Copilot23

There are still many FA's on furlough. My suggestion, if the current FA's have an issue with providing the service, then maybe they can consider moving aside so those out of work can be given the chance to decide if they want to fulfill the job description standard "other duties as assigned." This is a good example of how collective bargaining work rules stymie innovation and efficiency.

justageek

Absurd, but wholly unsurprising.

I have to admit that the idea that the turndown service creates a safety hazard is an "interesting" spin, though.

pjoalfa

I think I don't like the question on the survey about how many rev vs non-rev pax there are. What's the difference in terms of F service to be performed?

will2288

Only in America?

While I am certainly not an expert on labor in foreign countries, I do seem to hear fairly frequently about major union strikes/issues in European countries. <redacted>

I do agree that this type of thing is something that will make it very difficult for AA to compete on international services. If some airlines can give so much more service to their premium passengers and AA has to deal with so much pushback from their unions over a cheap mattress and pajamas, it is hard to see how AA could ever have an elite J/F cabin. AA management certainly does not do everything it can to have the best J/F cabins, but when they make a real step in the right direction they get this kind of push back from their own workers. I have always liked AA and I wish them the best but it does not seem like their employees are partners in improving their airline.

C17PSGR

If I were an FA, I might think the turn down serves helps AA competitively and just takes a few minutes of my time. After all, if AA gets more first class passengers, it can recall FA's and add more flights. It might even become profitable, and put the FA's in a better bargaining position. Kind of hard to see much downside from it.

Also of note, are there only 219 FA's left on furlough? Great to see they will deplete the recall list soon!

elitetraveler

"Did the T/D service disrupt any part(s) of the F/C service? Y/N"

No, American doesn't offer F/C service. They have a F/C cabin.

will2288

^

lobo411

But if JDiver's sources are correct, and AA instituted this policy in violation of an existing contract with the workers, why would you trust AA to treat you fairly in the future?

It seems to me that there is an existing contractual agreement that AA is not going to honor. There's no such thing as "I'm only violating the contract a little bit." A violation is a violation, a lie's a lie, [redacted ad-hominem]

elitetraveler

Here is a case of AA actually investing in its premium product. You would think its FAs might realize that more premium pax is a good thing for what they want - higher wages.

Can't FAs opt out of flying F - in other words, don't they have a choice?

lobo411

(All of this assumes that the FA's position is valid...that they do have a contractual agreement on this issue that AA has violated)

They may well agree as well. But this is about respecting the process. Let's say you and I are contractual partners. I have a change that violates our agreement, but I think it serves us both. Unilaterally, I violate our contract and implement the change.

Are you telling me you wouldn't be annoyed that I violated the contract unilaterally? That you wouldn't be a bit suspicious that I implemented changes without consulting you? That my unilateral move wouldn't have implications beyond the narrow particulars of the case at hand?

If AA thought this was a good move, then they should have renegotiated the portion of the contract they're violating.

Contracts are sacred. Capitalism isn't capitalism without that one, basic precept.

C17PSGR

There's certainly an inordinate amount of distrust between AA management and its FA's. The problem is that if AA asks the FA's will say no, even though this is really a de minimus issue. If AA asked, they will essentially be admitting its prohibited, as its not de minimus. Then again, since AA didn't ask, it certainly doesn't help build the trust factor.

On the other hand, I don't think AA has to bargain over adding another drink service or otherwise changing its service standards. For example, I don't believe AA's service standards are designed for FA's to sit except when the sign is on or during a short break. AA is simply altering the work flow -- and its on night flights where there is a lot of down time anyway.

demkr

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

You mean AA requires productivity of their employeees? What a travesty!

JY1024

Many thanks to those who have engaged in this conversation in a civil and thoughtful manner. ^

FlyerTalk is all about sharing information and healthy discourse; that's what has made FT so successful so far! However, as my colleague mentioned above, the best way for use to keep the AA forum orderly and keep this thread open for members to discuss the topic at hand is to ask for everybody's cooperation.

- Please be respectful of all our members and follow the Guidelines and Rules.
- If you have general views about unions, politics, socioeconomics, etc., please take share them in OMNI or OMNI/PR.
- Instead of responding to inflammatory/off-topic posts, please report them to your volunteer moderators by using the "Alert a Moderator" feature (), which is at the bottom left of every post

Many thanks everybody! /Moderator

gsforfree

Wirelessly posted (Verizon BlackBerry 9630: Mozilla/5.0 (BlackBerry; U; BlackBerry 9650; en-US) AppleWebKit/534.8+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/6.0.0.524 Mobile Safari/534.8+)

Without reading the contract, we are commenting on this blindly.

Do we know how "increased workload" is defined? Is it driven by seats? Like a previous poster said, if AA changed the contract unilaterally, then the APFA is right in their actions (regardless of individual views).

Agreed, it is asinine that FAs would file a grievance over increased proftiability, but contracts are word and must be upheld. Workload-wise, though, this can't be a strenuous activity as all FAs must be able to lift the exit door, no?

Spiff

Doubtless the news of this grevience will increase full F bookings...