Calchas

Raffles is a regulated purveyor of credit products so doubtless he is more familiar with the regulations than I am, but if this happened to me I would certainly complain to Amex about their misdescribed "companion voucher" which is not always valid for companions. If their offer of compensation was unsatisfactory I would take the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman.

Amex will be charged £550 by the Ombudsman per complaint, even for complaints that are not upheld, so I would imagine Amex would soon bring the matter to the notice of their close partner in this affair, British Airways, if this problem is occurring as frequently as is claimed.

rlnnpt

Hi Francis, are you able to elaborate on this? Very relevant to the topic if you used a specific approach to succefully claim compensation+ from BA!

Thanks, Russ

ianfly

I personally would prefer £500 and club world than BA first... especially on a 7 or so hour flight!

Dave Noble

Once BA has accepted the voucher and issued the ticket, I cannot see how AMEX can be accountable at all; issues with the flight operation itself are not to do with AMEX but covered by BA's CoC and external considerations such as EC261

If BA refused to accept the vouchers, that would be a different matter

dougzz

Because Amex and BA have a commercial relationship, and the Amex product is promoted and sold to the consumer on the back of this. If BA fail to honour their part of the relationship, then Amex can't simply say not their problem. Accepting the voucher but failing to honour its terms is not that different to not accepting it. BA can have all the small print it wants in CoC, but courts typically favour the consumer, and don't like companies that hide behind pages of contract terms that no one reads.

Amex may not like it coming to this, as they seem to be a company that still values their reputation and customer service.

Blueboys999

While I'm sure all of this debate of the legal fine points of this situation is fascinating to some, I'm equally sure that to others it is somewhat tedious.

Would somebody who was simply downgraded to Business from First on 1 flight seriously contemplate taking legal action action over it? If so, they perhaps need to take a close look at themselves or maybe just get out a bit more.

KARFA

As BA don't seem to be offering anything for these downgrades what would you suggest people do? Nothing? The OP's story of a £500 gift card sounds a bit more generous than usual but I am not sure all are being offered that.

Legal action using MCOL seems to be the only route to force BA to pay up.

Blueboys999

Not nothing but I would try take all the learning points from my experience and get on with my life. Staying angry and perpetuating the event by pursuing financial compensation is by no means always the way forward especially in relatively trivial circumstances such as this. YMMV.

KARFA

I am not sure that being downgraded is trivial and I don't see how after being knocked back from BA you can simply walk away and do nothing. You have been financially disadvantaged and BA has deprived you of what you paid for.

Sounds like you may be BA's ideal customer though if you are just prepared to accept no compensation or reimbursement when it is due

orbitmic

(Quote answering question as to whether Amex is in breach of contract). I'm not sure I'm following the argument. What are the reasonable steps tha Amex could have taken and did not or part of their contract that they failed to deliver? Are you suggesting that they are 'aware' of some likelihood of the 2-4-1 vouchers that they promise are in fact less than effective, which would seem to go far beyond what Raffles suggests?

you could make the argument that Amex provided an instrument that ended up being ineffective and should reissue it and sue them accordingly, but that would invariably just lead to Amex (who certainly paid ba what they owed it for the issued voucher) suing ba back and undoubtedly being vindicated in turn has Amex has effectively done nothing wrong and ba has. If it were me, id sue both jointly but fully expecting that it is solely ba that would be asked to assume the cost of the replacement travel.

simons1

So if it's not nothing, what would you suggest people do to obtain recompense for beibg downgraded?

orbitmic

To be honest, i dont think they are worried that they will be downgraded because they have a 2-4-1 but rather that they will be top of the downgrade pecking order if anybody is and personally, i think that they are completely right. Regardless of whether 2-4-1 are targeted as such, as others have pointed out there may be numerous reasons notably related to commercial value, which make a 2-4-1 companion a likely pick. I'm genuinely not sure why this would even be shocking. Some mention surprise that ba would downgrade part of a party rather than solo travellers, but that seems genuinely odd to me as such a policy would typically result in ba always choosing to downgrade business travellers (most likely to fly as groups or families), which would be entirely counter-productive. As for the argument the system is probably not sophisticated enough, I wholly disagree, the whole point of the upgrade/downgrade part of the system is to enable airlines to specify the basis of commercial priority and value. The whole idea that ticket costs could not or would not be part of it sounds rather unconvincing.

IAN-UK

Well, yes - I think quite a few others would as well. Especially those more accustomed to travelling in F, and no longer enthralled by any mystique or promise of luxury. Though I imagine the cash in banknotes rather than a voucher would be more attractive: certainly attractive pocket money for those lucky enough to have tickets paid for by other parties.

Quite a different story for a couple on holiday or making a special-occasion trip.


And that's why it might be more sensible for the airline to auction the downgrade opportunity, before imposing the shift only if there are no takers. The auction could be as brassy or as discreet as the airline wished to make it

simonsmith

My parents, now in there 80s take the time to manage their spending carefully to get an Amex voucher each year. They then have to attempt to use their voucher by getting up at midnight to book the outbound and return flights to Cape Town exactly 355 days before. They look forward to their annual big treat of flying in First all year. All this takes a bit of effort . The disappoint of a downgrade would be palpable and BA would not care a jot these days.

dougzz

A lot of what is said here points greatly towards BA seeking volunteers as a way out of this. The trip somonsmith describes would potentially be spoilt by a one person downgrade, whilst many a business traveller doing F frequently would happily trouser £500 to sit amongst the hoi polloi of CW. They have no way of knowing the value of the trip to an individual, so why not seek volunteers?