Apr 9, 2016, 5:10 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
Boeing 787-8 (788) Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business Class Seats Selection Guide & Reviews
There were 20 787-8 Dreamliners at the end of 2018, now gradually expanding to 42 total 788s in the AA fleet.
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner with Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business class seating and service
For the 787-9, see Boeing 787-9 / 789: Business (Rockwell Collins (née B/E) Super Diamond Seat, Service (master thd)
The 787-8 offers 20 modified Zodiac "Concept D" Business Suite all aisle access "podded" seats in 1-2-1 with back to back seating in the center pairs, and alternating front and rear facing window seats. They are said to be 21-26" wide, and have 60-61" pitch upright in pods with full aisle access and 77" in the horizontal "bed" position. True AVOD offering up to 250 movies, 160 TV shows, 13 radio channels, 375 albums and 20 games, is offered via cabled handset controllers to large flat touch screens. Power offered is 110 VAC via universal plugs and 5 VDC USB. Bose QuietComfort headsets with noise reduction are provided (picked up about one hour prior to arrival). Ku-Band satellite WiFi is offered for sale.
The Dreamliner "big sister" model (22 787-9, first in service September 2016, has Collins (née B/E Aerospace) Super Diamond Solo seats that largely avoid the Zodiac problems, is the "big sister"). The second batch of 787-8s (787T) differ from the first batch and are fitted with Collins Super Diamond seats.
Zodiac "Concept D Business Suite" seats connected "at the head" are affected by movement from the seat they are connected to, often referred to on FT as "motion over the ocean". The Business seats that are unconnected and stable in 787-8 J are 1D&H, 5A&L.
Due to the modifications AA required of Zodiac for these seats, there are some peculiarities reported:
Link to photos taken by SFO777 here, from his trip on AA2320 DFW-ORD 07:10 - 09:36 Inaugural flight, shared with 68 FlyerTalkers.
There were 20 787-8 Dreamliners at the end of 2018, now gradually expanding to 42 total 788s in the AA fleet.
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner with Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business class seating and service
For the 787-9, see Boeing 787-9 / 789: Business (Rockwell Collins (née B/E) Super Diamond Seat, Service (master thd)
The 787-8 offers 20 modified Zodiac "Concept D" Business Suite all aisle access "podded" seats in 1-2-1 with back to back seating in the center pairs, and alternating front and rear facing window seats. They are said to be 21-26" wide, and have 60-61" pitch upright in pods with full aisle access and 77" in the horizontal "bed" position. True AVOD offering up to 250 movies, 160 TV shows, 13 radio channels, 375 albums and 20 games, is offered via cabled handset controllers to large flat touch screens. Power offered is 110 VAC via universal plugs and 5 VDC USB. Bose QuietComfort headsets with noise reduction are provided (picked up about one hour prior to arrival). Ku-Band satellite WiFi is offered for sale.
The Dreamliner "big sister" model (22 787-9, first in service September 2016, has Collins (née B/E Aerospace) Super Diamond Solo seats that largely avoid the Zodiac problems, is the "big sister"). The second batch of 787-8s (787T) differ from the first batch and are fitted with Collins Super Diamond seats.
Zodiac "Concept D Business Suite" seats connected "at the head" are affected by movement from the seat they are connected to, often referred to on FT as "motion over the ocean". The Business seats that are unconnected and stable in 787-8 J are 1D&H, 5A&L.
Remedial seat stability fix announced 9 Oct 2016 by John Walton, Runway Girl Network (link)
"Jay Mapston, American’s manager of onboard products, cabin design, spoke to Runway Girl Network with praiseworthy candor about the airline’s current situation and plans. To start, Mapston explains the 787-8 fleet’s (Zodiac) Concept D (Business Suite) will see remedial stability work to fix the much-discussed issue where the seats shake when an adjoining passenger moves."
As of July 2019, no such fix has been put in place. The seat modification has to be designed, submitted to the FAA for certification (STC) and approved, the parts manufactured and seats modified. Normally, the seat manufacturer would do this, but as AA terminated the Zodiac contract for failure to perform. It’s anyone’s guess when and if a fix is forthcoming.
