DanTravels

First, I apologize in advance for saying what I am about to say, since this is the DL forum, and I know people here hold DL in somewhat of an exalted view... but:

You apparently fear that reciprocal upgrades on DL would result in hordes of NW/CO platinums swarming onto DL flights and taking away your beloved seats in DL domestic F. Why on Earth do you think they'd want to do that? Has it occurred to you that if everyone else thought DL was really all that great, they'd be DL platinums?

I've flown several segments on each of the three this year, including domestic F on both NW and DL, and have been to at least 3 of each lounge as well. DL has shown me nothing to make me think they're at all better than NW or CO, and when it comes to domestic F (where one ends up if one is upgraded), there are quantifiable differences in things like meal service that make DL unappealing to me, upgrades or no.

Sorry if this bursts your bubble... but I hope it helps you realize your fears are unfounded.

IsleOfMan

I hope my fears are unfounded... but even on principle alone I'm of the opinion that DL should upgrade all DL Elites before any NW/CO elites.

MikeyZBT

Yeah, but at least implement a system where, in the rare case, that:

1. You are a DL Medallion
2. You are flying CO or NW
3. All the CO/NW Elites have been upgraded
4. AND there are still first class seats available...

I think, in that case, however rare they are, that CO/NW should offer upgrades to DL Elites...

And yes, in the reverse, DL should offer upgrades to CO/NW Elites AFTER ALL the DL Medallions have been upgraded.

IsleOfMan

I agree with this 100%... the ONLY time CO/NW elites should see an upgrade on DL metal is after ALL DL elites have been upgraded. The same is true for CO/NW metal flights... I wouldn't expect an upgrade before any elite loyal to the airline operating the flight.

GUWonder

A CO or NW Platinum who flies DL more than a DL Silver or Gold -- maybe even more than the typical DL Platinum -- might expect an upgrade for being loyal to DL regardless of where they credited their flights.

cynicalflyer

Where precisely do these mythological creatures exist? Esp. now that Jeff has announced the gutting like a dead fish of the SkyChoice program?

IsleOfMan

They can expect it all they want... but if they are crediting their flights to another program, that is the program they've chosen to be loyal to. Until all of the individual programs go away and we have just SkyTeam, I think the airline should recognize elites in its own program before anyone else.

ecaarch

I gotta agree. ^

MikeyZBT

Absolutely.

I would love just being able to hope for an upgrade on CO/NW as a Delta FO.

eefor jfp

My guess is that if this is implimented, it will follow the guidelines of the *Alliance model. Many program members can upgrade on other airlines. Using, for example, Miles and More (Lufthansa's program) it works like this: Y/B to C = 35,000 miles transatlantic one way; C to F or other paid economy fares to C = 50,000 miles transatlantic one way. Award fares are not eligible, nor are a few special fares like travel agent, group, etc. Similar levels for other areas of the world. The whole chart is available here. Anyway, it's really expensive and "cheaper" to just redeem a ticket (90K miles in biz for a RT from Europe to the US vs. 100K to upgrade just the transatlantic portions RT). If SkyTeam follows this model, it won't be a huge giveback but it will be a positive step for those with lots of miles to burn. I've never tried to redeem an award, but from what I've read on the boards, it's not too hard.

bocastephen

Interesting discussion, but unlikely to see the light of day. CO Elites have made it very clear to our management we do not want reciprocal upgrades with Delta, and the current system with NW is just fine - although we want NW Elites to be prioritized after the same tiered CO Elite to match how NW treats CO Elites.

The article is just speculation - who knows what DL might be negotiating with its other partners - but at CO, we will not stand for allowing DL Elites to get access to our FC seats via free upgrades. It's already hard enough for Golds and Silvers to get any upgrades at all unless they pay full Y.

Ain't gonna happen.

tkey75

I'm sure you're right, but not for the reasons you state. It should be perfectly clear to everyone that despite all the talk, it's a rare airline that cares and acts for the wants of its customers on the level you describe.


Wait - why are we discussing this again? Has something new happened?

mtparadis

No, just another "same number of seats and same number of elites will lead to less upgrades" argument.

waltinsocal

[QUOTE=DanTravels;8932887]First, I apologize in advance for saying what I am about to say, since this is the DL forum, and I know people here hold DL in somewhat of an exalted view... but:

You apparently fear that reciprocal upgrades on DL would result in hordes of NW/CO platinums swarming onto DL flights and taking away your beloved seats in DL domestic F. Why on Earth do you think they'd want to do that? Has it occurred to you that if everyone else thought DL was really all that great, they'd be DL platinums? "


My response is that it wouldn't take "hordes" coming over. On certain flights where upgrades are tight, it might take just "one" coming over. But then again if the pecking order were to be DL PM, DL GM, DL FO and then the "one" or even the "hordes" from the other airlines, that would be fine since now as a GM I only get trumped by a DL PM (or a DL GM based on a tiebreaker.)

DaDaDan

This is a completely true statement as currently there is "friction" in the system. CO elites on DL don't get upgrades, and vica versa. So even though there will be the same number of elites and the same number of seats, the number of elites eligible for upgrades on the average flight will increase.

The effect may not be as bad as everyone thinks though, because while CO elites may take some DL flights because they no longer need to go out of their way to take CO just for the upgrades, the opposite will be true as well. Thus, the increase in upgrade-eligible elites on any one flight may not be so bad. Also, elites will still be drawn to their own airline because of the reduced MQM/EQM rates for low fare classes when travelling on the other's flights.

Anyway, I think the they should try it out for a while and see how things shake out.