whiskey_sk

Isn't there a similar organisation on EU-level? Not all people on this board reside in Germany, and furthermore, favourable EU level decision could also affect other airlines who run similar scams (I'm sure LH is not the only one).

TRAVELSIG

Having had some dealings on a professional level with similar agencies in admittedly other countries I have very little faith- the words that concern me are "not actively pursuing", "if they receive enough complaints", "they normally investigate". Political words that give way too much wriggle room. I don't think that anyone wants to touch this issue unfortunately- if someone does though it may be a great thing depending on how exactly it is approached- it could also really backfire.

CalFlyer

I agree, TRAVELSIG, you never know what the next move of airlines would be if the surcharge scam were prohibited. But then again, as long as the scam exists and further unfolds, it does tremendous damage to my wallet. I just paid more than EUR 340 for a "free" premium class one-way ticket from the U.S. to Europe. The value of my millions of miles is decreasing by the month, it seems. I want this to stop.

TRAVELSIG

Agreed.

What it does over time is eliminate any advantage of the frequent flyer program. I am already at that point with hotels- the "status" cards really don't matter and I just buy the room I want at the hotel I like- therefore eliminating most of the presumed advantages of a global chain and certainly limiting the corporation ability to pass the charges (premium) on to end users.

When I also notice now that a "free" ticket can cost $1000 then I also respond rationally- just fly who has the best combination of schedule/service/product/fare/ and if I happen to get frequent flyer points OK. It is amazing how much this decision changes flying. The only problem I warn you about is that once you see some of the products around the world you have a very large risk of being disillusioned with your LH black card unless you only fly F (in which case your HON card no longer matters any more anyway).

Lack

I'm not sure any company would bounce consumers of their back citing their shareholder interest if it didn't feel like the country approach to customer protection didn't give a da*n....

Sadly, I'm not as elastic with my choices, given limited budget and airline options, I relay on points for tickets not otherwise attainable. I reckon, the HON level flying population is overall, a very small number of people that generally on day to day basis don't even bother to cross shop various propositions (be it their ignorance, corporate policy or just general disregard for such mundane issues).

Olip

QF/EK are doing the same scam. I booked an EK award using QF miles lately and I was surprised about the high surcharges. When I looked closer I found out that surcharges in C were almost twice as in Y.

htb

Can you post the email address? If not I'd appreciate a PM.

Thanks, HTB.

BristolTraveller

I can see a correlation up until 2009, and then it looks like the Jet-A prices that LH have provided take off on their own trajectory (if I'm reading the graph correctly).

Despite the evidence LH puts forward, I'm thoroughly unconvinced that YQ is correlated to the Group's fuel costs. I think it's a revenue line which can be managed in response to fuel cost changes (such as the spike in 2008), but I see very little evidence that its structured to balance their fuel costs (even taking into account hedging positions).

CalFlyer

After LH had charged me this hefty EUR 340 U.S. origin surcharge on my one-way premium ticket U.S. to Europe, I had written a complaint email to the HONCircle team. I requested a specific explanation why there is such a huge discrepancy between surcharges for a given flight segment when purchased with a U.S. vs. European origin. Here from the reply:

"We understand that you find the difference between the taxes and surcharges that apply for a departure from the USA compared to a departure from an airport in Germany confusing. However, the cost incurred depends on the airport's country of origin and destination. Market-specific aspects and principles of fair competition also play a role and these are beyond our control.

Dear CalFlyer, we regret that we cannot give you a more detailed explanation in this matter and would appreciate your understanding."

This is adding insult to injury. The U.S. does not have a departure tax that penalizes tickets originating in the U.S. (unlike London), so not a cent of difference can be explained from that. And what are the market-specific aspects and the principles of fair competition that play a role and that are beyond LH's control? Does it mean: others charge a hefty surcharge so we decided to do the same? There is nothing beyond LH's control here, it is their decision to design the pricing scheme as arbitrary as it is. The usage of the beyond our control phrase again confirms that airlines try to imply that the surcharges are somehow externally determined, although in reality it is their very own attempt at street robbery. As the reservation agent put it when I complained about the EUR 340 fee: "It is what it is, do you want to pay now or shall I cancel your award?"

I think it is high time we really put the surcharge scam beyond LH's control and get the CPAs involved.

huegli

How can this be ? I checked for award tickets in C from ZRH-FRA-BAH and back and the M&M website showed me availability and taxes of CHF 522. I look into it today again and now the taxes are CHF 645.

Has onyone observed this before ? Has Lufthansa maybe increased the fuel surcharge ?

gum

In Germany there was a broad media coverage of this "enhancement".

Lufthansa increased the "fuel surcharge" for longhaul flights in Business and First Class to - if I remember correctly to a value between 170 and 192 Euro.

This is part of a commonly used toolbox in order to avoid conflicts with all customers who have negotiated rates (like larger corporate accounts).

To exaggerate it: The additional rip-off is cloaked as "fuel surcharge".

Sorry for the news.

CalFlyer

To my knowledge, most corporates have agreed upon percentage discounts from published fares. So if LH included fare increases in the fare itself(instead of surcharges) they would not need to renegotiate with corporates. But they would automatically provide the corporate discount on the fare increase as well, which makes it look preferable for LH to add it in the fuel surcharge.

abenarsha

Same for me on a gva del in c class. Yesterday it was 580 and today it s 698 chf! I m pissed off! Looking forward to burn all my miles and move to emirates or etihad airlines!

more4less

+1

IAN-UK

I'm guessing they mean they do what they can get away with.

I just bought a redemption ticket for my brother's visit from Brasil.
A refreshing fifty-something euros in taxes - yes, that right: around £45 or $70. AND a straightforward award booking via M&M.

Of course Brasil forbids YQ on award tickets

Now, if only we could convince other national regulators to impose similar restrictions ....