Dave Noble

No idea how many others abused it, I know I didnt

So what? You admit that you have done that which they claim you have done; how you got caught doesn't matter does it?

If you think you have been unfairly treated then put it in writing to IHG detailing why what they have done is unreasonable and see if they will reopen it. If they won't then perhaps time to use another chain

torcross

To the OP just read your blog and you say you were not too worried as you didn't fall into any category but if I remember a few months ago you did not sound like that as your father in law had his account closed and you were not happy at all.

You also say after you and your wife's account is closed you try to book a reward night on your fathers account, I'm not being funny but that isn't helping the situation surely using somebody else's account is totally against the t&c's of PC and enough to have your account closed in its own right.

Random_Flyer

Having read through the entire thread I can say that the OP likely got his accounts closed for three main reasons, all of which were cited here by the OP in this thread.

1) Exploiting the quiz loophole against T&C. Minor, but would attract some attention if they are currently looking for accounts that did this.

2) Managing his father's account (when his father is based in China) from his computer in the US. For a family to use the same IP or credit card when they're all living in the same household is one thing. But to have the account managed from the US while the registered user is living in China is going to setup a red flag.

With nothing in common except the IP, it is going to look like his father is just some guy in China who is racking up points and selling them to the OP.

3) Lastly, and this is the big one, OP was the one redeeming all the points that his father's account was earning.

Looking at all three of those together, it can easily appear to any outside observer that you have the OP (here in the US) that is managing the account of and getting all the benefits from a user in China. With no common credit card usage and no constant overlapping stay patterns (ie using his father's points only when his father was staying with him on a trip) an auditor is immediately going to jump to the conclusion that points sales are going on in violation of the T&Cs. This is going to be amplified by the fact that there is a large amount of fraud coming out of China (where OP's dad is based) and beause the point transfer was one way.

Now, making that accusation just opens up a whole can of worms, so it is a lot easier to just say "we're closing the account due to abuse of the promo." That's where reason #1 comes in.

I would doubt that there is a company wide discriminaiton policy, rather it just seems that OP's actions fall neatly in line with the typical actions of those who try to scam the system.

I hope that explanation makes a bit of sense.

torcross

I know I'm being naive but when people say selling PC points do they mean transferring them when at $5 a 1000 (you cant gain anything from this, apart from the odd exception) or selling the actual reservation based on what hotel the buyer wants to stay in, also when this happens are the initial points legally obtained from the seller or is there some kind of scam.

Shareholder

So with a bit more information from the OP we find that he indeed was perpetrating a fraud on PC in several ways. Also find it curious that he says his father -- who has no computer or credit card of his own -- has racked up 100 nights in a single year! What was he doing: cheap mattress runs at very low local Chinese rates but bumping these stays up with multiple bonuses? That's beginning to sound what's going on here. PC probably has cracked a whole ring of such miscreants operating outside of China, but relying on Chinese-resident relatives who do the actual ultra-cheap stays. Then the nights are laundered by being redeemed and sold to third parties at high end properties around the world.

Cry me a river...

yyliu88

If you don't believe me, that's fine, all I can say is Every single word I said here are 100% truth.

yyliu88

Who said My father did not have his own CC, I said he uses his own CC.

and He sometimes stayed in a hotel for 20+ nights, if he was MR, why would he want to stay in a same hotel for 20+ nights. Do you consider a stay with 18000 base points is cheap stays? If so, I have nothing to say

Where is third party? I am the only one uses his points. High end properties with PC? I only stayed IC twice in my life using points.

If u are bored enough, I can tell u my dad name and the hotel he stays, you can call the hotel to see how many nights he spent with them last year.

Random_Flyer

You are the third party.

To the hotel auditors it looks like fraud when one person earns points and never redeems them (this would be your dad) and another person, halfway around the world (this would be you) is the one managing the account and converting the points into stays.

yyliu88

There is no auditor, once they saw the name, they close the account. Did you see what I quote from Josh Ellerman?

NickB

Not quite. Differences between you and most members here is that:
1) you have made a large redemption;
2) several accounts are linked to your IP;
3) one of those accounts is based in a country with a known large-scale incident of fraud.