AA canceled the contract with Zodiac for inability to comply with scheduled delivery times, causing seatless Dreamliners to sit out availability idled in the desert and causing considerable delay for the 777-200ER refurbishment. The seats were NOT used for the 787-9 nor more than half the 47 aircraft 772 fleet, and it is likely the newly ordered 788s will be equipped with Super Diamond Seats.
"Jay Mapston, American’s manager of onboard products, cabin design, spoke to Runway Girl Network with praiseworthy candor about the airline’s current situation and plans. To start, Mapston explains the 787-8 fleet’s (Zodiac) Concept D (Business Suite) will see remedial stability work to fix the much-discussed issue where the seats shake when an adjoining passenger moves."
As of July 2019, no such fix has been put in place. The seat modification has to be designed, submitted to the FAA for certification (STC) and approved, the parts manufactured and seats modified. Normally, the seat manufacturer would do this, but as AA terminated the Zodiac contract for failure to perform. It’s anyone’s guess when and if a fix is forthcoming.
AA canceled the contract with Zodiac for inability to comply with scheduled delivery times, causing seatless Dreamliners to sit out availability idled in the desert and causing considerable delay for the 777-200ER refurbishment. The seats were NOT used for the 787-9 nor more than half the 47 aircraft 772 fleet, and it is likely the newly ordered 788s will be equipped with Super Diamond Seats.
- Many seats are interlaced with others - passenger in one moves, the linked seat moves. "Motion over the ocean" is induced by the partner seat attached at the head,
- Forward facing seats may have more restricted shoulder room / width when flat than aft facing
- Middle seat privacy dividers were balky and continually slipped into the retracted position, so they were "fixed" in place so they are not passenger operable. Apparently crew fixes them in several configurations: all up, making them great for privacy but nearly impossible for couples wanting to share conversation; all down, making for lower privacy; facing forward up, facing aft down. Some aircraft have them repaired and passenger operable, some not.
- Rows 1 and 2 center seats have no overhead bins; they were displaced by the crew rest area in the fore fuselage crown.
- 1A and L are close to lav and galley.
- Many prefer seats 5A or L as they are unaffected by other seats / passenger movement in seats.
- 5A and 5L have one window, rather than two.
Link to photos taken by SFO777 here, from his trip on AA2320 DFW-ORD 07:10 - 09:36 Inaugural flight, shared with 68 FlyerTalkers.
Dreamliner 787-8 / 788 Zodiac Business Seats & Reviews (master thd)
Jan 16, 2019, 8:41 pm
#616
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: American EXP; British Airways Gold
Posts: 1,896
Hi all - I just booked AA1294 DFW-ORD on 1/21 for me and wife. I keep reading back and forth that the dividers are locked up, locked down, and that rear facing and front facing have two people sitting closest to each other. Can someone help me understand what I can expect on this flight, and which seats to snag? I’ve currently got 6D and 6H but 5D and 5H are also available. Will 5 or 6 allow my wife and I to have the divider down and be in the right angle to be closest to each other? She doesn’t like to fly and does like me, so first class closeness is a plus when I can make it happen!
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
Even if the divider between the two of you is locked in the up position, you'll have a quiet and peaceful flight into Chicago.
Jan 16, 2019, 8:43 pm
#617
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 1,285
I recommend grabbing 1D and 1H. It's very quiet in the front of this bird, and your wife's seat won't "move around", because it's not connected to another seat.
Even if the divider between the two of you is locked in the up position, you'll have a quiet and peaceful flight into Chicago.
Even if the divider between the two of you is locked in the up position, you'll have a quiet and peaceful flight into Chicago.
Jan 16, 2019, 9:09 pm
#618
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 197
Thank you all for the quick replies. Some follow ups:
Literally my my only two middle seat options available for selection are row 6 and row 7. So row 1 is not viable although it sounds great!
I’m not concerned with the seat movement since it’s only a 2.5 hr flight. We’d rather be physically as close as possible
The photo below is from seatguru. I think it’s rows 6 and 7 and shot looking towards the front of the plane. The area I circled is the ideal angle for us because it has our heads closer and our feet angled away. Do you guys agree that this is row 7 and do you know if that partition is locked up?
Thanks again! Really impressed with the response times and knowledge here!
.
