TATL Upgrades using Skymiles and SWUs on Air France/KLM
Apr 10, 2012, 2:18 pm
#616
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: LHR
Programs: DL DM 2MM, BA Bronze, Various Hotels
Posts: 10,187
Most of my OpUp's TATL have been to/from LHR...all about the route!
Apr 11, 2012, 5:48 am
#617
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: BER, SAT, AUS
Programs: Feels like FO (AA EXP)
Posts: 1,611
On AFKLM, all of my OpUps didn't make any sense. I have received many intra-EU OpUps for no apparent reason, such as CDG-ATH, ATH-AMS, CDG-TXL. Strangely all on flights that were not overbooked and they looked fairly balanced to me.
TATL OpUps on both have been sparse the last two years. I think after a system alignment, all GM onwards, are simply displayed as Elite Plus in the system and if the agent does not undertake the additional step to open the reservation and check for the status, a DM is actually indistinguishable from a GM. An indicator for me is the lounge (in AMS): when there is a lazy agent (just scanning my BP), I am frequently asked for the "color of my card", while an agent putting in a lot of typing work has not yet asked me that question.
At CDG, the situation is even worse even for DL-operated. Most of the time they have a paper print out, in which all EC seats and potential OpUps are shown. Status is not really a part of the list, at least I did not see any. Just Names, seat assignments, and a $ amount next to it. I have no idea how that list is prepared though, maybe someone can elaborate.
TATL OpUps on both have been sparse the last two years. I think after a system alignment, all GM onwards, are simply displayed as Elite Plus in the system and if the agent does not undertake the additional step to open the reservation and check for the status, a DM is actually indistinguishable from a GM. An indicator for me is the lounge (in AMS): when there is a lazy agent (just scanning my BP), I am frequently asked for the "color of my card", while an agent putting in a lot of typing work has not yet asked me that question.
At CDG, the situation is even worse even for DL-operated. Most of the time they have a paper print out, in which all EC seats and potential OpUps are shown. Status is not really a part of the list, at least I did not see any. Just Names, seat assignments, and a $ amount next to it. I have no idea how that list is prepared though, maybe someone can elaborate.
Apr 11, 2012, 1:23 pm
#618
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: now ZRH, previously DTW
Programs: DL-Diamond & 1MM; HH-Diamond; Marriott-Gold
Posts: 159
Just had the best upgrade experience ever - really think that DL has improved on this ^
Called PM line and asked for a mileage upgrade on the return portion of our trip. The entire ticket is booked with DL flight numbers in DL W class on AF operated flights. The agent put me on hold for about 5 minutes, came back and said that she needs to transfer me to the "specialty desk." Got connected to a guy there, explained what I want again, and he put me on hold for another 10 minutes, came back, confirmed the SM accounts to debit the miles from and deducted 15k miles from each of our account, and reissued the tickets right away. Ticket showing business on both DL and AF website now with new ticket numbers.
Brilliant - no need to explain anything to anyone in the phone call, all smoothly done. And I was worried that with a DL issued/coded W class ticket, things might be complicated, but apparently not
Called PM line and asked for a mileage upgrade on the return portion of our trip. The entire ticket is booked with DL flight numbers in DL W class on AF operated flights. The agent put me on hold for about 5 minutes, came back and said that she needs to transfer me to the "specialty desk." Got connected to a guy there, explained what I want again, and he put me on hold for another 10 minutes, came back, confirmed the SM accounts to debit the miles from and deducted 15k miles from each of our account, and reissued the tickets right away. Ticket showing business on both DL and AF website now with new ticket numbers.
Brilliant - no need to explain anything to anyone in the phone call, all smoothly done. And I was worried that with a DL issued/coded W class ticket, things might be complicated, but apparently not
Apr 11, 2012, 1:30 pm
#619
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Earth. Residency:HKG formerly:YYZ
Programs: CX, DL, Nexus/GE, APEC
Posts: 10,689
On AFKLM, all of my OpUps didn't make any sense. I have received many intra-EU OpUps for no apparent reason, such as CDG-ATH, ATH-AMS, CDG-TXL. Strangely all on flights that were not overbooked and they looked fairly balanced to me.
TATL OpUps on both have been sparse the last two years. I think after a system alignment, all GM onwards, are simply displayed as Elite Plus in the system and if the agent does not undertake the additional step to open the reservation and check for the status, a DM is actually indistinguishable from a GM. An indicator for me is the lounge (in AMS): when there is a lazy agent (just scanning my BP), I am frequently asked for the "color of my card", while an agent putting in a lot of typing work has not yet asked me that question.
At CDG, the situation is even worse even for DL-operated. Most of the time they have a paper print out, in which all EC seats and potential OpUps are shown. Status is not really a part of the list, at least I did not see any. Just Names, seat assignments, and a $ amount next to it. I have no idea how that list is prepared though, maybe someone can elaborate.
