A disappointing experience - or a reflection of how things are?
Apr 5, 2012 | 1:11 am
#106
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Twin Cities
Programs: Delta DM MM, IHG Plat, Hilton DM, Marriott SE, Emerald EE, Oakdale Gun Club, NRA & GOA Life Member
Posts: 3,870
Why is the policy stupid that the FAs kept him in coach? If I was a solo Diamond in coach and saw someone moved to BE just because they had kids up there I would be livid. Are you really suggesting that DL just move him up front because he has kids??? There's a reason the BE cabin was empty...the OP wanted it but obviously didn't value it highly enough to pay for it.
Apr 5, 2012 | 1:50 am
#107
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: DL DM, EY Plat, MM Senator
Posts: 493
Why is the policy stupid that the FAs kept him in coach? If I was a solo Diamond in coach and saw someone moved to BE just because they had kids up there I would be livid. Are you really suggesting that DL just move him up front because he has kids??? There's a reason the BE cabin was empty...the OP wanted it but obviously didn't value it highly enough to pay for it.
B. Karma is a b$$ch. Hope neither you nor your loved ones ever have a medical emergency on board.
The OP did not ask to be moved upfront. Did not see it anywhere in the original post.
It is people like you who drive the good guys away from this board. Congratulations on another one.
Getting livid harms no one but yourself. Good luck!
Apr 5, 2012 | 5:02 am
#108
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: MCO
Programs: DL-DM/1MM, HILTON-DIA, .HYATT-DIA/GLOB , IHG-PLT,HERTZ 5*, NATIONAL ES
Posts: 8,700
Setting aside any emotional opinions on entitlement/NRSA/DYKWIA/babies/PDBs/etc, the correct answer really is this simple. It really is.
Passengers from coach should not enter BE to contact family/friends unless a true EMERGENCY is occurring at which point an FA/pilot should be involved. Changing a diaper isn't an emergency nor is a child vomiting. These are both routine childcare responsibilities, and if both parents feel the need to be present for such events they need to purchase tickets in the same cabin. It would be no different for people traveling with spouses or friends. Outside a true medical emergency I can't think of a situation where contact would be required.
For those who think such a viewpoint is callous and unfriendly, I would question whether they understand the slippery slope of allowing constant visits to another cabin for leisure purposes.
Passengers from coach should not enter BE to contact family/friends unless a true EMERGENCY is occurring at which point an FA/pilot should be involved. Changing a diaper isn't an emergency nor is a child vomiting. These are both routine childcare responsibilities, and if both parents feel the need to be present for such events they need to purchase tickets in the same cabin. It would be no different for people traveling with spouses or friends. Outside a true medical emergency I can't think of a situation where contact would be required.
For those who think such a viewpoint is callous and unfriendly, I would question whether they understand the slippery slope of allowing constant visits to another cabin for leisure purposes.
^^. Too often I have been in a J or F cabin where visitors of all sizes ventured up to see friends/family. On an AA transcon (777), my partner and I were in J. Guy across from me had his grandkids visiting constantly. The fact that the guy next to him had a dog added to the excitement. Having constant tradfic affects the comfort of any cabin, but J+F cabins aresupposed to be more isolated....
DL should enforce the invisible line between Y and F/J on both domestic and international flights.
Apr 5, 2012 | 5:36 am
#109
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Long Beach, CA
Programs: DL DM
Posts: 5,292
Setting aside any emotional opinions on entitlement/NRSA/DYKWIA/babies/PDBs/etc, the correct answer really is this simple. It really is.
Passengers from coach should not enter BE to contact family/friends unless a true EMERGENCY is occurring at which point an FA/pilot should be involved. Changing a diaper isn't an emergency nor is a child vomiting. These are both routine childcare responsibilities, and if both parents feel the need to be present for such events they need to purchase tickets in the same cabin. It would be no different for people traveling with spouses or friends. Outside a true medical emergency I can't think of a situation where contact would be required.
For those who think such a viewpoint is callous and unfriendly, I would question whether they understand the slippery slope of allowing constant visits to another cabin for leisure purposes.
Passengers from coach should not enter BE to contact family/friends unless a true EMERGENCY is occurring at which point an FA/pilot should be involved. Changing a diaper isn't an emergency nor is a child vomiting. These are both routine childcare responsibilities, and if both parents feel the need to be present for such events they need to purchase tickets in the same cabin. It would be no different for people traveling with spouses or friends. Outside a true medical emergency I can't think of a situation where contact would be required.
For those who think such a viewpoint is callous and unfriendly, I would question whether they understand the slippery slope of allowing constant visits to another cabin for leisure purposes.
^
Apr 5, 2012 | 5:42 am
#110
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SE US
Programs: Duke of Bombay, Delta Ham Sandwich tm, Delta's Glitch
Posts: 4,201
^^. Too often I have been in a J or F cabin where visitors of all sizes ventured up to see friends/family. On an AA transcon (777), my partner and I were in J. Guy across from me had his grandkids visiting constantly. The fact that the guy next to him had a dog added to the excitement. Having constant tradfic affects the comfort of any cabin, but J+F cabins aresupposed to be more isolated....