Literally my my only two middle seat options available for selection are row 6 and row 7. So row 1 is not viable although it sounds great!
I’m not concerned with the seat movement since it’s only a 2.5 hr flight. We’d rather be physically as close as possible
The photo below is from seatguru. I think it’s rows 6 and 7 and shot looking towards the front of the plane. The area I circled is the ideal angle for us because it has our heads closer and our feet angled away. Do you guys agree that this is row 7 and do you know if that partition is locked up?
Thanks again! Really impressed with the response times and knowledge here!
.
Jan 16, 2019, 9:28 pm
#619
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: American EXP; British Airways Gold
Posts: 1,896
Thank you all for the quick replies. Some follow ups:
Literally my my only two middle seat options available for selection are row 6 and row 7. So row 1 is not viable although it sounds great!
I’m not concerned with the seat movement since it’s only a 2.5 hr flight. We’d rather be physically as close as possible
The photo below is from seatguru. I think it’s rows 6 and 7 and shot looking towards the front of the plane. The area I circled is the ideal angle for us because it has our heads closer and our feet angled away. Do you guys agree that this is row 7 and do you know if that partition is locked up?
Thanks again! Really impressed with the response times and knowledge here!
Literally my my only two middle seat options available for selection are row 6 and row 7. So row 1 is not viable although it sounds great!
I’m not concerned with the seat movement since it’s only a 2.5 hr flight. We’d rather be physically as close as possible
The photo below is from seatguru. I think it’s rows 6 and 7 and shot looking towards the front of the plane. The area I circled is the ideal angle for us because it has our heads closer and our feet angled away. Do you guys agree that this is row 7 and do you know if that partition is locked up?
Thanks again! Really impressed with the response times and knowledge here!
Jan 16, 2019, 9:43 pm
#620
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 197
Sorry my typo (thanks for taking the time to research, apologies for wasting it for a minute). Yes I’ve got row 6 right now and row 5 is available, not row 7. Is row 5 like what I circled in the picture? If so, does anyone know about that divider?
Jan 16, 2019, 9:47 pm
#621
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 197
Lucky wrote on a post previously:
For the rear facing center seats, the partition between seats is permanently raised (meaning it’s not good when traveling with someone), while for the forward facing center seats, the partition is permanently lowered (meaning it’s good when traveling with someone)
https://onemileatatime.com/best-amer...lass-seat-787/
if rear facing are the ones closest together and also permanently locked up it means I can’t have both things I want.... Anyone know if this is still accurate?
For the rear facing center seats, the partition between seats is permanently raised (meaning it’s not good when traveling with someone), while for the forward facing center seats, the partition is permanently lowered (meaning it’s good when traveling with someone)
https://onemileatatime.com/best-amer...lass-seat-787/
if rear facing are the ones closest together and also permanently locked up it means I can’t have both things I want.... Anyone know if this is still accurate?
Last edited by jacisme; Jan 17, 2019 at 9:49 am Reason: correx typo
Jan 16, 2019, 9:59 pm
#622
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: American EXP; British Airways Gold
Posts: 1,896
I don't know that you are going to get anyone to provide you the 100% guarantee as to what you'll find once you get on the plane. It's a crAApshoot.
Jan 16, 2019, 10:16 pm
#623
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Chicago, IL
Programs: AA ExPlat, Delta GM, Hilton Honors Diamond, Marriott Titanium Elite, Hertz President's Circle
Posts: 140
Lucky wrote on a post previously:
For the rear facing center seats, the partition between seats is permanently raised (meaning it’s not good when traveling with someone), while for the forward facing center seats, the partition is permanently lowered (meaning it’s good when traveling with someone)
https://onemileatatime.com/best-amer...lass-seat-787/
if thats permanently true true it means I can’t have both things I want.... Anyone know if this is still accurate?
For the rear facing center seats, the partition between seats is permanently raised (meaning it’s not good when traveling with someone), while for the forward facing center seats, the partition is permanently lowered (meaning it’s good when traveling with someone)
https://onemileatatime.com/best-amer...lass-seat-787/
if thats permanently true true it means I can’t have both things I want.... Anyone know if this is still accurate?
