elitetraveler

If the FAs position is valid I agree. I tend to think there is more than meets than eye. It would be stupid for AA management to start this new service if they thought they were going to have to withdraw it.

On the other hand, the FA survey about the impact on service and safety is purely idiotic.

Will AA be the first airline in the world that can't give out PJs and F class mattresses because of safety issues.

The two unfortunates are the FAs can't get over the big management bonuses of several years ago AND the BOD continues to allow a leaderless management to keep AA mired in mediocrity.

ffdom

If this were an April fools I'm not sure I'd believe it - an airline losing hundreds of millions of dollars, with an uncompetitive soft product and barely competitive hard product on international F routes, wants to add a service component that makes it slightly more competitive with other carriers, and maybe takes the FAs a few minutes more per passenger (maximum 15 actual passengers, 2 FAs or 3?), is facing an appeal from the FAs? I mean, really? (CX, SQ, BA, VS, QR, all have PJS and turndown service, and I'm sure many otehrs do as well.)

My last two roundtrip flights were LAX-HKG-LAX in CX F [vacation, using AA miles] and LAX-ORD-DEL-ORD-LAX in AA F) [business trip in paid J plus upgrade to F using eVIP]. There is no closeness in the quality of hard or soft products. Service on CX was way above AA of course. As soon as I was done with dinner on both CX flights and got up, was asked by the FAs if i would like my bed made up, and after a few minutes getting ready and back at my seat all was set.

My AA ORD-DEL had a good crew - they were attentive and I asked if I could use the duvet from an open seat as my mattress topper with no problem. Of course I wore my CX PJs. I wrote about the behavior of AA FAs on DEL-ORD in a previous post. Before takeoff they asked the passenger in row 1 if they'd mind changing seats cos the FAs preferred the window for their own rest (father intervened and said his son wouldn't move) -kind of a stunning, audacious request but they thought it was fine to ask. FA said I couldn't use the spare duvet in the open center seats cos they needed it for themselves...again, are you serious? (Yep they didn't they were being outrageous at all, indeed I as a passenger was overreaching...) And about 3 minutes after dinner was done (they didn't bother with after dinner drinks) the FAs organized themselves into the empty F seats and went to sleep. This is the kind of overworked schedule they have. This flight may be seriously think that my next DEL flight i would just pay for CX J rather than AA paid J with upgrade.

Maybe they can delete the sparkling water with lemon garnish on the menu that comes at the end of the flight and replace it with turndown? That service,if they bother with at all, is a waste of time since you can ask for that at any point anyway.

I rarely have any complaint with AA FAs - they are almost always polite, friendly and effective. Compared to my UA experiences, they are positively delightful. But you cannot be a serious international airline and question the addition of an extremely modest service improvement that may net some revenue, for the sake of FAs spending a few minutes with each passenger. Really. If we have gotten to this, I don't think there's much hope.

elitetraveler

Of course some folks prefer the 'natural' service of AA FAs over CX. I guess some folks prefer SPAM over filet mignon and wish for the gold old days when Aeroflot was Aeroflot.

PETEFLYS

I am suprisesd no one saw this coming when AA and JAl did there joint venture conference last year where the Jal staff was going to try and bring AA standards of service up or something to that affect.

So the first change of service is turn down like every other international carrier does seems to be a problem....Who would have thought!

ijgordon

I love the survey question about whether the turndown disrupted the flow of first class service. What could possibly be the union's motivation for asking this question? Since when are they concerned with providing good, fluid service to passengers? The grievance itself clearly suggests they're not.

The whole "we're here primarily for your safety" bugs me as it's just sooo disingenuous. If you wanted a job whose sole responsibility was to provide safety/security service then you could have been a police officer or even (gasp!) a TSA agent. But no, you signed up for a job that, SINCE THE BEGINNING OF COMMERCIAL AIR SERVICE, involves providing catering and hospitality services to passengers. And now you're trying to reneg on it? Yeah, I get it, police officers don't get free travel benefits.

mreed911

Yep. This stunt by the APFA will certainly result in me requesting the service every chance I get.