DL should enforce the invisible line between Y and F/J on both domestic and international flights.
DL should enforce the invisible line between Y and F/J on both domestic and international flights.
Apr 5, 2012 | 6:21 am
#111
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2008
Location: CHA, MAN;
Programs: Delta DM 1 MM; Hz PC
Posts: 11,174
But this is an MO of many on this board! The art of civil discussion and debate is rapidly disappearing in our society, and its tiny slice represented here is a great example of what is going on in the society at large. Accusations and insults, and even thinly veiled profanity fly within a post or two. The general perception on this board is that anyone who complains is automatically wrong, a DYKWIA type. It is especially surprising given that many (most?) on this board are well educated, well traveled people who know basic etiquette and manners -- and yet here they behave as bullies. Compensating for something?
One does not need to be a mental health professional to see that for some this must be an outlet for their unresolved frustrations in life. A friend, a top notch psychiatrist, got so interested in this phenomenon that he started building a profile of several particularly intereting posters. It will be a fascinating research report to read if it ever materializes -- and there are no patient confidentiality concerns either, everything is anonymous from the get go. The trends are so brilliant though! Wouldn't it make a fabulous case study for the Journal of Mental Health? Would love to read it, even though it is not my field at all.
One does not need to be a mental health professional to see that for some this must be an outlet for their unresolved frustrations in life. A friend, a top notch psychiatrist, got so interested in this phenomenon that he started building a profile of several particularly intereting posters. It will be a fascinating research report to read if it ever materializes -- and there are no patient confidentiality concerns either, everything is anonymous from the get go. The trends are so brilliant though! Wouldn't it make a fabulous case study for the Journal of Mental Health? Would love to read it, even though it is not my field at all.
Apr 5, 2012 | 8:36 am
#112
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: ORD
Programs: DL FO...ex-PM, GM...does it really even matter these days? LOL...
Posts: 1,248
Setting aside any emotional opinions on entitlement/NRSA/DYKWIA/babies/PDBs/etc, the correct answer really is this simple. It really is.
Passengers from coach should not enter BE to contact family/friends unless a true EMERGENCY is occurring at which point an FA/pilot should be involved. Changing a diaper isn't an emergency nor is a child vomiting. These are both routine childcare responsibilities, and if both parents feel the need to be present for such events they need to purchase tickets in the same cabin. It would be no different for people traveling with spouses or friends. Outside a true medical emergency I can't think of a situation where contact would be required.
For those who think such a viewpoint is callous and unfriendly, I would question whether they understand the slippery slope of allowing constant visits to another cabin for leisure purposes.
Passengers from coach should not enter BE to contact family/friends unless a true EMERGENCY is occurring at which point an FA/pilot should be involved. Changing a diaper isn't an emergency nor is a child vomiting. These are both routine childcare responsibilities, and if both parents feel the need to be present for such events they need to purchase tickets in the same cabin. It would be no different for people traveling with spouses or friends. Outside a true medical emergency I can't think of a situation where contact would be required.
For those who think such a viewpoint is callous and unfriendly, I would question whether they understand the slippery slope of allowing constant visits to another cabin for leisure purposes.
Apr 5, 2012 | 8:38 am
#113
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: ORD
Programs: DL FO...ex-PM, GM...does it really even matter these days? LOL...
Posts: 1,248
Why? He could've purchased 2 seats in that "wide open" cabin. Or...is this what the OP was hoping would happen and it backfired? Hmmmm...
Apr 5, 2012 | 8:57 am
#114
Moderator: Delta SkyMiles, Luxury Hotels, TravelBuzz! and Italy
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 27,015
Delta people certainly have the power to bend rules in the name of customer service. Plus, all rules are not the same. Smoking in the Lav is not the same as walking into BE. A big plane with a wide open BE and only NRSA seated in it? If the FA wanted to make nice, he/she had 3 opps to do so. At the beginning of the flight by going to a gate agent and saying since "we are wide open up here, do you want to move this Diamond up"?, after the IFE incident, and after the medical incident. All of those and especially the last 2 could have been justified. My take is the OP somehow pissed off the FA whether it was intentional or not... with that said, I did not see a tone of deservedness.... more like dissapointment how the whole thing went down.
Apr 5, 2012 | 9:17 am
#115
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Why is the policy stupid that the FAs kept him in coach? If I was a solo Diamond in coach and saw someone moved to BE just because they had kids up there I would be livid. Are you really suggesting that DL just move him up front because he has kids??? There's a reason the BE cabin was empty...the OP wanted it but obviously didn't value it highly enough to pay for it.
After the medical emergency in which the OP assisted, he alone could have been moved up to BE at the purser's discretion, but that would require leaving the other kid alone back in coach, which is not allowed because the UM fee was not paid (and the kid might be too young to travel as UM anyway).
Having one or two seats in BE does not permit someone to visit BE or be moved up even if there are empty seats, especially with small children (who cannot travel in BE with nonrev parents). If I were on that flight, I would not accept having the OP's family situation disturb my experience in BE.
This is the first time I've ever been tempted to make the common FT refrain "if you want to travel in BE, you should purchase a seat in BE."
