Springs1

It's called READ A MENU. 9 times out of 10, if you want a soup or a salad, it's on the menu what the price is and at some restaurants, it's a cheaper price than if you just order a side salad by itself. Don't expect your servers to baby-sit you if you are too lazy to READ THE MENU FOR YOURSELF. I don't EVER RECALL a restaurant I have EVER BEEN TO that doesn't have the prices of the side salads added to an entree. If it's NOT listed it COMES with the item on the menu, 99.9% chance it cost extra. If you are unsure, ASK. Don't expect them to baby-sit you, because they are supposed to try to sell more, because their managers want that.

PTravel

Then again, I've also been to restaurants that have no prices at all on the menu. If you have to ask, you probably can't afford to eat there (Doyen in Paris comes to mind, as well as a Michelin 1 star restaurant in a chateau in Tours, though the name escapes me at the moment). I've also been in many restaurants that are so dimly lit that I have to hold a candle over the menu to read it. I don't actually mind that, though -- I like the atmosphere.

However, as a general rule, my only responsibility at a restaurant is to act courteously to diners and staff alike and pay my bill at the end. I don't have any "jobs" at the restaurant (though, in the past, I've worked as a waiter). That's why we eat out at restaurants: to enjoy the experience and not take on any responsiblities beyond savoring the meal.

Incidentally, in China it is customary to have long discussions with the waiter during which the virtues of the various dishes are compared, the waiter makes recommendations, preparation and quality are discussed, etc. I'm often amused when my wife tries to do the same here in the U.S. The waiters are, at best, a bit perplexed but always seem happy to oblige.

Springs1

That's when the CUSTOMER should ASK if they want to know. The server doens't have to tell you.

It's your responsiblity to KNOW what you are ordering and HOW MUCH you have to pay(unless you aren't interested in the amount the items are).

If you order filet mignon, if you aren't familar with steaks, you may have thought you were ordering a sirloin or a ribeye, because you don't know the differences in the cuts of the meats, for example. It's your responsiblity to know what you are ordering. So the customer should asks questions instead of just assuming things if they aren't sure.

PTravel

Um . . . well, yes. I wouldn't expect a server to recite prices at such a restaurant.

Well, sure. Who doesn't do that?

MichaelColey

Brilliant idea! Why didn't I think of that?

I'm not talking about things that are on the menu or that should be obvious to most customers. I'm talking about deceptive practices and/or things that most other places don't charge for. For instance:

* Charging for water.
* When ordering a burger, being asked "Mustard? Ketchup? Lettuce? Onions? Tomatoes?" (with no mention of price) when lettuce, onions, and tomatoes cost extra.
* When ordering an entrée that doesn't come with either soup or a salad and the waiter asks "Would you rather have soup or salad with that?"

I understand that management encourages upselling but customers expect their waiters to be helpful, not to behave like used car salesmen. I expect a waiter to make me aware of any extra charges as I'm ordering. If I have a surprise when the check comes, the tip will definitely reflect it. If I have it happen repetitively at a restaurant, I won't go back.

Rejuvenated

Happens so often whenever I dine in Europe. They would ask me if I want the regular or the gas water. Of course I seldomly opt for the latter.

LapLap

That means you get the "Sin Gas" then

Fredd

Agreed. ^ We waxed eloquent on that point on Trip Advisor awhile back concerning a Honolulu place called Cheeseburger in Paradise in this excerpt:

Yes, the location is great but we knew we'd made a mistake almost as soon as we entered. I detest places that promise more on their menu than they deliver, and I further detest places that don't include prices on their drink list, and I even further detest places that keep trying to "up-sell" with add-ons.

We both just wanted water so the friendly enough young waitress, who persisted in the annoying habit of coyly addressing us as "you two," had to take away the little plastic pineapple they sell as a souvenir for people who buy "real" drinks.

I ordered a Chicken "Oriental Salad" for $12.95. "Do you want avocado with that?" No thank you.

My husband ordered a Cajun chicken burger for $8.95. "Would you like cheese on that?" No thank you. "Would you like bacon on that?" No thank you. She left a little disconsolately but then returned. "Oh, I forgot to ask if you'd like fries or onion rings with that?" No thank you.

I was waiting to see if she'd ask if we'd like "cloth napkins" or perhaps a "deluxe condiment assortment." Anyway, you get the picture...

Springs1

For instance, I have been offered guacamole and took it not realizing it would probably cost extra until after I had placed my order and the waitess left the table. The thing is, it's up to the CUSTOMER to ASK these questions. The server doesn't have to tell you the price.

As far as soup or salad added to an entree, that's normally on the menu. If it wasn't, then ask if the soup or salad actually COMES with the meal. Once, I went to a restaurant and the menu DID NOT state the ribs came with a salad. She asked what kind of salad did I want and dressing, which through me off, because it wasn't on the menu. I said "A salad comes with this?" She said "YES." This would be a good way without having to ask the price. If they say "NO, it's extra", then if you want to know how much, ASK.

