BEWARE- CO Crew caught on video falsely accusing ELITE of Federal Crime
Jan 4, 2007, 6:52 pm
#106
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 20
The information I am reluctant to disclose is germane to my airline alone..(not Continental). There are procedures that we follow that are not a direct mandate of the FAA but are FAA approved. For example, how the pilots assess turbulence and convey that information to the flight attendants is in a language that only our company may use, but it is approved by the FAA. Other airlines may have a different system but it too has been approved by the FAA. How we determine threat is probably coded or worded differently at each airline, and not something that the public is or should be privy to. Hope that makes sense.
Jan 4, 2007, 6:54 pm
#107
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The information I am reluctant to disclose is germane to my airline alone..(not Continental). There are procedures that we follow that are not a direct mandate of the FAA but are FAA approved. For example, how the pilots assess turbulence and convey that information to the flight attendants is in a language that only our company may use, but it is approved by the FAA. Other airlines may have a different system but it too has been approved by the FAA. How we determine threat is probably coded or worded differently at each airline, and not something that the public is or should be privy to. Hope that makes sense.
Which airline do you work with?
Jan 4, 2007, 7:24 pm
#108
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This is how-it violates one of the several levels that is used for classification purposes (if I tell you what they are, I have to kill you). Behavior that is unusual (why would you need to tape us???) lends itself to being interpreted as suspicious. The FAR is an umbrella that covers this area. Sorry if this sounds cryptic, but I am not sure what should be disclosed.
The FAR you cited says nothing about video taping or even about suspicious behaviour. It talks about interfering with the crew. it does not appear that any interference occurred here.
Jan 4, 2007, 7:44 pm
#109
Join Date: Jan 2007
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Jan 4, 2007, 7:44 pm
#110
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Programs: CO Silver, HHonors Gold, Marriott Silver
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In all fairness with me jumping so late in the game of this long thread, the OP should have explained to the cabin crew when they asked if he was 'ok' that he is feeling woosy because he had just taken Ambien and had to wait for 2 hours for the flight and please excuse him as he is very tired.
By stating 'nothing' and the crew seeing you with beady watery eyes could mean 'something' to the crew - that you were high on something.
Sometimes it is better to tell the truth about what you consumed than tape the incidence.
By stating 'nothing' and the crew seeing you with beady watery eyes could mean 'something' to the crew - that you were high on something.
Sometimes it is better to tell the truth about what you consumed than tape the incidence.
Last weekend I boarded a red-eye flight from SNA to EWR. I took an Ambien30 minutes prior to boarding. I was seated in 1-B. After boarding I asked the flight crew if I may use the forward lav to change into my sweats and slippers. The crew said yes and asked me if everything was "ok?" I responded yes but that Iwas a little woozy because I had taken my Ambien. Keep in mind I had been sitting in the gate area (not one of the bars) for 2 hours.
Jan 4, 2007, 8:03 pm
#111
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Like everyone else, I agree that we are only hearing one side of the story. We don't know exactly what has happened.
However, this brings to mind two incidents with CO that I have seen. In one incident, a GA was potentially going to involuntarily deny boarding to a man traveling with his wife and children. I was waiting to board as I had offered to be take a voluntary bump, and over the length of the boarding process I watched both the man and the GA escalate in to a conflict where the GA was threatening to deny boarding and call the police. In the end, he was not IDB'd and was allowed to board. Two things struck me during the whole incidient, though. First, the GA's attitude and response struck me as escalating, not de-escalating, the situation. He struck me as cold, arrogant, inflexible and unwilling to work with the passenger. The GA also would not provide his name when requested by the passenger.
In the other case, I was attempting to enter the PC when I realized I'd forgotten my WorldClub card at home. I've never had an issue in the past as the staff would look up my membership status using my WorldPerks number. However, the employee working the membership verification desk was adamant she could not check me in without the card. After insisting that I had previously been checked in without the card, the woman sitting next to her said "Oh, just click there and type in his number. If you don't see the expiration date you just have to call NW." After she checked me in, I received a mini-lecture on why I need to have my card and how unfair it was to the people trying to enter behind me. In my case, I felt as though I was being goaded in to responding in a negative way so she would have a reason to deny me entry. I apologized several times and left. Having experienced this at the start of my trip, I was sensitive to it every time I entered a club in IAH and EWR. No other employees gave me any trouble.
Of course, both of these incidents were in EWR, so that alone suffices as an explanation.
However, this brings to mind two incidents with CO that I have seen. In one incident, a GA was potentially going to involuntarily deny boarding to a man traveling with his wife and children. I was waiting to board as I had offered to be take a voluntary bump, and over the length of the boarding process I watched both the man and the GA escalate in to a conflict where the GA was threatening to deny boarding and call the police. In the end, he was not IDB'd and was allowed to board. Two things struck me during the whole incidient, though. First, the GA's attitude and response struck me as escalating, not de-escalating, the situation. He struck me as cold, arrogant, inflexible and unwilling to work with the passenger. The GA also would not provide his name when requested by the passenger.
