TSA behavior detection program
#121
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: IAD
Programs: *wood Gold
Posts: 1,780
Unless one is actually carrying a bomb to place aboard a plane, I'm willing to give pretty much everybody a free pass for things that TSA accuses them of doing. That includes lying to them, hurting their feelings with snide remarks, "assaulting" them by waiting until they're doing your pat-down to pass gas, and probably even assaulting them for real.
Here's a question... If one plans to mispronounce your name, why not just reply to the question by saying something like "We're going to have a problem. I don't believe that you can compel me to answer this question truthfully, and as such I refuse to do so. This does not constitute refusal to submit for screening to ensure that I am not carrying any WEI." If you do this, you're telling the truth to them, annoying them, and also indicating your willingness to comply with their screening procedures.
#122


Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,540
The only saving grace so far is that of the 37 comments not a single one has been "anything for security" based. Hopefully the tables are turning, turning, turning. I can think of a few million dollars I could immediately cut out of the federal budget!
#123

Join Date: Jan 2007
Programs: UA 1k
Posts: 508
I wonder if these "investigators" are college educated, specially trained, or the run of the mill GED with a couple days instruction.
Bet it starts out as the former, then slowly becomes the latter.
Boston and other test markets, show you're not cattle by not participating.
Whisper one word, "laryngitis".
Bet it starts out as the former, then slowly becomes the latter.
Boston and other test markets, show you're not cattle by not participating.
Whisper one word, "laryngitis".
#125
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: IAD
Programs: *wood Gold
Posts: 1,780
That might be classified as "lying" to a federal official, which some on here would be oh-so-quick to point out to be "wrong, wrong, wrong - nanny, nanny, boo, boo".
The far better approach?
1) Wear sunglasses
2) Put earbuds in your ears and pretend you're listening to an iPod
3) Ignore anyone who speaks to you
4) If tapped on the shoulder or something similar, ignore them
5) If tapped again, make a scene - demand the police to come and press battery charges (you were touched without your permission and against your will - I imagine there would have to be something to cover that)
Get the person's name as well. When you return home, go to small claims court and file a lawsuit against him/her. It's cheap to do this, and will cause the TSA employee to take a day off work to show up (or risk default judgment).
We can create problems for TSA by performing actions that increase turnover and make it harder for them to recruit quality people. If turnover is at 20% now, we should try to push it to 25% by the end of the year or middle of next year. Then push it higher than that. It will be nearly impossible to maintain quality in an organization whose workforce completely changes every 3-4 years, not to mention all the costs associated with that turnover. We should do our best to make turnover the #1 issue on Pistole's problem list.
The far better approach?
1) Wear sunglasses
2) Put earbuds in your ears and pretend you're listening to an iPod
3) Ignore anyone who speaks to you
4) If tapped on the shoulder or something similar, ignore them
5) If tapped again, make a scene - demand the police to come and press battery charges (you were touched without your permission and against your will - I imagine there would have to be something to cover that)
Get the person's name as well. When you return home, go to small claims court and file a lawsuit against him/her. It's cheap to do this, and will cause the TSA employee to take a day off work to show up (or risk default judgment).
We can create problems for TSA by performing actions that increase turnover and make it harder for them to recruit quality people. If turnover is at 20% now, we should try to push it to 25% by the end of the year or middle of next year. Then push it higher than that. It will be nearly impossible to maintain quality in an organization whose workforce completely changes every 3-4 years, not to mention all the costs associated with that turnover. We should do our best to make turnover the #1 issue on Pistole's problem list.
#126
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: DTW
Programs: DL 0.22 MM, AA 0.34 MM, PC Plat Amb, Hertz #1 GC 5*
Posts: 7,511
I'm guessing that's because, to this point, even with BDO's, conversation was not a requirement for screening (yet I could be guessing wrong!). I'm hearing that it might be coming, and to refuse to answer if it's raining or not, could be cause for refusal of entry to the sterile area.
#127
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Salish Sea
Programs: DL,AC,HH,PC
Posts: 8,972
I'm guessing that's because, to this point, even with BDO's, conversation was not a requirement for screening (yet I could be guessing wrong!). I'm hearing that it might be coming, and to refuse to answer if it's raining or not, could be cause for refusal of entry to the sterile area.
Yes, the TSA could change their secret rules, but since their workers cannot physically remove you from the pre-TDC line just stand your ground and wait for a LEO. Then sue the pants off everyone involved.
#128
FlyerTalk Evangelist


Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: An NPR mind living in a Fox News world
Posts: 14,343
National Make Fun of The SPOTNik Day?
I'm guessing that's because, to this point, even with BDO's, conversation was not a requirement for screening (yet I could be guessing wrong!). I'm hearing that it might be coming, and to refuse to answer if it's raining or not, could be cause for refusal of entry to the sterile area.
How about "National Make Fun of The SPOTNik Day?
#129
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Miami, Fl, sometimes
Programs: AAEXP, MRPLT
Posts: 126
First, the only reason this program got funding is because they came up with a cool acronym which seems to over-impress a lot of Washington types.
Any reasonably decent profiler is already or will be employed by better agencies like the FBI, CBP proper or even NYPD. A 5-day program is laughable.
I'll just say it, a college degree is no longer a significant indicator of one's abilities, especially in my profession.
I don't think anyone needs to be confrontational in this situation since the process, and the person, will probably be easily frustrated by a little TMI.
My plan:
- Where have you been?
- [chuckle] "My [wife|husband] asks me that all the time, I swear, I was just playing golf. You probably don't believe me either but some courses are lit at night and if you use enough sunscreen, you don't show anything at all. And really, I know they say 2 hours before departure but that's an awful long time to sit at an airport."
- Do you have a business card?
- [blank ponderous stare] [begin rummaging through my carry-on] "I think so, I mean I'm supposed to. They keep sending me new ones but I always forget them." [methodically searching various compartments] "This is embarrassing, I'm glad I'm not traveling with the boss today. I really thought I grabbed some new ones last week..." [double check the obvious locations]
- Where are you traveling?
- "Now or today? I think I'm connecting but it's different every week. What was last week? Oh, where did I get dinner, then I'll remember where it was. Dang it, it's right there on the boarding pass. Which one did I give you? I have the other one here somewhere. Oh, here it is, %LAX%, but I'm actually going somewhere nearby, don't really remember where, there are so many little towns. Are you from that area? What's there to do?"
Any reasonably decent profiler is already or will be employed by better agencies like the FBI, CBP proper or even NYPD. A 5-day program is laughable.
I'll just say it, a college degree is no longer a significant indicator of one's abilities, especially in my profession.
I don't think anyone needs to be confrontational in this situation since the process, and the person, will probably be easily frustrated by a little TMI.
My plan:
- Where have you been?
- [chuckle] "My [wife|husband] asks me that all the time, I swear, I was just playing golf. You probably don't believe me either but some courses are lit at night and if you use enough sunscreen, you don't show anything at all. And really, I know they say 2 hours before departure but that's an awful long time to sit at an airport."
- Do you have a business card?
- [blank ponderous stare] [begin rummaging through my carry-on] "I think so, I mean I'm supposed to. They keep sending me new ones but I always forget them." [methodically searching various compartments] "This is embarrassing, I'm glad I'm not traveling with the boss today. I really thought I grabbed some new ones last week..." [double check the obvious locations]
- Where are you traveling?
- "Now or today? I think I'm connecting but it's different every week. What was last week? Oh, where did I get dinner, then I'll remember where it was. Dang it, it's right there on the boarding pass. Which one did I give you? I have the other one here somewhere. Oh, here it is, %LAX%, but I'm actually going somewhere nearby, don't really remember where, there are so many little towns. Are you from that area? What's there to do?"
Last edited by boatseller; Aug 2, 2011 at 9:24 am
#130
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend




Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 72,094
I'm guessing that's because, to this point, even with BDO's, conversation was not a requirement for screening (yet I could be guessing wrong!). I'm hearing that it might be coming, and to refuse to answer if it's raining or not, could be cause for refusal of entry to the sterile area.
#131
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Somewhere between here and there...
Programs: WWF, Appalachian Mountain Club
Posts: 11,595
From The Boston Globe:
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a traveler’s documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a traveler’s documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
#132
Suspended
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4,953
From The Boston Globe:
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a travelers documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a travelers documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
Every time the TSA injects another level of screening into the pot, more passengers get fed up with the whole charade. So perhaps this is a good thing.
#133

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,964
From The Boston Globe:
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a travelers documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a travelers documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
#134
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: where the chile is hot
Programs: AA,RR,NW,Delta ,UA,CO
Posts: 48,873

Oh, great, now they're adding two more 'layers'.
Let me count the layers:
-secure flight
-entry to checkpoint (am I attempting to enter the right line?)
-TDC - blacklight, squiggles, say my name
-second BP/ID check (only at some airports currently)
-BDO conversation
-'extra screening as needed'
- 'line director' - WTMD or NoS
- goods on belt, NoS scan
- grope because NoS scan operator is incompetent or asleep
- bag check
- BDO conversation starting at food court, continuing into bathroom stalls
- gate ID and bag check
#135
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: DTW
Programs: DL 0.22 MM, AA 0.34 MM, PC Plat Amb, Hertz #1 GC 5*
Posts: 7,511
From The Boston Globe:
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a traveler’s documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
"Questioning will take place at a separate podium after a traveler’s documents have been checked, and those identified for more screening will be sent to a third station."
So an actual questioning checkpoint after the TDC. I suspect this procedure will be a monumental failure and result in many, many innocent travelers being sent to the "third station" where who knows what happens to you.
Is it me, or does this sound like it's going to be modeled after the passport control stations on international arrivals? Questions like where did you come from, where are you going, where are you staying, what did you do, did you meet anyone, etc. In that case, I'm hosed, given my 95% hit rate on border secondaries (one actually said that they knew I wasn't a threat, there was an open secondary line, and I was just there long enough for them to look busy).
So TSA gets the badge idea from LEOs, and the questioning booth from CBP?


. Maybe when you tell them, they'll be gentle on the grope.