Irrespective of what your name is, that makes your overall situation (as distinct from any individual single factor) different from most members.

You may wish to call 3) "discrimination" if you will. But that is not fundamentally different from, for instance, airlines imposing restrictions and extra controls on the issuing of tickets originating in certain African countries with a higher level of credit card fraud than others.

yyliu88

1) 150K for 6 nights at 25K level HIX that currently $100 per night, you call this large redemption? so no one ever redeemed more than 25K?

2) so what? where did they say I can not access my wife, my father accounts using same computer? No one ever use same computer to access their family accounts?

3) so? r they suppose to look at stay pattern and points earning and redemption history before making judgment?

I redeemed large amount of points earlier this year for one signle PB stays from my own account and for myself, nothing happened. just few months later, everything changed?

Last, if you are assistant of some companies, do you know one assistant take care of many boss travel programs?

yyliu88

You did not get the point here, PCR have done account closing for Chinese for few months already, but I am first reporter on and victim on this forum because no any other races account got closed! only Chinese, How many non Chinese people on FT compare to Chinese? How many people did the quiz here than Chinese?

but why I am the only victim here?

because

1 I am one of few Chinese who knows pretty everything on every major programs on earth

2 I am one of few Chinese who has an account long enough on FT

3 I am the only Chinese(not including people who was born here) who come to FT every day to review nearly every program

4 I am the only Chinese who is writing points related blogs and 2 of them.

for reasons listed above, I am the only Chinese who can raise my voice on this issue as it clearly become a discrimination issue now.

Since the first day PCR started to shut down accounts, I never believed they were targeting Chinese, I only thought they were closing accounts in China.

I also said, all mine, my wife and my father accounts were safe,
My father still got his points credit, until I redeemed 150K, all gone.

yyliu88

No, I am using my father accounts because my father gave me permission to use them. There is no T&C saying the permission has to be in writing.

Have you ever call to redeem someone else miles, like ur father, for ur flight?
Does CSR ever question u or tell you can not?

Last, Have you seen I said in anywhere I wanted my account back? No, I don't care, move on. I just became father, everything changed, All I want just people here know the fact and what is really happening now.

NickB

And how many of these have an IP linked to an account in a country in which there was a major incident of fraud?
Until you can establish that there Joe Bloggs, Mary White and John Smith have a profile that links them to accounts in China AND have several accounts linked to their IP AND have done multiple quizzes AND have done a large redemption recently, you have not established that your name, nationality or ethnicity is a determining factor.

It may well be that PCR have treated you badly by refusing to look more deeply into the issue. What you have singularly failed to establish is that this is because of your presumed nationality or ethnicity on account of your name.

andrewwm

There is such thing a concept in law, as in life, called proportionality. Just as we don't execute speeders, wise companies don't ban customers who have minor violations of their policies. Furthermore, maybe not in your country, but in the US it is illegal to selectively enforce the law only against a certain category of people. And for good reason.

IHG took the same view in the quiz loophole scandal. Since everything is registered in their database, they could have just run a script that closed all accounts that took the quiz more than x times (x in your case, I guess, is 2). Instead, they wisely realized this could alienate a number of good customers, so they temporarily locked accounts, deducted the illicitly gained points and closed only the really egregious offenders (who were clearly using a script and had received in excess of 40,000 points). His use of the loophole didn't even rise to the level of IHG, using its automated and impartial punishment script, temporarily locking his account.

I agree that IHG has the legal right to close his account. IHG could likely find a legal reason to close all of our accounts. Does that mean it's fair or good business practices? No. They are clearly targeting Chinese and closing accounts of, apparently Chinese people who use their accounts much as most people here on FT. I'd wager that there is a large percentage of white Americans here on FT who engaged in a moderate bit of point grabbing on the quiz loophole (less than 5,000) and will never, ever be at risk of having their accounts closed.

So if someone did the quiz twice then they deserve to have their account banned forever?

I'll tell the judge at your sentencing hearing for jaywalking to lock you up and throw away the key. Also, if you've ever registered for a targetted promotion for which you were not part of the target group, maybe you should email PC and ask them to close your account if you want to be this self-righteous.

I feel like the OP has been fairly forthcoming. Why do you have a different opinion?