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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   Long TSA Lines [merged threads] (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1752212-long-tsa-lines-merged-threads.html)

GUWonder May 15, 2016 6:05 am


Originally Posted by entropy (Post 26626293)
these bozos are trying to get more money. They had a bill in congress to jack up their take on passenger screening over 100%. Its blackmail.

Extortion rackets are so very DHS.

TSA has more than enough screeners and screening checkpoints, but the problem is the TSA's processes/procedures. TSA policy/processes are more for show and shakedown than for delivering a material improvement in effectiveness of interdicting contraband WEIs at passenger screening checkpoints.

They've given us a show of force farce -- like the NYPD's blaring of sirens and flashing police car lights to supposedly scare terrorists -- that just wastes our time and money, all as they shake us down for more money.

WillCAD May 15, 2016 6:36 am


Originally Posted by petaluma1 (Post 26627954)
Neffenger is a short-termer but a placeholder could be given the position to mollify some people.

Canine teams are being shuffled around so why not FSDs?

I still want to know how dogs speed up the screening process.

I answered you in the other thread, but I'll repeat it here: dogs speed up the screening process when they are used *in place of* a more time-consuming screening methodology, such as the NoS, as they were during the Managed Inclusion II program. If they are merely added to the process without something else being subtracted, they do not speed up the process.

Boggie Dog May 15, 2016 9:32 am

I don't think DHS or TSA is taking the long checkpoint waits very seriously.

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/specia...ned-wait-times


Johnson said that he would not characterize the current issue of heightened airport wait times as a national crisis, instead he noted that it is an aviation security imperative.
Ten's of thousands of people missing flights due to TSA incompetence is just an aviation security imperative.

And this, I haven't seen mention of so far.


A reduction in size and number of carry on bags will also result in this new plan, something Secretary Johnson said DHS has been in touch with airlines about recently.
So TSA is now going to direct what size of carry-on bags are allowed? Wonder how that will set with our Road Warriors?

Looks to me that if the airlines continue to allow themselves to be pushed around by government that fairly soon they will have little to no say in how to operate their companies.

If the public wants to see how badly government can operate simple services they need look no further than DHS/TSA.

chollie May 15, 2016 10:07 am

The airlines will be happy to get onboard with a program that claims aviation security will be better if more bags are checked. TSA is hoping that if fewer bags get through the checkpoints, they'll have a better chance at passing the Red Team tests. Win-win for everyone but the pax.

The airlines are not getting 'pushed around'. AA is making a small fortune in rebooking fees and Delta is planning on pairing with Clear. If TSA pushes against carry-on luggage, the airlines will be only to happy to comply - for a fee, of course. Lines? So what? At the end of the day, business travelers and leisure travelers strapped for time (too far to drive) have no alternative but to stay home, and both the airlines and TSA know it and intend to cash in on it.

Congress? Don't make me laugh. As long as key figures get to bypass nasty lines (and they do), and as long as corrupt TSA suppliers continue to line the right Congressional pockets, nothing is going to change.

TSA is also aggressively pushing back at elite lines and would like to eliminate them in favor of Pre - obviously, because elite lines offer a more reliable alternative to Pre. The real Pre time savings is not avoiding shoe removal or even disrobing - FFs get good at that. The time savings is 1) shorter lines and 2) WTMD.

Apparently the baggage screeners do a better job than the checkpoint folks when it comes to passing the Red Team tests. Good Red Team tests = big $$$ bonuses for TSA managers and Neffy. If they get $100K for completely failing the tests, who knows how much they'll get if they actually pass the tests?

petaluma1 May 15, 2016 10:34 am

From @AskTSA this morning:


The @TSA security lines R CRAZY long at @fly2ohare, but I appreciate not having to remove my shoes or take out my laptop to get through.
The person who wrote this was in a standard screening line, so it would seem TSA is, in fact, letting the unwashed through without removing shoes.