One note about Row 5: I've found the rear-facing seats to be slightly shorter in that row than in other rear-facing rows. Also, the galley can be *loud*. Not an issue on DFW-ORD, but definitely something to consider on any long flight where you are expecting to get sleep (e.g. ORD-LHR).
Jan 23, 2019, 4:29 am
#625
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVP100K, Hilton Diamond, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,215
I have my 788 service LAX-PEK coming up ever so closer now on March 6. I moved out of the mini-cabin on advice from people in this thread, but it’s still showing the 7 rowed J cabin with the mini-cabin.
Is there any chance by March 4th they will not have changed the planes seats by then? If so I’d rather go back to the mini J cabin in 6A.
Is there any chance by March 4th they will not have changed the planes seats by then? If so I’d rather go back to the mini J cabin in 6A.
Jan 23, 2019, 4:39 am
#626
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVP100K, Hilton Diamond, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,215
I've yet to run into a 788 with sliders locked in the up position (sample size of > 10, both domestic and TATL). I believe that was an issue when they first installed the seats that has been resolved (unlike, unfortunately, the "motion over the ocean" issue).
One note about Row 5: I've found the rear-facing seats to be slightly shorter in that row than in other rear-facing rows. Also, the galley can be *loud*. Not an issue on DFW-ORD, but definitely something to consider on any long flight where you are expecting to get sleep (e.g. ORD-LHR).
One note about Row 5: I've found the rear-facing seats to be slightly shorter in that row than in other rear-facing rows. Also, the galley can be *loud*. Not an issue on DFW-ORD, but definitely something to consider on any long flight where you are expecting to get sleep (e.g. ORD-LHR).
Back in early 2016 I did a HND-LAX with a co-worker and we sat in the middle of row 6 in the mini J cabin on the 788. The wall was locked into the up place for the entire flight, and despite the FAs best efforts to move it down, they were unable to do so. My co-worker and I had to yell if we wanted to talk the entire flight.
Jan 23, 2019, 6:52 am
#627
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,107
I have my 788 service LAX-PEK coming up ever so closer now on March 6. I moved out of the mini-cabin on advice from people in this thread, but it’s still showing the 7 rowed J cabin with the mini-cabin.
Is there any chance by March 4th they will not have changed the planes seats by then? If so I’d rather go back to the mini J cabin in 6A.
Is there any chance by March 4th they will not have changed the planes seats by then? If so I’d rather go back to the mini J cabin in 6A.
There is a chance, but it’s getting smaller and smaller. They have started updating more 788’s now, and in that time frame I wouldn’t risk it personally.
Jan 23, 2019, 7:49 am
#628
Join Date: May 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, LT Gold
Posts: 3,148
I have my 788 service LAX-PEK coming up ever so closer now on March 6. I moved out of the mini-cabin on advice from people in this thread, but it’s still showing the 7 rowed J cabin with the mini-cabin.
Is there any chance by March 4th they will not have changed the planes seats by then? If so I’d rather go back to the mini J cabin in 6A.
Is there any chance by March 4th they will not have changed the planes seats by then? If so I’d rather go back to the mini J cabin in 6A.
So I think it's wise for anyone with a 788 flight at this point to get out of the minicabin and secure your desired seat in the 20J cabin forward door 2L.
Jan 23, 2019, 8:11 am
#629
Suspended
Join Date: May 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: DL Diamond, AAdvantage EXP, Hyatt Explorist, HHonors Diamond, Avis First
Posts: 7,344
There's one 788 flying with PE - N800AN, and 2 more getting refit right now. By March 4, there should be at least 2-3 more 788s "in the shop" at PAE getting refit as well. That would mean around 25% of the 788's have PE or are in process.
So I think it's wise for anyone with a 788 flight at this point to get out of the minicabin and secure your desired seat in the 20J cabin forward door 2L.
So I think it's wise for anyone with a 788 flight at this point to get out of the minicabin and secure your desired seat in the 20J cabin forward door 2L.
Jan 23, 2019, 1:23 pm
#630
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 106
I'm booked for ORD-PHX, but in the mini-cabin. I paid cash, no upgrades/stickers/vouchers etc. What would happen if there were a change of aircraft? I would assume I'd have to be downgraded and would in-turn be fairly compensated? Hopefully it doesn't come to that!