TATL OpUps on both have been sparse the last two years. I think after a system alignment, all GM onwards, are simply displayed as Elite Plus in the system and if the agent does not undertake the additional step to open the reservation and check for the status, a DM is actually indistinguishable from a GM. An indicator for me is the lounge (in AMS): when there is a lazy agent (just scanning my BP), I am frequently asked for the "color of my card", while an agent putting in a lot of typing work has not yet asked me that question.
At CDG, the situation is even worse even for DL-operated. Most of the time they have a paper print out, in which all EC seats and potential OpUps are shown. Status is not really a part of the list, at least I did not see any. Just Names, seat assignments, and a $ amount next to it. I have no idea how that list is prepared though, maybe someone can elaborate.
You are either statusless, Elite or Elite plus. It does not matter to AF or KL whether your ST E+ is GM, PM or DM.
Apr 11, 2012, 1:46 pm
#620
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: JFK
Programs: Delta GM, ST E+, SPG Gold
Posts: 141
In February, I flew LAX-CDG-LAX on AF. I am a DL GM (ST E+). At the airport, I asked the check-in agent what the possibility was getting an OpUp to Affairs...the guy laughed at me...and I went on my merry way to the lounge. While at the "fabulous" AF lounge (LAX terminal 2)...I made a similar ask to the lounge attendant, who placed me on a "list." She also informed me the flight was oversold....a Boeing 77W.
They announced boarding would be delayed....the GA's feverishly asked First class & Affaires to line up. They started calling out names to approach the desk, I was one of the names called. They informed me I would be upgraded....I was hoping for biz class...but instead I was placed in Premium Economy. It was nice and I definitely enjoyed the space.
No dice CDG-LAX....but due to the snow delays in Rome, I was very late connecting and was four minutes from closing the boarding door.
No complaints from me!!
They announced boarding would be delayed....the GA's feverishly asked First class & Affaires to line up. They started calling out names to approach the desk, I was one of the names called. They informed me I would be upgraded....I was hoping for biz class...but instead I was placed in Premium Economy. It was nice and I definitely enjoyed the space.
No dice CDG-LAX....but due to the snow delays in Rome, I was very late connecting and was four minutes from closing the boarding door.
No complaints from me!!
Apr 20, 2012, 6:06 pm
#621
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: LIT, CDG
Programs: DL PM, AA Gold, Hilton Gold, Choice Hotels Plat, Avis First, AMEX MR Plat
Posts: 83
I would agree! I'm flying tomorrow hoping O opens up soon (almost 20% open in J!) so I can try again. The last couple of times there has been availability have been a breeze. For me this is the best perk DL offers.
Apr 20, 2012, 6:20 pm
#622
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: OKC
Programs: DL DM/2.768MM, Global Entry, Titanium_Marriott, GHertz
Posts: 6,752
When this works out, it is amazing. The DM agent wanted to charge me $3.8K for OKC-GVA in November and said they could not find the AF W/S fare ticket I found on DL's web. So after verifying O in EF, I bought the $1.5K ticket online, called in, and have confirmed seats in Affairres.
The one little problem is getting seat recommendations on the 777 (CDG-IAD) as there has been no response to my post in the AF forum on an existing thread.
The one little problem is getting seat recommendations on the 777 (CDG-IAD) as there has been no response to my post in the AF forum on an existing thread.
Apr 20, 2012, 7:09 pm
#623
Join Date: Jun 2008
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 167
I've flown their 777s a bunch. I'd say try to get a seat in the middle of the section, away from the galleys as it gets loud there.
Regarding the 2-3-2 layout, the middle seat ("F") in the 3 section is the least likely to be filled, so if you are looking for direct aisle access, "E" and "G" are often good options.
As it relates to the angled lie flat, you either love it or hate it. Personally as a side sleeper I find the angle just tolerable enough to do pretty well. The lack of air vents is probably the one thing I would change if I could, although ironically the last few times around it was too cold, not too hot, which I'd rather have anyways.
Regarding the upgrade experience in general, it sounds like we've all come to the agreement that buying the ticket on delta.com first is the best solution. Every time I've struggled with one of these that was the part the reps couldn't figure out. Once you have the ticket the upgrade step is usually 10 minutes or less. Just make sure they do a full reissue, as one time they did not for me and it caused my reservation to look crazy with an economy and a business record for the same segment.
Regarding the 2-3-2 layout, the middle seat ("F") in the 3 section is the least likely to be filled, so if you are looking for direct aisle access, "E" and "G" are often good options.
As it relates to the angled lie flat, you either love it or hate it. Personally as a side sleeper I find the angle just tolerable enough to do pretty well. The lack of air vents is probably the one thing I would change if I could, although ironically the last few times around it was too cold, not too hot, which I'd rather have anyways.
