Last edit by: alexwuk
September 2021 update:
Suspensions of all remaining LGW short haul services further extended to 26 March 2022, with the exception of: one daily MAN-LGW-MAN rotation (BA2509/BA2508) and one daily GLA-LGW-GLA rotation (BA2511/BA2512)
Many LGW short haul routes will continue to operate from LHR in the meantime; exceptions are ALC/CGN/DBV/GOA, which have been suspended until 26th March 2022 ie these destinations will not operated by BA this Winter.
Suspensions of all remaining LGW short haul services further extended to 26 March 2022, with the exception of: one daily MAN-LGW-MAN rotation (BA2509/BA2508) and one daily GLA-LGW-GLA rotation (BA2511/BA2512)
Many LGW short haul routes will continue to operate from LHR in the meantime; exceptions are ALC/CGN/DBV/GOA, which have been suspended until 26th March 2022 ie these destinations will not operated by BA this Winter.
BA at Gatwick 2021
#871
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,639
It isn't the first time the Ghana Govt. have had issues with BA in relation to their service, state of planes and bedbugs is seems!
British Airways CEO, Alex Cruz arrives in Ghana, refuses to meet Aviation Ministry following the airlines bedbugs scandal [ARTICLE] - Pulse Ghana
Pilot37
British Airways CEO, Alex Cruz arrives in Ghana, refuses to meet Aviation Ministry following the airlines bedbugs scandal [ARTICLE] - Pulse Ghana
Pilot37
Last edited by 1Aturnleft; Jan 26, 2021 at 7:25 am
#872
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,452
In my opinion, BA have done nothing wrong. They have used old frames on many routes over the years, its just what the market dictates and what aircraft is necessary. BA are a business and unless Ghana is giving a subsidy/PSO, I dont see why they should tell BA what planes/terminal/airport to operate from.
The decision to switch the route to LGW may be unfortunate but thats BAs decision. ISB and DOH are also moving to LGW and they arent kicking up a fuss. There are so many routes which only have a LGW connection (KIN, ANU etc) - that is just the way it is. Its not racism or discrimination just business.
Also, by switching to LGW the route will benefit from BAs new refurbished 777s. Theyre much better than the 747s which used to run the route.
The thing is, if BA pull the route Im sure Virgin will take it up or the government will subsidise them to operate it. So BA doesnt have all the power.
The decision to switch the route to LGW may be unfortunate but thats BAs decision. ISB and DOH are also moving to LGW and they arent kicking up a fuss. There are so many routes which only have a LGW connection (KIN, ANU etc) - that is just the way it is. Its not racism or discrimination just business.
Also, by switching to LGW the route will benefit from BAs new refurbished 777s. Theyre much better than the 747s which used to run the route.
The thing is, if BA pull the route Im sure Virgin will take it up or the government will subsidise them to operate it. So BA doesnt have all the power.
#873
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,639
In my opinion, BA have done nothing wrong. They have used old frames on many routes over the years, its just what the market dictates and what aircraft is necessary. BA are a business and unless Ghana is giving a subsidy/PSO, I dont see why they should tell BA what planes/terminal/airport to operate from.
The decision to switch the route to LGW may be unfortunate but thats BAs decision. ISB and DOH are also moving to LGW and they arent kicking up a fuss. There are so many routes which only have a LGW connection (KIN, ANU etc) - that is just the way it is. Its not racism or discrimination just business.
Also, by switching to LGW the route will benefit from BAs new refurbished 777s. Theyre much better than the 747s which used to run the route.
The thing is, if BA pull the route Im sure Virgin will take it up or the government will subsidise them to operate it. So BA doesnt have all the power.
The decision to switch the route to LGW may be unfortunate but thats BAs decision. ISB and DOH are also moving to LGW and they arent kicking up a fuss. There are so many routes which only have a LGW connection (KIN, ANU etc) - that is just the way it is. Its not racism or discrimination just business.
Also, by switching to LGW the route will benefit from BAs new refurbished 777s. Theyre much better than the 747s which used to run the route.
The thing is, if BA pull the route Im sure Virgin will take it up or the government will subsidise them to operate it. So BA doesnt have all the power.
There can't be much cargo or connecting traffic on the route otherwise it would have stayed at LHR. And the 18% business traffic figure cited will mean yields from a predominantly VFR nature as being relatively low in comparison to a typical LHR flight break even. Which I guess is why the route has been moved back to Gatwick with its lower cost base to make it cost effective.
I doubt VS could turn a profit on it at LHR given BA can't. ACC already benefits from direct DL service to JFK so theres not even a connecting Atlantic traffic market for VS to secure - their major shareholder already has the direct monopoly. The only business is low yielding VFR traffic and a small business market. It would hardly seem worth VS's while unless there was a significant cargo uplift to warrant the effort and an air frame to serve it.
Last edited by 1Aturnleft; Jan 26, 2021 at 8:35 am
#874
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Belfast
Programs: BA Silver
Posts: 379
Regardless, it just seems silly to be picking a fight with BA right now. Ultimately BA will decide which London airport routes are served from, not the Ghanaian Government.
#875
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,639
Accra is currently an A350 route from Heathrow. Changing it to a LGW not only means Accra loses the prestige associated with a LHR link but the service is moving it back to the old product in business after upgrading it. BA havent helped their own case here.
Regardless, it just seems silly to be picking a fight with BA right now. Ultimately BA will decide which London airport routes are served from, not the Ghanaian Government.
Regardless, it just seems silly to be picking a fight with BA right now. Ultimately BA will decide which London airport routes are served from, not the Ghanaian Government.
