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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   Requirement for speaking your name? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1398391-requirement-speaking-your-name.html)

Houston.Business Sep 18, 2011 2:05 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ESpen36 (Post 17130407)
It sounds like you encountered TSA's enhanced questioning/BDO program that is being rolled out selectively across the country. While you are not obligated to respond, if you refuse you could subject yourself to delays and additional searches.

I would not say "that's classified" unless it is actually the case. While TSA front-line employees (performing whatever function, including but not limited to TSO, TDC, BDO, etc) are not LEOs, they are government officials who could make trouble for you. IMHO, it is best to tell the truth, in as few words as possible, when speaking with government officials. Saying that your reason for travel is "classified" or "restricted" or "confidential" could land you in some trouble if the TSO calls for a supervisor who demands to see proof of your federal clearance level that allows you to claim that particular classification. Instead, you could say that your reason for travel is "personal" or "private." Just my $0.02.

I understand where you're coming from. My company is in a highly competitive business, and company information is "Confidental". I frequently have to sign Confidentiality Papers before starting a job.

InkUnderNails Sep 18, 2011 2:27 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Houston.Business (Post 17130553)
I understand where you're coming from. My company is in a highly competitive business, and company information is "Confidental". I frequently have to sign Confidentiality Papers before starting a job.

There is one company for which I work that requires I sign a new one every day that I sign in. My customers as well are highly competitive, government employees do not understand that concept, and release of any information about where I am working or what I am doing violates their trust. I am a consultant that has access to quite a bit of highly privileged information. None of it is for public release. I do not even talk about it with my wife.

Global_Hi_Flyer Sep 18, 2011 4:30 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Houston.Business (Post 17130553)
I understand where you're coming from. My company is in a highly competitive business, and company information is "Confidental". I frequently have to sign Confidentiality Papers before starting a job.

Likewise. That's separate and apart from Federal clearance issues. BTW, there generally is no written "proof" that one can show a screener to verify that an individual holds a clearance, though some companies color-code badges to indicate clearance level.

Far better to say that the information is confidential or private (whatever your company term is) and not even bring up the classified stuff.

halls120 Sep 18, 2011 8:09 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ESpen36 (Post 17130407)
It sounds like you encountered TSA's enhanced questioning/BDO program that is being rolled out selectively across the country. While you are not obligated to respond, if you refuse you could subject yourself to delays and additional searches.

I would not say "that's classified" unless it is actually the case. While TSA front-line employees (performing whatever function, including but not limited to TSO, TDC, BDO, etc) are not LEOs, they are government officials who could make trouble for you. IMHO, it is best to tell the truth, in as few words as possible, when speaking with government officials. Saying that your reason for travel is "classified" or "restricted" or "confidential" could land you in some trouble if the TSO calls for a supervisor who demands to see proof of your federal clearance level that allows you to claim that particular classification. Instead, you could say that your reason for travel is "personal" or "private." Just my $0.02.

There isn't a TSA employee anywhere that has the authority to demand to know more than what my destination airport is or why I am traveling there while on government business.

cbn42 Sep 19, 2011 2:04 am

"Classified" or "confidential" sounds too confrontational. I usually just say "visiting", which is always true, because you are going to meet someone. If they ask who, say "friends", which is also always true because you can call anyone you meet a friend.

InkUnderNails Sep 19, 2011 3:13 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbn42 (Post 17133137)
"Classified" or "confidential" sounds too confrontational. I usually just say "visiting", which is always true, because you are going to meet someone. If they ask who, say "friends", which is also always true because you can call anyone you meet a friend.

I really do not think I should have to tell them anything.

cbn42 Sep 19, 2011 3:39 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by InkUnderNails (Post 17133269)
I really do not think I should have to tell them anything.

I don't think that what I say tells them much of anything.

InkUnderNails Sep 19, 2011 3:42 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbn42 (Post 17133322)
I don't think that what I say tells them much of anything.

Resisting authority has kept me in trouble since I was a kid. On this issue, I am still that kid.

FliesWay2Much Sep 19, 2011 5:03 am

Imagine This Scenario...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Houston.Business (Post 17130553)
I understand where you're coming from. My company is in a highly competitive business, and company information is "Confidental". I frequently have to sign Confidentiality Papers before starting a job.

There are also huge due diligence and insider trading implications associating individuals from one company meeting with individuals from another company in a certain location.

Extremely educated with a college degree SPOTNik at BOS conducts interrogation:

1. Where are you flying? (Guy spills guts with final destination.)
2. Do you have a business card? (Guy is intimidated and gives up a business card.)
3. SPOTNik: "Gee, I didn't know you guys had a plant in your destination city. My college buddy works for <Company B> in <your destination city> and does the same things that your company does."
4. SPOTNik ends interrogation, releases passenger from detention, and goes home and buys as many shares of Company A stock as he can afford right before the public announcement that Company A is buying Company B.

...all for national security, I'm sure you'll understand...


FYI, when Lockheed and Martin-Marietta were in their early merger talks, company execs always flew to a city where neither of them had a plant and they always landed at different airports for this very reason.

mikemey Sep 19, 2011 8:19 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by InkUnderNails (Post 17133330)
Resisting authority has kept me in trouble since I was a kid. On this issue, I am still that kid.

I resist authority any chance I get, especially when it's authority asserted to keep people pliant and afraid.

cbn42 Sep 19, 2011 6:55 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikemey (Post 17134201)
I resist authority any chance I get, especially when it's authority asserted to keep people pliant and afraid.

I guess we defer on that point. I resist authority only there is a valid, practical reason to do so. I don't resist authority for the thrill of it, and I think that people (adults) who resist authority just because they think it's funny/exciting need to see a doctor.

TheRoadie Sep 19, 2011 7:21 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbn42 (Post 17137860)
...I think that people (adults) who resist authority just because they think it's funny/exciting need to see a doctor.

So where does "defending the Constitution against intrusions by the camel's nose" fit on that spectrum of insanity? By that measure, Rosa Parks just needed therapy to become a well-adjusted inhabitant of "her place."

Global_Hi_Flyer Sep 19, 2011 8:28 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbn42 (Post 17137860)
I guess we defer on that point. I resist authority only there is a valid, practical reason to do so. I don't resist authority for the thrill of it, and I think that people (adults) who resist authority just because they think it's funny/exciting need to see a doctor.

Does that mean that you find it acceptable that authority is exercised even if there is no valid, practical reason to do so?

Just curious.

bdschobel Sep 20, 2011 11:02 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by InkUnderNails (Post 17133330)
Resisting authority has kept me in trouble since I was a kid. On this issue, I am still that kid.

So am I.

Bruce

mikeef Sep 20, 2011 12:39 pm

It's funny how the TSA has turned me into a "resistor" at the airport. My first goal is to get through security with a minimum of hassle. 95% of the time, they take my ID, smile and tell me to have a nice flight, after which, I proceed through the WTMD with no problem. The other 5%, though, drives me up a wall. Biggest problem: TSOs who take my bags out of my eyesight and then yell at me when I try to follow them.

Mike


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