As far as lettuce goes, normally you don't have to pay for that type of stuff, but sometimes you do. Usually the menu will state something like "Add a $1.00 for dressed), but if it doesn't, you know you can ASK you know if you aren't sure. 9 times out of 10, you probably won't get charged for regular amounts of lettuce, mustard, ketchup, etc., but if you order extra, there's always a chance you may be charged. If you order a condiment that doesn't come with the item such as ranch for someone's fries with a burger, expect that it's very possible you MAY BE CHARGED. If you aren't sure, the best advice I can give you is to ASK your server.

It's not deceptive really, because if you add ANYTHING to your meal, it should be common sense there will always be a POSSIBLITY you could get charged. Since you don't know, you should ASK.

Water wouldn't be charged normally unless it would be bottled water. I haven't had that issue ever, but if I would, I would definately ask a manager about why on earth they would charge for a glass of tap water. I don't think I would ask the server about if they charged for water, because 99.9% of the times, you wouldn't be charged for a glass of water.

LapLap

I think you might be losing sight of the intent of this thread.

It's about restaurant pet peeves. Things that cheese you off at restaurants.

It seems you are fully indoctrinated into the practices common in North American diners - many of them cynically put into place by management aware that they will yield higher returns from customers not so familiar with the ins and outs of the hospitality industry.

Although these might seem perfectly acceptable to you, doesn't mean that the rest of us have to like them. And as this is a WORLD forum, which does not limit its discussion to moderately priced dining establishments in the USA, not all of us share your views that the customer should be expected to second guess the intentions of waiting staff bent on 'upselling' in a way that many people feel is akin to trickery and deception.

Sure, we can all grill our servers and be alert to their attempts to wring extra money from us by asking and asking and asking and inspect the menu's intricacies with the thoroughness of a lawyer. But, personally, when I go out to eat I like to RELAX and ENJOY my food and actually RELISH THE INTERACTION between myself and the human being I'm privileged to be served by that day.

I usually feel that way when I eat out in London, I always feel this way when I eat out in Japan, and believe it or not, I almost invariably feel this way when I eat out in North America too.

I also get peeved by deceptive practices common in a certain kind of Diner. A British equivalent to Applebees or Chilis might be Nandos (which I do not frequent). Here's something tangible that highlights the kind of thing I'm talking about:
"If you want to be pestered by Nando's don't whatever you do tick this box"
It's part of a coupon you seem to need to fill in with your address in order to get a free meal (having collected stamps with previous meals).

PTravel

I have never been in a restaurant in which the server tries to "upsell" by the restaurant charging extra for such things. However, I'm also hard-pressed to recall a restaurant in which everything wasn't a la carte. Occasionally, restaurants will offer a complete meal, "price fixed," or a "tasting menu." These will clearly indicate what you get. I would find it embarrassing if my dining companion asked the server, "Is there an extra charge for the bread? Is the side vegetable free?", etc. In some countries in Europe, it is customary to charge for bread, olives, etc. that are the precursor to the meal. In the U.S., that is never done. There will be a charge anywhere for bottled water, whether still or sparkling. The problem, here, is that you seem to be extrapolating from low-priced chain restaurants to all restaurants. Believe me, the chain restaurants are typical of nothing but chain restauranats.

Curious_George

Charging for water was a pet peeve of mine when I lived in London in the late 90's. When I moved back to the States, to the annoyance of all my friends, I always asked for a glass of tap water when we went out to eat (even if it was the only water available).

Now for some reason, sparkling water is my non-alcoholic beverage of choice (and seltzer water at restaurants that have no idea what I mean when I ask for sparkling water).

uncertaintraveler

Portions of the post that previously appeared in this space has been deleted. I would provide you with a reason why, but doing so would likely be against the TOS.

markwtaylor

!!!Geez. When did THAT start happening? Are the Airline CEOs and bean counters now in charge of the foodservice industry??? What's next - assessing a paper, electricity & water charge when you go to the $hithouse?

ksandness

I just have two pet peeves:

1. Being ignored as a solo customer. If the wait staff don't at least acknowledge my presence in five minutes, I'm out of there. They don't have to take my order, but they do have to give me a menu or at least say, "I'll be with you in a moment."

2. Wait staff who haven't bothered to find out what the Soup of the Day or other ______of the Day is. If it's on the menu, someone is going to ask about it eventually.

3. A disorganized kitchen. I once stopped off at a mid-level pasta and pizza place for a bit to eat before a concert. The restaurant was packed. I ordered pasta with pesto, thinking that would be quick. It was only after waiting for 15 minutes that I noticed that of the five or six tables of people who were sitting there when I walked in, none had been served yet.

The kitchen was open to view, and I could see what the trouble was. Instead of having a small menu, ready-made sauces, and constantly bubbling pots of hot water (the secret of the fast pasta places I've known), this place had two cooks who were making everything from scratch, including boiling the water and wandering around in a daze between steps. Believe me, this was not the kind of upscale place where chefs pride themselves on made-to-order masterpieces. I felt like jumping up and making my own pasta with pesto, which I could have done in no time at all.

My food came out of the kitchen just as I was headed for the door, since I had ten minutes before curtain time, two blocks away. I didn't eat it and I didn't pay. The restaurant soon went out of business, and no wonder.