~~

ETA:

Also found this re: ORD:

why are you screening every single flier either w/ explosive materials test or wand. Every. Single. Flier today #ORD?

Checked EVERY bag
I'm trying to find out if this person had to remove his/her shoes

Shoes had to be off.

Boggie Dog May 15, 2016 11:19 am

Would be interesting to see a wait time comparison between contract and non-contract airports.

gingersnaps May 15, 2016 11:45 am


Originally Posted by Boggie Dog (Post 26629033)
Would be interesting to see a wait time comparison between contract and non-contract airports.


Wouldn't a better metric be detection rate and wait times?

milepig May 15, 2016 1:53 pm

Fewer bags I could see helping. But, smaller? Do larger bags take longer to go through? Remember the chaos the sizers on the machines caused!

I'm equally puzzled as to how they think 700 more agents will be the solution. There are 376 airports in the US with commercial flights so that's 2 per airport. The TSA employs 47,000 TSOs. 700 more will solve the problem??

pogopossum May 15, 2016 3:29 pm

How about this: charge for carry ON bags: One bag free for all, $25 per bag for any additional. Fees go to TSA. Either checked bags are free, or the fees go to the TSA, since they have to pick through those also.

If the airlines are making "billions" off of check bag fees and are doing nothing additional for them, the TSA should get the money as a "user fee." Increase in TSA budget comes from flyers, not non-flyers. Seems fair to me.

Pogopossum

BSBD May 15, 2016 3:49 pm


Originally Posted by milepig (Post 26629699)
Fewer bags I could see helping.

How? If carry-on bags are limited, it just moves the bottleneck from the security checkpoint to the airline check-in counter (and the checked-bag screening process). It may make things easier on TSA, but how does it make things easier on pax? Standing in line is standing in line, whether you do it to get through the checkpoint, or do it to get your bag checked in.

nk15 May 15, 2016 4:24 pm

TSA was letting in some non-precheck people into precheck the other day. The person in front of me in line was trying to get through the traditional metal detector by going in sideways, raising her hands above her head (like they do in the x-ray nudoscope), and then changing sides, but not moving through the detector, waiting in it for instructions. I was watching all this in awe...

Boggie Dog May 15, 2016 4:49 pm


Originally Posted by pogopossum (Post 26630094)
How about this: charge for carry ON bags: One bag free for all, $25 per bag for any additional. Fees go to TSA. Either checked bags are free, or the fees go to the TSA, since they have to pick through those also.

If the airlines are making "billions" off of check bag fees and are doing nothing additional for them, the TSA should get the money as a "user fee." Increase in TSA budget comes from flyers, not non-flyers. Seems fair to me.

Pogopossum

TSA has all the tax monies they need. No more!!

Boggie Dog May 15, 2016 5:05 pm


Originally Posted by gingersnaps (Post 26629153)
Wouldn't a better metric be detection rate and wait times?

I would like to know which group screens slower. They both use same equipment so detection rates should be about the same. I think government screeners are engaged in a work slowdown.

chrisgwins May 15, 2016 5:30 pm


Originally Posted by nk15 (Post 26630336)
TSA was letting in some non-precheck people into precheck the other day. The person in front of me in line was trying to get through the traditional metal detector by going in sideways, raising her hands above her head (like they do in the x-ray nudoscope), and then changing sides, but not moving through the detector, waiting in it for instructions. I was watching all this in awe...

I just got precheck after years of being trained to use the NOS. I totally see me doing this in a metal detector the first time I use precheck. :D

Carl Johnson May 15, 2016 9:11 pm


Originally Posted by chrisgwins (Post 26630578)
I just got precheck after years of being trained to use the NOS. I totally see me doing this in a metal detector the first time I use precheck. :D

You're supposed to raise your hands in the air in the precheck lane. The different from the regular lane is that after you raise your hands in the air, you then wave them like you just don't care.


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