#876
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: London, Babylon-on-Thames
Programs: BAEC Blue (back to Earth)
Posts: 1,522
There's no discernible logic to what's going on here that I can see, the laser like focus on high end leisure which made LGW long haul a money maker after years of ongoing losses seems to have been abandoned in favour of the old strategy of routes churning between LHR<->LGW. Having Doha at LGW just makes no sense to me other than slot sitting at LGW. I think it will be summer 2022 at the earliest before we see what any post COVID strategy will be.
#877
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,452
BA is often the monopoly carrier and frequently where they're not, it's a cosy duopoly with another. It's not the market dictating at all, it's BA dictating to the market. They can dump the crummiest hard product on the route and still charge an eye watering fare and still come out on top whilst offering better fares on newer equipment on more competitive routes out of Hounslow Intl. It's a lack of robust competition which allows BA to do this.
There's no discernible logic to what's going on here that I can see, the laser like focus on high end leisure which made LGW long haul a money maker after years of ongoing losses seems to have been abandoned in favour of the old strategy of routes churning between LHR<->LGW. Having Doha at LGW just makes no sense to me other than slot sitting at LGW. I think it will be summer 2022 at the earliest before we see what any post COVID strategy will be.
There's no discernible logic to what's going on here that I can see, the laser like focus on high end leisure which made LGW long haul a money maker after years of ongoing losses seems to have been abandoned in favour of the old strategy of routes churning between LHR<->LGW. Having Doha at LGW just makes no sense to me other than slot sitting at LGW. I think it will be summer 2022 at the earliest before we see what any post COVID strategy will be.
The Ghanaian government need to look at the world, the aviation industry and the numerous cities BA have dropped and say We are lucky to still have a direct service to London.
#878
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: UK
Programs: BA Silver, IHG Platinum
Posts: 950
Moving BA to an airport away from Accra seems like an open invitation for BA to can the route, in which case everyone loses. What a strange threat to make.
This is a very odd thing for a national government to get all bent out of shape by.
This is a very odd thing for a national government to get all bent out of shape by.
#879
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,452
More to the point, BA are moving from one London airport to another. If the Ghanaian government make BA fly into another airport, it wont even be near the capital of Accra, it will be a small airport in the middle of Ghana. This would be akin to the UK government moving an airline from LHR to Newcastle!
If I were BA I would say see you later and move the aircraft to a city which appreciates the presence of the airline.
#880
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London
Programs: BAEC Bronze
Posts: 1,091
I doubt VS could turn a profit on it at LHR given BA can't. ACC already benefits from direct DL service to JFK so theres not even a connecting Atlantic traffic market for VS to secure - their major shareholder already has the direct monopoly. The only business is low yielding VFR traffic and a small business market. It would hardly seem worth VS's while unless there was a significant cargo uplift to warrant the effort and an air frame to serve it.
#881
Join Date: Oct 2017
Programs: Honors Diamond
Posts: 1,662
Pure speculation but is Doha as a result of needing to maintain something from London to Doha to meet the terms of the Joint Business Agreement with QR?
#882
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: TPA for now. Hopefully LIS for retirement
Posts: 13,753
LOL. Or maybe SMH.
This has the priority attention of the top of the GH government?
What percentage of the total GH population really cares (or is even aware of) which London airport BA flies to?
I live in TPA. We only have (or really, had, pre-Covid) LGW service too. Should I be offended as well? I will let Mayor Castor know that we should start an international incident.
This has the priority attention of the top of the GH government?
What percentage of the total GH population really cares (or is even aware of) which London airport BA flies to?
I live in TPA. We only have (or really, had, pre-Covid) LGW service too. Should I be offended as well? I will let Mayor Castor know that we should start an international incident.
#883
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 169
This might be the case, but I gather LGW-DOH is targeted at bucket and spade and VFR travellers connecting onto Qatar airways flights to non-BA holiday/VFR destinations east and south e.g. BKK, KUL, HKT, Australia etc. The airport move of this route, much like ISB and ACC, is following the metal (economy-heavy LGW 777s). In the same vein premium heavy routes such as BGI, BDA, MLE have moved the other way to LHR as the 777s there have more premium-heavy layouts.
#884
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Istanbul, Turkey
Programs: TK Elite Plus,BAEC GGL,ITA Executive, AFKL Gold,QR Gold,HH Diamond,Bonvoy Gold,ALL Gold
Posts: 14,186
For the Accra discussion, I think that BA has decided to switch that route to LGW for the following reasons:
- There is no slot waiver yet that has been announced for S21. BA/IAG needs to use LGW slots if they don't like to lose them. Wizzair is seeking LGW slots at this point so there is demand for LGW.
- As mentioned above, Accra is a high-capacity Y route rather than a business-heavy one. Since the 747's are gone, high-density LGW 777's are the best fit.
- Most likely, the passengers that are traveling on this route are people who originate/terminate their journey in the UK ( similar to ISB ). LHR slots would be most likely used for business heavy routes and routes that have a high portion of international-international connecting passengers if both airports have slot usage requirements like 40-50%
Depending on the slot usage requirements, we could see more routes going into this direction.
- There is no slot waiver yet that has been announced for S21. BA/IAG needs to use LGW slots if they don't like to lose them. Wizzair is seeking LGW slots at this point so there is demand for LGW.
- As mentioned above, Accra is a high-capacity Y route rather than a business-heavy one. Since the 747's are gone, high-density LGW 777's are the best fit.
- Most likely, the passengers that are traveling on this route are people who originate/terminate their journey in the UK ( similar to ISB ). LHR slots would be most likely used for business heavy routes and routes that have a high portion of international-international connecting passengers if both airports have slot usage requirements like 40-50%
Depending on the slot usage requirements, we could see more routes going into this direction.
#885
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,061
I live in TPA. We only have (or really, had, pre-Covid) LGW service too. Should I be offended as well? I will let Mayor Castor know that we should start an international incident.