Apr 5, 2012 | 10:00 am
#116
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 481
Delta people certainly have the power to bend rules in the name of customer service. Plus, all rules are not the same. Smoking in the Lav is not the same as walking into BE. A big plane with a wide open BE and only NRSA seated in it? If the FA wanted to make nice, he/she had 3 opps to do so. At the beginning of the flight by going to a gate agent and saying since "we are wide open up here, do you want to move this Diamond up"?, after the IFE incident, and after the medical incident. All of those and especially the last 2 could have been justified. My take is the OP somehow pissed off the FA whether it was intentional or not... with that said, I did not see a tone of deservedness.... more like dissapointment how the whole thing went down.
Maybe I missed it, please point out that OP wanted or felt he deserved to be moved up to BE.
Also he mentioned that he visited his kid only TWO times during the flight.
Apr 5, 2012 | 10:04 am
#117
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 481
A. Learning to read and actually understand the written word should be your number 1 priority
B. Karma is a b$$ch. Hope neither you nor your loved ones ever have a medical emergency on board.
The OP did not ask to be moved upfront. Did not see it anywhere in the original post.
It is people like you who drive the good guys away from this board. Congratulations on another one.
Getting livid harms no one but yourself. Good luck!
B. Karma is a b$$ch. Hope neither you nor your loved ones ever have a medical emergency on board.
The OP did not ask to be moved upfront. Did not see it anywhere in the original post.
It is people like you who drive the good guys away from this board. Congratulations on another one.
Getting livid harms no one but yourself. Good luck!
Apr 5, 2012 | 10:14 am
#118
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 481
Have you used SWUs for upgrade? What about people using the SWUs? Shouldn't you/they purchase BE tickets according to your statement above? As I said, start another thread, and we could discuss there. Thank you.
Apr 5, 2012 | 11:02 am
#119
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: LGA/JFK
Programs: DL Silver (aka, Delta AmEx PLUS), Starbucks Gold :)
Posts: 463
But this is an MO of many on this board! The art of civil discussion and debate is rapidly disappearing in our society, and its tiny slice represented here is a great example of what is going on in the society at large. Accusations and insults, and even thinly veiled profanity fly within a post or two. The general perception on this board is that anyone who complains is automatically wrong, a DYKWIA type. It is especially surprising given that many (most?) on this board are well educated, well traveled people who know basic etiquette and manners -- and yet here they behave as bullies. Compensating for something?
Furthermore, the perception on this board (that anyone who complains is wrong and is a DYKWIA type) is carried back to Delta. If they are monitoring this board, and they see an issue to which the majority of the people downplay, dismiss, or blame the OP, why would they WANT to change? It may also be why they don't take the complaints on FCM, using SWU's, or changes in the SM program seriously.
OP - I noticed that you deleted the initial post. Sorry that it came down to that.
Apr 5, 2012 | 11:27 am
#120
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: DL DM, EY Plat, MM Senator
Posts: 493
I agree. In fact, as a DM flying in BE because I paid for it, I would complain strongly to the FAs if I saw the OP in BE after the door closed and even if the OP and the kid sitting with him were in the BE cabin for very long during the boarding process. I would then call for the purser and if the OP or his other kid continued to visit BE, I would complain strongly to DL after the flight, with crew names and details.
After the medical emergency in which the OP assisted, he alone could have been moved up to BE at the purser's discretion, but that would require leaving the other kid alone back in coach, which is not allowed because the UM fee was not paid (and the kid might be too young to travel as UM anyway).
Having one or two seats in BE does not permit someone to visit BE or be moved up even if there are empty seats, especially with small children (who cannot travel in BE with nonrev parents). If I were on that flight, I would not accept having the OP's family situation disturb my experience in BE.
This is the first time I've ever been tempted to make the common FT refrain "if you want to travel in BE, you should purchase a seat in BE."
After the medical emergency in which the OP assisted, he alone could have been moved up to BE at the purser's discretion, but that would require leaving the other kid alone back in coach, which is not allowed because the UM fee was not paid (and the kid might be too young to travel as UM anyway).
Having one or two seats in BE does not permit someone to visit BE or be moved up even if there are empty seats, especially with small children (who cannot travel in BE with nonrev parents). If I were on that flight, I would not accept having the OP's family situation disturb my experience in BE.
This is the first time I've ever been tempted to make the common FT refrain "if you want to travel in BE, you should purchase a seat in BE."
However, the OP did not ask to be moved to BE, did not visit the BE except for staying there to assist his family while the plane was on the ground and the boarding door was still open, and did not come across as demanding or even asking for anything special in his post. So, please get the facts straight before you start discussing "could have", "would have", "should have"; it didn't, simple as that. I wish many things were different -- I wish that evryone passed a basic test on ethics and etiquette before being allowed to post here, but that's not in the cards, so I shut up and move on.
There was a specific situation, with specific parameters, so do not bend the facts to further your agenda. Hijacking and derailing threads with irrelevant posts is against the forum policy, isn't it?
Thank you!
Last edited by glbetrotter; Apr 5, 2012 at 11:35 am