In the other case, I was attempting to enter the PC when I realized I'd forgotten my WorldClub card at home. I've never had an issue in the past as the staff would look up my membership status using my WorldPerks number. However, the employee working the membership verification desk was adamant she could not check me in without the card. After insisting that I had previously been checked in without the card, the woman sitting next to her said "Oh, just click there and type in his number. If you don't see the expiration date you just have to call NW." After she checked me in, I received a mini-lecture on why I need to have my card and how unfair it was to the people trying to enter behind me. In my case, I felt as though I was being goaded in to responding in a negative way so she would have a reason to deny me entry. I apologized several times and left. Having experienced this at the start of my trip, I was sensitive to it every time I entered a club in IAH and EWR. No other employees gave me any trouble.
Of course, both of these incidents were in EWR, so that alone suffices as an explanation.
Jan 4, 2007, 8:05 pm
#112
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i skipped a few pages.... did he ever post the video?
Jan 4, 2007, 8:12 pm
#113
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That states:How is video taping a crew member automatically interference? I can understand that video taping could turn into interference, but it certainly does not directly prohibit video taping as has been suggested above. I also note that according to the OP's account of the events he was not told that he had interfered with the flight crew.
But airline employees (or apologists) making stuff up or engaging in wishful thinking happens too; and that's where we get this sort of "creative interpretation" (and arguments by analogy) that would seem to be without merit in the absence of even one court case where there was a conviction of an airline passenger for the passenger's recording of an interaction to which they were a party or witness, particularly if done in plain sight and/or otherwise disclosed while the plane doors are still open.
Jan 4, 2007, 8:18 pm
#114
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milion miler, you havent answered the question posed ad infinitum :
WILL YOU POST THIS SMOKING GUN EVIDENCE OF A VIDEO YOU KEEP SAYING SAVED YOU A NIGHT IN JAIL??????????
WILL YOU POST THIS SMOKING GUN EVIDENCE OF A VIDEO YOU KEEP SAYING SAVED YOU A NIGHT IN JAIL??????????
Jan 4, 2007, 8:25 pm
#115
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I don't recall reading anything about it being posted yet.
That noted, I would definitely not release the video publicly as it won't do the OP much of any good under the current circumstances, particularly in the absence of some action/movement/statement/response by CO to the OP's filed complaint (if any).
That noted, I would definitely not release the video publicly as it won't do the OP much of any good under the current circumstances, particularly in the absence of some action/movement/statement/response by CO to the OP's filed complaint (if any).
Jan 4, 2007, 9:10 pm
#116
Join Date: Aug 2005
Programs: United 1k ; SW A+ Preferred; Hilton Diamond, Marriott Gold
Posts: 634
So what exactly is it we ELITE are suppsoed to BEWARE of ?
Jan 4, 2007, 9:14 pm
#117
Join Date: Aug 2005
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"I missed the viewing of President Ford in DC that i was scheduled to attend"
They took appointments? Who "scheduled" you?
They took appointments? Who "scheduled" you?
Jan 4, 2007, 9:18 pm
#118
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The public could schedule themselves to attend -- in sort of the same way that someone can schedule a visit to an attraction at Disneyland or Disneyworld.
Jan 4, 2007, 9:22 pm
#119
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Who knows what happened, but one big problem I have is the power Flight Attendants have to alter your life legally based on their perception of things.
Police, and other legal authorities require at least a bachelor degree, and years of training. Flight attendants require a high school diploma, or equivaltent, and 6 weeks of training, with minimal yearly reviews. They have the power to make major problems for you based on their whims. They do not hold even 5% of the qualifications of professional legal authorities, but we hold their words as the same, since 9/11. Something isn't quite right.
Of course most are professional, and decent, but some are trash, and a dirty look can instantly turn into a "threat", and they can have you removed, and thats wrong.
Police, and other legal authorities require at least a bachelor degree, and years of training. Flight attendants require a high school diploma, or equivaltent, and 6 weeks of training, with minimal yearly reviews. They have the power to make major problems for you based on their whims. They do not hold even 5% of the qualifications of professional legal authorities, but we hold their words as the same, since 9/11. Something isn't quite right.
Of course most are professional, and decent, but some are trash, and a dirty look can instantly turn into a "threat", and they can have you removed, and thats wrong.
Jan 4, 2007, 9:31 pm
#120
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As far as I am concerned, until I see this alleged video I refuse to cast any judgement against CO as we are only hearing one side of the story. Anyone who knows me on this board knows that I am FAR from a CO apologist, but something about this story stinks. Stinks real bad. Flame me if you want, but for all we know this cat was seriously whacked out on Ambien and did some stuff that alarmed the FA's to the point where they didnt feel comfortable with him flying. Nuff said. Good for CO. I have flown CO over 300k in the past 2 years and have seen far more good judgement demonstrated than bad. That being said, until I see the video I simply cannot side with the OP on this issue.