmer, or even fraudulent (e.g., an already used card put back on the rack).
If you have a question that does not seem to fit anywhere, or you have not found an appropriate place for it, post it here.
a helpful note from seat17D about some of the inherent risks of MS:
Take what you read with a grain of salt. No law enforcement agency cares if you are loading 5k to a bluebird per month unless you are loading your money from illegal activities like crack sales. Even at that point they only care about your crack sales, not your bluebird load.
Nobody is going to ask you "why are you loading your bluebird" or "where did you get the money you want to load on your bluebird" when you go to walmart.
Hints
1) On FT, topics are heavily consolidated. Sometimes the title of the thread and first few posts may not properly reflect the broad range of discussion inside the thread. Be sure to visit any thread relating to the product or service you want to learn more about because you might be surprised by how in depth the discussion really is. Example: This thread... I know, the first few posts are confusing.
2) Use Google to search FT. It works a lot better than the built-in search.
Important Rules
1) MSing is very YMMV. It varies by store, manager, and right down to the cashier working at the moment. That being said, always be nice and courteous in the face of rejection. The biggest secret for success is to lay low so you can try again.
2) DO NOT spend more than you can afford. START WITH SMALL AMOUNTS TO TEST THE WATER! As an example.. don't start with a $5000 purchase of VGCs if you can't afford to float that much! Instead, buy one and try it, and scale up once you are comfortable with a new method. It's easy to lose track, or get robbed, when you are handling so much money. Getting a refund is NOT always possible.
3) DO NOT ask employees, cashiers, customer service representatives, etc... about how to MS, or about things you read on this forum. The information you read here are very specific, unknown, legal uses of products or services. Most employees, cashiers, and even managers do not know about them. At best you'll get bad information. At worst you'll create a lot of unnecessary misunderstanding.
4) It bears repeating that there are no guarantees. you could easily buy $10,000 in gift cards or some other instrument, only to discover that your method for liquidating them vanishes the very next day. MS is not "normal" financial activity ("normal" being defined by the banks), and thus is often perceived as "suspicious" even if it is "legal."
5) never underestimate the risk of criminal activity. gift cards can easily be stolen, loaded onto a compromised account, loaded in a debit card skimmer, or even fraudulent (e.g., an already used card put back on the rack).
If you have a question that does not seem to fit anywhere, or you have not found an appropriate place for it, post it here.
a helpful note from seat17D about some of the inherent risks of MS:
I will speak to only the impacts and actions that have been taken (or threatened) to me personally over the years
1. Account closure - always got my money back. Moderate frequency. Little to no long-term impact UNLESS my wife was the first one to find out when her card was declined in public setting
2. Blacklisted by an FI - lower frequency. Short- to medium term impact. Eventually the FI's greed heals all wounds.
3. Blacklisted by a governmental agency -- lower frequency. Variable long-term impact as governmental agencies never actually forget, they just don't take action (see below)
4. Banned from a retail establishment -- threatened, but never actually banned. Mostly just pointed discussion from a misguided manager. Low-medium frequency.
5. Banned from an online establishment -- lower frequency, generally lower impact. Generally permanent, at least for me so far.
6. Cashback forfeited or clawed back -- generally happened to me as part of a credit card shut down. so far only forfeits and not clawbacks, but they are possible
And then there are the things law enforcement can and has done
1. Executed a warrant to subpoena my banking and other financial records without my knowledge
2. Contacted my FIs to inquire as the nature of my financial relationship
3. Frozen the portion of my assets that were currently involved in the activity they were investigating
4. Visited my home -- when I was not there -- to "interview" my spouse, etc. regarding their knowledge and involvement ... and to attempt to obtain additional documentation not already obtained by the subpoenas
5. Threatened to seize my assets. Not just the ones frozen. Not just those I currently possessed. But all assets they deemed as ever having been part of the criminal activity. (Think every GC, MO, etc. you have purchased over the past 3-5 years)
6. Threatened one or more felony charges. (Consider having to explain THAT to your wife or boss.)
And that all was for something that was completely legal, once the 'splaining was done.
Of course once LEO opens a criminal investigation, it never actually closes unless they take you to court and fail. So even though I was cleared of the charges, the original case file is out there ready to be dusted off.
In the end, my biggest concern is the extent to which something will permanently impact my marriage or ability to enter into financial contracts (felony charges would be one example). Fortunately once the initial shock of LEO's investigation wore away, both my marriage and financial relationships were intact. Very thankful both she and a few key FI's stood by me.