Perhaps we should create a survey form for FT passengers, that gets sent to CR every time we fly, documenting "time to PDB" and "time to meal service" and "time between courses" and "lag between drink refills." Start measuring their performance towards us as customers (the ones who fund their very existence).

I agree with others - in this economy, I'm sure there are furloughed FA's who'd love to come back to work.

As a passenger, this is a service the airline now offers, and as such, I expect it, and I expect it with proper orientation to customer service.

AA *must* remain competitive to earn travel dollars.

JumboD

Truly unbelievable. Just feels like an excuse to complain about something and attempt to get something out of management due to a loophole and fear of a PR debacle. Maybe they don't realize that the various ATI immunity deals recently passed necessitate AA being more in line with their partners. BA FAs can even find it in themselves to offer turn-downs and PJs on daytime flights.

jazzhou

Make sure a reputable consulting company is hired to conduct a thourough research. I'm now very curious and interested in learning the final research result on the possible cause of "unreasonable workload" and the specific issues concerning safety or service procedures that are involved for the new ‘Turn Down’ service on international flights. AAmerican do take things very diligently and professionally.

belfordrocks

This has got to be a joke. Because of the "increased workload" of handing out a pair of pyjamas and sheets, flight attendants now have to fill out an extra sheet of paperwork per flight, detailing exactly the number of passengers asking for turndown service- to when it was offered to the nearest minute?

Wow.

ma91pmh

aa please fire them all.... hire people who actually want to offer a good service rather than minimize their own personal effort. fire fire fire!!!!

demkr

True dat! Better believe that's gonna happen..

+1000

OWdevotee

Filling out that absurd survey form is far more likely to 'disrupt the flow' of service than performing the actual turn-down.

Of all the small-minded, petty, unproductive and downright destructive things I've seen unions do over the years, this one ranks near the top.

Clipper110A

That has often been my experience in 10 years EXP....but generally the same before that in my time as DL GM, US DMPreferred, CO Plat....

While it is quite true that f/as are "here for your safety" (look at AF evac at YYZ or TWA L1011 on fire at JFK evacs with no pax fatalities due to fa proficiency), in the US, this bifurcation of "safety" and "service" is nothing more than an excuse for the lazy. It sometimes also is a motive for passive-aggressive crewmembers to "vent" on some passenger who may not realize her handbag can't be on the floor at the bulkhead, instead of helping to resolve the potential safety issue. It seems also to be a US flight attendant phenomenon more than anything else.

Safety is the highest possible "service" that can be provided. "Service" such as a smile and eye contact on boarding, rapport with passengers, crewmember professional appearance, water runs on a 12 hour flight, conveying an image that the crew is present, engaged and in control will make a HUGE difference when emergencies occur...all that stuff is geared to the "safety" of the flight also...

People get impressions and make decisions subconsciously. They are more likely to respect and follow the commands of a crew that has a professional appearance than someone chewing gum, slouched in the entry doorway in a uniform they look like they slept in, gossiping and complaining to another crewmember while ignoring everyone who passes them. The "service" of hydrating people during long flights is a safety issue, and has a relationship, for some passengers, with avoiding inflight medical emergencies...etc...

The point is in the US, "safety" and "service" have somehow been divided out. It is a false distinction.

VERY TRUE..some curls of smoked salmon and a salad cart to distinguish from J a First Class "Service" does not make...

It is an important principle to review contractual agreements and innovation as regards those agreements. This is often done however, in the backdrop of mutual labor-management animosity, so it is at times exaggerated.

However, it is indicative of the state of US commercial aviation that this even would be an issue. This should have been solved first by mgmt and union, although it is borderline ridiculous. The difficulty also is, even if the union and AA mgmt now manage to solve this, and the service is provided, the union and mgmt have already given an excuse for the fas who are already miserable at work and think and behave as if any passenger request is asking them for a pint of their blood to continue to perform with regards to this enhancement to Intl F in the same lackluster and miserable manner they do with so many other things.

belfordrocks

JDiver

I has become obvious the union is against necessary and excessive paperwork burdens and bureaucratic impositions on busy flight crew.