Fare Class No Longer a Factor in Upgrade Priority
Oct 26, 2023 | 2:40 pm
#61
Moderator: Delta SkyMiles, Luxury Hotels, TravelBuzz! and Italy
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Los Angeles
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The original "rule" was that you had to buy a minimum of a K fare to get upgraded, but there was no capacity control on the upgrades. Buy the K fare, have the right status, and you were upgraded right away (no waiting for an upgrade window). I remember buying a K fare to HNL for around $450 during a fare sale and upgrading it.
Anything below K was not upgradeable. At one point, that meant L, but as you note, there were more and more sub-K discount fares added over the years: L, U, T, X, V come to mind.
The problem for DL from a competitive standpoint back in the day was that other carriers would allow upgrades from any fare (although I don't think it was at the time of booking) and there was pressure on DL to liberalize the upgrade policy. So, we eventually migrated to the all-fare-eligible model, but it was with time windows and upgrade inventory restrictions. It was actually much nicer when you could buy the more expensive K fare and upgrade on the spot.
Anything below K was not upgradeable. At one point, that meant L, but as you note, there were more and more sub-K discount fares added over the years: L, U, T, X, V come to mind.
The problem for DL from a competitive standpoint back in the day was that other carriers would allow upgrades from any fare (although I don't think it was at the time of booking) and there was pressure on DL to liberalize the upgrade policy. So, we eventually migrated to the all-fare-eligible model, but it was with time windows and upgrade inventory restrictions. It was actually much nicer when you could buy the more expensive K fare and upgrade on the spot.
Oct 26, 2023 | 2:49 pm
#62
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,963
Once upon a time on PMNW you would call the reservations number however many days before you were allowed to upgrade based on your elite status level, and you would be upgraded up to last seat availability - no places held back. This was on all fares except Y and perhaps one or two others where you would be upgraded at time of reservation.
Oct 26, 2023 | 3:17 pm
#63
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Nashville
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YMB fares are still more than the discounted F, that is one of the challenges here. Someone who buys tickets 3 -5 days out usually pays more than half the F cabin. I get DL wanting to take care of those people, but this is another one of the issues they created with FCM. They want to correct it by shrinking the elite pool but as a DM on those type of fares I don't see how fewer DMs helps me since there still are no seats in F to UPG.
Oct 26, 2023 | 3:22 pm
#64
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I would say 50% being generous. BNA on a Monday morning can have 30 -40 DMs on the flight. Even with the thinning of the elite ranks, there are no seats to upgrade too.
Oct 26, 2023 | 6:08 pm
#65
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: KATL
Programs: DL DM/2MM
Posts: 2,089
The sentence about fare classes isn't flagged as being obsolete in 2024, though other bullet points in that list are specifically mentioned as being so.
Oct 26, 2023 | 6:12 pm
#66
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: KATL
Programs: DL DM/2MM
Posts: 2,089
So, my best guess (and I do mean guess): Someone was paying attention when compiling the chart, as someone paying attention is how the language changed. The portion that says fare class could have been missed when they were making the change to the chart.
On the other hand doing away with fare class as a factor is a major change, difficult to imagine that they wanted to do that. Keeping fare class as a factor encourages people to pay higher fares.
On the other hand doing away with fare class as a factor is a major change, difficult to imagine that they wanted to do that. Keeping fare class as a factor encourages people to pay higher fares.
I agree with this second paragraph though. Given all of the things that they highlighted as changing, it seems hard to believe that they didn't call out the most consequential of them all in any way other than a chart in the T&Cs.
Oct 26, 2023 | 6:31 pm
#67
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: IND
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The original "rule" was that you had to buy a minimum of a K fare to get upgraded, but there was no capacity control on the upgrades. Buy the K fare, have the right status, and you were upgraded right away (no waiting for an upgrade window). I remember buying a K fare to HNL for around $450 during a fare sale and upgrading it.
The problem for DL from a competitive standpoint back in the day was that other carriers would allow upgrades from any fare (although I don't think it was at the time of booking) and there was pressure on DL to liberalize the upgrade policy. So, we eventually migrated to the all-fare-eligible model, but it was with time windows and upgrade inventory restrictions. It was actually much nicer when you could buy the more expensive K fare and upgrade on the spot.
The problem for DL from a competitive standpoint back in the day was that other carriers would allow upgrades from any fare (although I don't think it was at the time of booking) and there was pressure on DL to liberalize the upgrade policy. So, we eventually migrated to the all-fare-eligible model, but it was with time windows and upgrade inventory restrictions. It was actually much nicer when you could buy the more expensive K fare and upgrade on the spot.
Oct 26, 2023 | 6:50 pm
#68
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Atlanta, GA
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That was a friendly, simpler system. But there was a contingent on this board that insisted that any fare should be upgradeable. And eventually Delta capitulated and made that the case, but with upgrade windows and inventory controls put in place as a result. I often wonder what would have happened if the K fare requirement had remained in place. (I am not so sure a K fare in today's market would be any less than the majority of discount F fares offered).
Oct 26, 2023 | 8:58 pm
#69
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Atlanta, GA
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Once upon a time, I had to use influence with corporate travel to buy the K+ when L was available. The only thing I remember differently was that there was still a small amount of capacity control on it but not much. And you could tell in advance if it was available and just pick a different flight if your original choice didn't have availability.
Last edited by Robert Leach; Oct 26, 2023 at 9:50 pm
Oct 27, 2023 | 4:01 am
#70
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL DM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,417
1. What percent of flights have at least one seat that gets a complimentary upgrade.
2. What percent of flights have no more than one 2MM DM on them.
Odds of a UG for a 2MM DM will be approximately 1) x 2).
Oct 27, 2023 | 12:25 pm
#71
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Georgia
Programs: DL DM/2MM
Posts: 1,118
If you're at the top of the list, it doesn't matter if there are 3, or 30, or 300 DMs on the flight. The questions really are...
1. What percent of flights have at least one seat that gets a complimentary upgrade.
2. What percent of flights have no more than one 2MM DM on them.
Odds of a UG for a 2MM DM will be approximately 1) x 2).
1. What percent of flights have at least one seat that gets a complimentary upgrade.
2. What percent of flights have no more than one 2MM DM on them.
Odds of a UG for a 2MM DM will be approximately 1) x 2).
Oct 27, 2023 | 2:33 pm
#72
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: MSP
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I'm interested to see this tested on Jan 1; have 2 people at the same medallion level buy a ticket within the check-in window. One buys MC, one buys C+ and see where they fall on the upgrade list. Theoretically they'd have the same coach fare class, but should check to make sure. Then, have person that paid MC buy a C+ upgrade and see if they jump up the list. Finally, cancel for a refund.
Oct 27, 2023 | 2:50 pm
#73
Join Date: Oct 2019
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At the top of the list are 360s who surely must trump DMs. At any rate, in mid-Jan. I'll give you a data point from a 2MM DM holding an LUT ticket on a 30 DM flight. If DL is truly changing from fare class to cabin, and 2MM trumps 1MM (rather than all MMers are equal), and C+ isn't considered its own cabin, then I predict I'll clear. Otherwise, I have doubts.
Oct 27, 2023 | 4:52 pm
#74
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 6,493
I'm interested to see this tested on Jan 1; have 2 people at the same medallion level buy a ticket within the check-in window. One buys MC, one buys C+ and see where they fall on the upgrade list. Theoretically they'd have the same coach fare class, but should check to make sure. Then, have person that paid MC buy a C+ upgrade and see if they jump up the list. Finally, cancel for a refund.