When you MS, you are running with scissors.
1. Account closure - always got my money back. Moderate frequency. Little to no long-term impact UNLESS my wife was the first one to find out when her card was declined in public setting
2. Blacklisted by an FI - lower frequency. Short- to medium term impact. Eventually the FI's greed heals all wounds.
3. Blacklisted by a governmental agency -- lower frequency. Variable long-term impact as governmental agencies never actually forget, they just don't take action (see below)
4. Banned from a retail establishment -- threatened, but never actually banned. Mostly just pointed discussion from a misguided manager. Low-medium frequency.
5. Banned from an online establishment -- lower frequency, generally lower impact. Generally permanent, at least for me so far.
6. Cashback forfeited or clawed back -- generally happened to me as part of a credit card shut down. so far only forfeits and not clawbacks, but they are possible
And then there are the things law enforcement can and has done
1. Executed a warrant to subpoena my banking and other financial records without my knowledge
2. Contacted my FIs to inquire as the nature of my financial relationship
3. Frozen the portion of my assets that were currently involved in the activity they were investigating
4. Visited my home -- when I was not there -- to "interview" my spouse, etc. regarding their knowledge and involvement ... and to attempt to obtain additional documentation not already obtained by the subpoenas
5. Threatened to seize my assets. Not just the ones frozen. Not just those I currently possessed. But all assets they deemed as ever having been part of the criminal activity. (Think every GC, MO, etc. you have purchased over the past 3-5 years)
6. Threatened one or more felony charges. (Consider having to explain THAT to your wife or boss.)
And that all was for something that was completely legal, once the 'splaining was done.
Of course once LEO opens a criminal investigation, it never actually closes unless they take you to court and fail. So even though I was cleared of the charges, the original case file is out there ready to be dusted off.
In the end, my biggest concern is the extent to which something will permanently impact my marriage or ability to enter into financial contracts (felony charges would be one example). Fortunately once the initial shock of LEO's investigation wore away, both my marriage and financial relationships were intact. Very thankful both she and a few key FI's stood by me.
When you MS, you are running with scissors.
Nobody is going to ask you "why are you loading your bluebird" or "where did you get the money you want to load on your bluebird" when you go to walmart.
New to Manufactured Spending? Start Here.
Sep 23, 2014, 7:01 pm
#1021
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 7
A couple of quick questions. I did read all 68pages of this thread as well.
I used AP for a while and with that shutting down soon I am looking for another easy little effort way to MS. I was looking at serve and just reloading it using my Visa mileage CC and paying rent with it and other bills. Not looking to MS alot at the moment.
Does it sound doable and simple?
I used AP for a while and with that shutting down soon I am looking for another easy little effort way to MS. I was looking at serve and just reloading it using my Visa mileage CC and paying rent with it and other bills. Not looking to MS alot at the moment.
Does it sound doable and simple?
Sep 23, 2014, 7:10 pm
#1022
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Indiana
Programs: United, AA, Chase
Posts: 31
A couple of quick questions. I did read all 68pages of this thread as well.
I used AP for a while and with that shutting down soon I am looking for another easy little effort way to MS. I was looking at serve and just reloading it using my Visa mileage CC and paying rent with it and other bills. Not looking to MS alot at the moment.
Does it sound doable and simple?
I used AP for a while and with that shutting down soon I am looking for another easy little effort way to MS. I was looking at serve and just reloading it using my Visa mileage CC and paying rent with it and other bills. Not looking to MS alot at the moment.
Does it sound doable and simple?
Sep 24, 2014, 3:42 pm
#1024
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 342
Delete
Last edited by sybloc; Sep 24, 2014 at 5:41 pm
Sep 25, 2014, 11:12 am
#1025
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 172
my cousin owes me like 2k but he lives kind of far from me and works all the time .. he wanted to just buy 2k in VRs and give me the codes to load into my BB .. can i just then transfer that 2k to my chase bank account ? or no ?? when i have used Vrs to BB in the past it was just to pay cc bills. I thought i remember people saying that would red flag at chase or something ?
Sep 25, 2014, 11:59 am
#1026
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 429
I've transferred to my Citi account before. Never an issue.