Regarding the upgrade experience in general, it sounds like we've all come to the agreement that buying the ticket on delta.com first is the best solution. Every time I've struggled with one of these that was the part the reps couldn't figure out. Once you have the ticket the upgrade step is usually 10 minutes or less. Just make sure they do a full reissue, as one time they did not for me and it caused my reservation to look crazy with an economy and a business record for the same segment.
Apr 20, 2012, 7:13 pm
#624
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: OKC
Programs: DL DM/2.768MM, Global Entry, Titanium_Marriott, GHertz
Posts: 6,752
I've flown their 777s a bunch. I'd say try to get a seat in the middle of the section, away from the galleys as it gets loud there.
Regarding the 2-3-2 layout, the middle seat ("F") in the 3 section is the least likely to be filled, so if you are looking for direct aisle access, "E" and "G" are often good options.
Regarding the 2-3-2 layout, the middle seat ("F") in the 3 section is the least likely to be filled, so if you are looking for direct aisle access, "E" and "G" are often good options.
In terms of my choices, on the old 763s and 330s I go with 2C while on the 764 I go for 1A then 7A on DL's 777.
Apr 22, 2012, 1:27 pm
#625
FlyerTalk Evangelist & Ambassador: China
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: DL DM/MM, UA 1K, AA Exp, HH Dia, WOH Glob, IHG Plat, Marriott Gold, NA EE, Hertz PC
Posts: 17,423
Have a TATL segment not in YBMWS, so yes I know I cannot technically upgrade via miles or SWU regardless of O being available.
However, I do recall reading here some folks going to the AF lounges and getting agents to offer them UG's to PV or J with miles/cash pending the J loads.
Any recent reports?
However, I do recall reading here some folks going to the AF lounges and getting agents to offer them UG's to PV or J with miles/cash pending the J loads.
Any recent reports?
Apr 22, 2012, 3:33 pm
#626
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SUX
Programs: BA Silver; HHonors Gold; SPG Gold; Points but dirt with everyone else
Posts: 8,050
Have a TATL segment not in YBMWS, so yes I know I cannot technically upgrade via miles or SWU regardless of O being available.
However, I do recall reading here some folks going to the AF lounges and getting agents to offer them UG's to PV or J with miles/cash pending the J loads.
Any recent reports?
However, I do recall reading here some folks going to the AF lounges and getting agents to offer them UG's to PV or J with miles/cash pending the J loads.
Any recent reports?
Apr 23, 2012, 4:33 am
#627
FlyerTalk Evangelist & Ambassador: China
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: DL DM/MM, UA 1K, AA Exp, HH Dia, WOH Glob, IHG Plat, Marriott Gold, NA EE, Hertz PC
Posts: 17,423
Apr 25, 2012, 7:57 am
#628
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: DL DM; SPG Gold
Posts: 1,733
great SWU experience
I returned from CDG last week. I had a confirmed upgrade W to O on CDG-IAD, then IAD-ATL-SAN. I had chosen this flight initially because partner wanted to fly affaires on the A380. AF however, substituted the A380 for a regular 77W 2 weeks before the flight.
20 hours or so before our scheduled flight, I saw on expertflyer that 2 O were available on CDG-LAX. I called the plat line and sure enough, for $250 change fee each, we were re-booked on CDG-LAX-SAN, departing at the same time and arriving at SAN almost 5 hours ahead! Partner had used a SWU and I had used miles. Those were transfered to the new flight (no 72hr rule on miles?).
That was great and efficient customer experience! ^
20 hours or so before our scheduled flight, I saw on expertflyer that 2 O were available on CDG-LAX. I called the plat line and sure enough, for $250 change fee each, we were re-booked on CDG-LAX-SAN, departing at the same time and arriving at SAN almost 5 hours ahead! Partner had used a SWU and I had used miles. Those were transfered to the new flight (no 72hr rule on miles?).
That was great and efficient customer experience! ^
May 1, 2012, 8:17 am
#629
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 628
Reading through the thread, there seems to be a little bit of conflicting info on being able to buy up depending on class (or just my interpretation of it perhaps) but has anyone been able to buy (say, day off, with either cash or miles) into Affairs (business) from Premium Voyageur (premium economy) on an A fair? I know that one is the one Premium Voyageur fair that is excluded from miles upgrade, but curious if they ever offer say, day off cash upgrades from that fair into business?
May 1, 2012, 10:15 am
#630
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,417
Reading through the thread, there seems to be a little bit of conflicting info on being able to buy up depending on class (or just my interpretation of it perhaps) but has anyone been able to buy (say, day off, with either cash or miles) into Affairs (business) from Premium Voyageur (premium economy) on an A fair? I know that one is the one Premium Voyageur fair that is excluded from miles upgrade, but curious if they ever offer say, day off cash upgrades from that fair into business?