Sep 26, 2014, 2:31 pm
#1027
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHX & AGP
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,457
my cousin owes me like 2k but he lives kind of far from me and works all the time .. he wanted to just buy 2k in VRs and give me the codes to load into my BB .. can i just then transfer that 2k to my chase bank account ? or no ?? when i have used Vrs to BB in the past it was just to pay cc bills. I thought i remember people saying that would red flag at chase or something ?
Sep 26, 2014, 3:24 pm
#1028
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 66
Though Im relatively new to MS, I have been very successful so far with a few different cards. But now I've come to a hurdle which needs some advice from others. I was recently approved for a Barclay Arrival + card with a measly 1500 CL. This makes MS very difficult and while I've been making it happen I can't help but think there are some strategies that I haven't though of. Short of asking for an increase, I really can't afford another HP on my score, what are some tips/tricks to getting the most out of a very small CL? Maybe there aren't any. Also does anyone have experience with a similarly small CL and paying it off multiple times a month? Does this cause any flags on the creditors side?
Sep 27, 2014, 8:32 am
#1030
Join Date: May 2014
Location: New York
Posts: 391
I don't have personal experience, but there are definitely discussions of "recycling" your CL somewhere in the forum. I'm pretty sure you can find some discussion in the "Old Amex" thread (don't remember the exact title) - people trying to maximize 5% CB with low CL.
Sep 29, 2014, 1:40 am
#1031
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Virginia City Highlands
Programs: Nothing anymore after 20 years
Posts: 6,900
Folks,
Looking for an advice. I am not really interested in MS - I want to purchase 4 $500 VISA GCs to load them at WM to BB and use that BB for foreign trips only.
After reading several topics seems there are number of recently appearing problems: fraud with GC when crooks put stickers over the existing cards sold at stores, guessing numbers of GCs issued by US Bank, inability to use VISA GCs at WM to reload BB and so on.
So. To minimize the exposure to fraud and problems during the reload, what would one need to take into account? What should GC package looked at? How properly load funds at WM register?
Tips/info please. Thanks in advance.
Looking for an advice. I am not really interested in MS - I want to purchase 4 $500 VISA GCs to load them at WM to BB and use that BB for foreign trips only.
After reading several topics seems there are number of recently appearing problems: fraud with GC when crooks put stickers over the existing cards sold at stores, guessing numbers of GCs issued by US Bank, inability to use VISA GCs at WM to reload BB and so on.
So. To minimize the exposure to fraud and problems during the reload, what would one need to take into account? What should GC package looked at? How properly load funds at WM register?
Tips/info please. Thanks in advance.
Sep 29, 2014, 6:30 am
#1032
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,688
Though Im relatively new to MS, I have been very successful so far with a few different cards. But now I've come to a hurdle which needs some advice from others. I was recently approved for a Barclay Arrival + card with a measly 1500 CL. This makes MS very difficult and while I've been making it happen I can't help but think there are some strategies that I haven't though of. Short of asking for an increase, I really can't afford another HP on my score, what are some tips/tricks to getting the most out of a very small CL? Maybe there aren't any. Also does anyone have experience with a similarly small CL and paying it off multiple times a month? Does this cause any flags on the creditors side?
Sep 29, 2014, 12:54 pm
#1033
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 66
So I had to call in today about a payment I made last week and while I had the CSR, very friendly, on the line I asked about making multiple payments within the month. She could see my transactions and that I had made more than four in Sept. and said there was no problem doing so. She said many customers with low CL's make multiple payments and she even encouraged it. Now I know she's only a CSR and not part of a department that would really have any say, so Ill take this with a few grains of salt. She did say if there were any problems or questions obviously they would contact me.
I plant to continue to put all of my regular spend on the card and light MS only recycling the 1500 CL once per month ex 3k spend, and see how it goes.
I plant to continue to put all of my regular spend on the card and light MS only recycling the 1500 CL once per month ex 3k spend, and see how it goes.
Sep 30, 2014, 12:38 am
#1034
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHX & AGP
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,457
As others have stated, stop stressing over the low CL, it happened and moved forward, your CL will get increased over time, I also second what others have stated, take is slow at first, I have seen too many people get burned by trying too much at first.. This game is a marathon, not a sprint.
Sep 30, 2014, 10:10 am
#1035
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: IAD
Posts: 166
I am trying to understand the best use of AFT. Maybe good for minimum spend requirements. If ATM unload is the only option, it is probably not a good idea to deposit 5K in cash back to bank account.
how is everyone else using their AFT card.
how is everyone else using their AFT card.